Cold weather and distance

[LeftDaddy]

I have a question for the experts on here. I'm almost certain that I've read somewhere that cooler / cold temperatures don't affect distance as much as people think. I seem to remember this article saying 2-3 yards per 10 degree diff in temperature, and that lower compression balls could negate that effect to some degree.

 

Well, anyway, either I've lost about 2-3 clubs worth of distance in the past 2 months or what I read totally wasn't true. I played today and it was certainly cool, but not all that cold. I swear I've lost 30 yards on my driver, and I found myself hitting 3 clubs more than normal and still not reaching greens (hitting a 7 from same spot I would normally hit 9 or P for example). I used the Wilson Staff Duo ball, but it was just ridiculous how short everything was.

 

I did notice later that the front 9 played longer than the back, primarily because of wind direction, so I flew a couple of greens on the back 9, but by that point I was almost as a joke grabbing my 7 iron from my typical P wedge yardage. It was weird because I just couldn't make myself swing hard with that much club. The course is also still soggy from a lot of rain recently, so I guess that also hurts.

 

I've played plenty of winter golf before but I guess I just don't remember distances being this far off. Maybe the combo of cold temps, wind, and wet ground made it play so long? What do the experts say?

[jewofgolf]

Here's my take. I have observed a percentage carry distance decrease that seems to work.

60* 1%
50* 2%
45* 3%
40* 4%
35* 5%

Additionally, in the winter the fairways are soft and lumpy, so I find any roll on the fairway is close to zero. Also, especially with a driver, my swingspeed suffers simply due to the cold. I guess my muscles are more tense, especially in my hands.

A normal drive in the summer goes 280-290. If its 35* out that same quality of seing puts it out there around 240 or so. I just play the course shorter to make up for it. I try to keep it in the 6000 - 6400 range.

[KMeloney]

If you're anything like me (and maybe most people?), you're wearing more clothing in the cold which can restrict your motion to some degree, and/or your body isn't as "loose" as it is when it's warm out (also restricting motion).

I'd think the combination of the cold's affect on the ball AND body is to blame, rather than that on the ball alone.

[chapinc]

[quote name='jewofgolf' timestamp='1448249668' post='12633586']
Here's my take. I have observed a percentage carry distance decrease that seems to work.

60* 1%
50* 2%
45* 3%
40* 4%
35* 5%

Additionally, in the winter the fairways are soft and lumpy, so I find any roll on the fairway is close to zero. Also, especially with a driver, my swingspeed suffers simply due to the cold. I guess my muscles are more tense, especially in my hands.

A normal drive in the summer goes 280-290. If its 35* out that same quality of seing puts it out there around 240 or so. I just play the course shorter to make up for it. I try to keep it in the 6000 - 6400 range.
[/quote]

Maybe winter fairways are soft and lumpy in Scottsdale, but here in New England they are often frozen solid which usually increases my driving distance by 20-30 yards. Sort of like David Simms driving it down that paved road to out drive Roy McAvoy in "Tin Cup"!

[ronsc1985]

The loss in distaance due to a modern ball being cold is almost neglible, maybe 1%. I've done this on my GC2 launch monitor by leaving balls outside when the weather was 32F and comparing the launch conditions with balls kept in the house at 72 F. When wound balls were the norm the loss from the ball was significant.

What causes the ball to go fly shorter is the increasesd air density of cold weather. If you don't dress properly and can't keep your hands warm then you can lose a lot more from your lack of flexibiity when cold.

The amount you lose from air density increase is easily computable using any of the ball ballistics programs that have a temperature and atmospheric pressure input. Trajectoware on Dave T's website is a free one but isn't good for any shot that spins more then 4000 rpms.

[LeftDaddy]

[quote name='ronsc1985' timestamp='1448309956' post='12636382']
The loss in distaance due to a modern ball being cold is almost neglible, maybe 1%. I've done this on my GC2 launch monitor by leaving balls outside when the weather was 32F and comparing the launch conditions with balls kept in the house at 72 F. When wound balls were the norm the loss from the ball was significant.

What causes the ball to go fly shorter is the increasesd air density of cold weather. If you don't dress properly and can't keep your hands warm then you can lose a lot more from your lack of flexibiity when cold.

The amount you lose from air density increase is easily computable using any of the ball ballistics programs that have a temperature and atmospheric pressure input. Trajectoware on Dave T's website is a free one but isn't good for any shot that spins more then 4000 rpms.
[/quote]

Yes, this is a very good point. I definitely have that factored in to my "analysis" but perhaps the article I read was only focused on the ball temperature itself. In other words, I would have assumed the flight characteristics were taken into account also, but I vaguely remember the article only focusing on the ball temperature.

So sounds like the wisdom of the crowd suggests that minimal distance effects due to ball temp, but some distance effect due to air density in cold conditions, some loss of distance to stiffness, and (depending on ground conditions) some loss of distance due to roll.

Makes sense I guess. Thanks all!

[Dan Drake]

The rule of thumb that I have always heard was 2 yards for each 10°. So take your 70° yardage and go from there. 90° out? Add 4 yards carry to your irons. 40° out? Subtract 6 yards of carry.

Now, calculating how your body will feel when it's 40° out and how well you swing with 3 layers of clothing on is a whole 'nother story entirely!

[goatbarn]

It definitely is not just X yards per X degrees colder. It is definitely a percentage.

With the linear logic...I hit a 40 yard pitch when it's 30* colder, I should hit it 46 yards? But if I normally hit my driver 270 yards, now I'll still hit it 264 yards?

It makes much more sense if it were say 1% less carry per 2 degrees or something. So say it's 30* colder, that'd be 15% less distance. Normal 270 yard drive goes 230 yards, and a 40 yard pitch still would go 34 yards.

I have no idea what percentage it actually it, but I know that it's definitely not just X degrees = X yards, no matter how long the ball is in the air.

[golf9596]

My general rule is 3 yards of carry lost for every 10* lower than 80*. This takes into account extra layers, soft conditions and the cooler temperatures. I use to play the old “Lady” ball from Precept when it got below 50*, but have found my Pro V1-x seems to preform just fine for me no matter what the temperature is.

[Golfrnut]

Depending on where you live, there is also a factor of humidity to account for. Living near the coast where warm air brings up humity as well vs humidity dropping as the temp usually comes down can also add a bit into the mix. It's not necessarily just the temp that changes also, so a bit can be gained or lost there too.

[Keithpbz]

I've always used the 1% per 10* temperate rule. Going from 80* to 40* would be a 4% loss of distance with each club. You lose more yardage on longer clubs than wedges. On 80* day a wedge goes 100 yards and on 40* day it goes 96 yards. But on 80* day a 3 iron goes 200 yards and on 40* day it goes 192 yards. I actually made my own yardage gapping books for different temperature ranges based on this percentage theory. It has always been accurate for me.

[Sean2]

I am not as precise as you fellows. I played today (wind chill in the high 20s). I simply took an extra club or two.

[Keithpbz]

I play a lot of tournament golf and when a pin is 3 steps from an edge of the green I like to have a good idea how far a stock swing and shot will fly. 3 or 4 yards long can mean tough pitch shot from short side of hole. Usually means longer putts to save par. Having a little book with yardages helps me trust a shot, easier to commit and make confident swing for me.

[goatbarn]

[quote name='golf9596' timestamp='1448322037' post='12637426']
My general rule is 3 yards of carry lost for every 10* lower than 80*. This takes into account extra layers, soft conditions and the cooler temperatures. I use to play the old “Lady” ball from Precept when it got below 50*, but have found my Pro V1-x seems to preform just fine for me no matter what the temperature is.
[/quote]

So if it's 40* colder, your 60 yard pitch goes 48 yards, but your 320 yard drive still goes 308 yards?

That's not making any sense in my brain. It HAS to be a percentage.

[Keithpbz]

It is most definitely a percentage. And once your down to partial wedge and pitch shots the difference is too small to even worry about. No one is consistent enough to worry about 1/2 yard differences. I've heard stories about Johnny Miller saying he could control shots to the 1/2 yard. I think there are too many environmental factors to do that, plus perfect strike every time. But to mentally think you can do that is probably a huge confidence booster.

[bluedot]

Needless to say, there has been a ton of research done on this. A lot of the stuff you read when you google the topic talks about a number of yards per 10* temp drops, but as several have pointed out above the more accurate way to think of it is as a more or less constant percentage across all the clubs in your bag. I think the studies that talk about a particular number of yards being lost as if it is a constant number must only be talking about the driver; obviously, that isn't happening with a pitch shot or a putt. (BTW, the studies have also shown that the impact of humidity on a golf ball compared to air temperature (and therefore density) is negligible.) Add in a stiffer body and more layers of clothing and the effects of cold can be pretty dramatic.

Of course, we experience distance differences due to air density all the time without temperature changes simply by changing elevation. Ask any MLB pitcher about pitching in Coors Field in Denver at nearly a mile of elevation, or in Atlanta with the highest elevation of any MLB park east of the Mississippi. When I lived in Atlanta and traveled to piedmont NC, I figured a half a club of distance lost, and then another half club if I went to the coast. And in my experience, the density changes from temperature far outweigh the density changes from elevation!

If you want a lab on the impact of air density, keep your gas mileage on a particular route when it's 80* and then several months later when it's 30*. It's dramatic, maybe as much as 10% or more, absent wind. Same thing with a golf ball, of course.

[Ri_Redneck]

[quote name='LeftDaddy' timestamp='1448244346' post='12633268']
I have a question for the experts on here. I'm almost certain that I've read somewhere that cooler / cold temperatures don't affect distance as much as people think. I seem to remember this article saying 2-3 yards per 10 degree diff in temperature, and that lower compression balls could negate that effect to some degree.

Well, anyway, either I've lost about 2-3 clubs worth of distance in the past 2 months or what I read totally wasn't true. I played today and it was certainly cool, but not all that cold. I swear I've lost 30 yards on my driver, and I found myself hitting 3 clubs more than normal and still not reaching greens (hitting a 7 from same spot I would normally hit 9 or P for example). I used the Wilson Staff Duo ball, but it was just ridiculous how short everything was.

[b]I did notice later that the front 9 played longer than the back, primarily because of wind direction,[/b] [b]so I flew a couple of greens on the back 9[/b], but by that point I was almost as a joke grabbing my 7 iron from my typical P wedge yardage. It was weird because I just couldn't make myself swing hard with that much club. The course is also still soggy from a lot of rain recently, so I guess that also hurts.

I've played plenty of winter golf before but I guess I just don't remember distances being this far off. Maybe the combo of cold temps, wind, and wet ground made it play so long? What do the experts say?
[/quote]

Sounds like the wind combined with the cold was the cause of the difference.

BTW, I've had to hit a 3w on a 150 yd (8i) par3 because of wind and cold before, so a 7i at 9i yardage ain't THAT weird!

BT

[mizmatt]

I have really never noticed any loss of distance until it gets below 50°.
Then club up up as needed.