New tournament format--a lot of fun but needing a major tweak!!

[deadsolid...shank]

Got invited to play member-guest at a nearby course. I knew they were going to try a new format and it sounded pretty intriguing.

 

Two person teams.

 

Par 4's were best ball

 

Par 5's were scramble

 

Par 3's were a one man scramble. I really thought this was a great idea.......until it was put into play. The first par three is a 218 harder, uphill to a heavily sloped, very quick green. There are a lot of shots getting hit.

 

We were the third group out on Saturday, and the first two along with ours were lower handicaps. So it wasn't too bad. Sunday they went in reverse order of the standings. We were next to last out. When we got to the tee box there were SIX groups waiting in front of us. I think we waited approximately an hour and a half. There was also a smaller backup on the back nine, but only three groups.

 

Total time for the round was about 6 1\2 hours.

 

But it was still a lot of fun. Even the waiting around wasn't terrible because of all the good guys there. And the beer cart was there!

 

This course has a lot of innovative ideas for tournaments and this was a trial run for this format. Knowing how well they run it I'm sure it will be different next year.

[Qqq123xx]

Does sound like fun. Being member-guest imo each hole should involve both golfers. Maybe keep the BB, Scramble and add alternative shot.

[deadsolid...shank]

[quote name='Qqq123xx' timestamp='1432594238' post='11624650']
Does sound like fun. Being member-guest imo each hole should involve both golfers. Maybe keep the BB, Scramble and add alternative shot.
[/quote]

I guess the reason they tried the one man scramble was because of the difficulty of the this particular par three, especially for the higher handicaps and the women. I think it was a good idea in theory, it just didn't work as well as wanted.

We thought maybe two balls off the tee and then choose the best and play out with that one.

Personally, I would love alternate shot, but in our area, you can barely get people to play best ball, let alone stroke play or alternate shot. I'm sure they'll come up with a good idea.

How did this get moved to Rules and Etiquette? I guess the tourneys forum would have been a better place to start it.

[teejaywhy]

Can you explain the "one man scramble?"

[mark m]

It's a gimmicky format. It's just too hard to handicap scrambles unless the players are first put into a flight (or an allowable handicap range) and then teams are formed from there. You cannot have teams of 2 scratch (or better) players competing against against a couple of high handicaps. It simply cannot be made fair with any handicap system. Also, as you mentioned, one man scrambles do tend to have a big problem with slow play. You have to address this up front, encourage speedy play, and often the rules state that you can hit a second ball but [u]must[/u] play it if you do. It better be a small field event or forget about it. Some guys want a "do over" and create these formats. . . you don't get second chances in golf. Embrace it. Seize the day!

[deadsolid...shank]

[quote name='teejaywhy' timestamp='1432601036' post='11625458']
Can you explain the "one man scramble?"
[/quote]

Each player hits two off the tee, chooses the best one, hits two from there, and so on until the ball is holed.

[deadsolid...shank]

[quote name='mark m' timestamp='1432601241' post='11625482']
It's a gimmicky format. It's just too hard to handicap scrambles unless the players are first put into a flight (or an allowable handicap range) and then teams are formed from there. You cannot have teams of 2 scratch (or better) players competing against against a couple of high handicaps. It simply cannot be made fair with any handicap system. Also, as you mentioned, one man scrambles do tend to have a big problem with slow play. You have to address this up front, encourage speedy play, and often the rules state that you can hit a second ball but [u]must[/u] play it if you do. It better be a small field event or forget about it. Some guys want a "do over" and create these formats. . . you don't get second chances in golf. Embrace it. Seize the day!
[/quote]

Sure it's gimmicky, sometimes though doing something very different (gimmicky) is a nice change of pace and a lot of fun.

I don't know how they handicapped it. I know the team we played with on Sunday (an 8 and a 14) got a team stroke on one of par fives. Individual strokes on the par fours fell where they normally would. It worked pretty well because the low handicap teams didn't receive near as many individual strokes since the par fives were played as scramble. It seemed to work out fairly well because the team leading after day one consisted of a low single and a high teen handicap and the team that ended up winning had two fives.

There were somewhere in the low 50's for number of teams. Like I said earlier, I think the one-man scramble idea was trying to appease the higher handicap players. I think previously they played the par threes as aggregate and this hole wrecked a lot of scores. I applaud them trying something to appease everyone, I'm sure it will be adjusted next year.

[kurob]

[quote name='mark m' timestamp='1432601241' post='11625482']
It's a gimmicky format. It's just too hard to handicap scrambles unless the players are first put into a flight (or an allowable handicap range) and then teams are formed from there. You cannot have teams of 2 scratch (or better) players competing against against a couple of high handicaps. It simply cannot be made fair with any handicap system. Also, as you mentioned, one man scrambles do tend to have a big problem with slow play. You have to address this up front, encourage speedy play, and [b]often the rules state that you can hit a second ball but [u]must[/u] play it if you do.[/b] It better be a small field event or forget about it. Some guys want a "do over" and create these formats. . . you don't get second chances in golf. Embrace it. Seize the day!
[/quote]

That's the way to do it. We have an E-9 gambling game that's similar where higher handicaps get unlimited mulligans but if they take it they MUST use it. This gives them lots of short game advantages (they get to hit every short putt twice), but makes them really think about it when they hit a mediocre first one on a full shot and especially on approaches.

[Qqq123xx]

[quote name='deadsolid...shank' timestamp='1432599079' post='11625256']
[quote name='Qqq123xx' timestamp='1432594238' post='11624650']
Does sound like fun. Being member-guest imo each hole should involve both golfers. Maybe keep the BB, Scramble and add alternative shot.
[/quote]

I guess the reason they tried the one man scramble was because of the difficulty of the this particular par three, especially for the higher handicaps and the women. I think it was a good idea in theory, it just didn't work as well as wanted.

We thought maybe two balls off the tee and then choose the best and play out with that one.

Personally, I would love alternate shot, but in our area, you can barely get people to play best ball, let alone stroke play or alternate shot. I'm sure they'll come up with a good idea.

How did this get moved to Rules and Etiquette? I guess the tourneys forum would have been a better place to start it.
[/quote] No idea why it moved. Would of thought it would be just fine in General Golf Talk.

[deadsolid...shank]

[quote name='kurob' timestamp='1432651839' post='11628282']
[quote name='mark m' timestamp='1432601241' post='11625482']
It's a gimmicky format. It's just too hard to handicap scrambles unless the players are first put into a flight (or an allowable handicap range) and then teams are formed from there. You cannot have teams of 2 scratch (or better) players competing against against a couple of high handicaps. It simply cannot be made fair with any handicap system. Also, as you mentioned, one man scrambles do tend to have a big problem with slow play. You have to address this up front, encourage speedy play, and [b]often the rules state that you can hit a second ball but [u]must[/u] play it if you do.[/b] It better be a small field event or forget about it. Some guys want a "do over" and create these formats. . . you don't get second chances in golf. Embrace it. Seize the day!
[/quote]

That's the way to do it. We have an E-9 gambling game that's similar where higher handicaps get unlimited mulligans but if they take it they MUST use it. This gives them lots of short game advantages (they get to hit every short putt twice), but makes them really think about it when they hit a mediocre first one on a full shot and especially on approaches.
[/quote]

These weren't mulligans though, the par threes were played as scramble, so two shots on each one. I do like the idea of the mulligan instead however, especially with the idea that if you use a mulligan you have to take the result. Makes you think about hitting again if you have one thats ok but not great.