Tiger vs Jack question...

[starsail85]

I'd argue that tiger never got the driver where he wanted it after his knee went real bad in 2002

He was awesome off the tee in 99 2000

[bscinstnct]

[quote]

I agree. I thought Tiger drove very well in his early years. Some of his driving in the US Amateur was fun to watch.
[/quote]

"I'm old school," Tiger said. "I"m part of the last generation to play persimmon and balata balls. I grew up on persimmon. The ball always moved so you had to play a shot."


"Clearly enjoying the persimmon talk, Woods added that when he was a kid he used to ask his father Earl why people always used the phrase "hit it on the screws," since the screws were not in the center of the clubface.

"That's a miss-hit," said Tiger with a smile, "you wanted to miss the screws."

http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/tiger-woods-talks-about-nike-vapor-irons-and-his-old-school-golf-clubs

[John L.]

I wish the modern Titleist ProV1 curved as much as the old Titleist ProTrajectory's. You would have the best of both worlds. A tougher cover, and dimples that allowed you to bend the hell out of it.

[starsail85]

[quote name='John L.' timestamp='1450635986' post='12743878']
I wish the modern Titleist ProV1 curved as much as the old Titleist ProTrajectory's. You would have the best of both worlds. A tougher cover, and dimples that allowed you to bend the hell out of it.
[/quote]

Not sure if it's the cover here, I think it's the core that reduces the spin on longer shots ( pro v1 had the same cover as the professional when it first came out a urethane elastomer cover 392 )

Personally I find the pro v1 to be fine for working the ball , the thing that strikes me about say an old tour balata is the upshoot you get on the ball they really go high and you need to de loft everything to get max distance.

[Forged4ever]

[quote name='PouncePony' timestamp='1450562961' post='12740792']I guess the Harlem Globe Trotters are the best basket ball team ever.
[/quote]No, not THE best, though they never got the credit that they were due

Their greatest teams were just in the wrong era

Wait a second, I thought that I settled this with my quantitative formula?

I can't believe that I wasted 2-3 hours and Lord knows how many brain cells only to have it dismissed

That's ok, they scoffed at Newton and Albert initially also

Have a Great week Gents

Golfingly Yours,
RP

[hogans71]

[quote name='starsail85' timestamp='1450623688' post='12743190']
[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1450622387' post='12743130']
[quote name='starsail85' timestamp='1450613428' post='12742810']
Don't see Jack winning by 12 or 15
[/quote]

Does larger margin of victory count as two wins?

The notion that JN couldn't achieve superstar status in ANY era is absurd. Like TW, JN is a once in generation talent that would win in any era with any equipment. And win in bunches..
[/quote]

I don't see that Jack had even close to the array of shots you need on a modern tour course. He played on slow greens and there was no need to have any variety and your could get away with real weaknesses

The 12 and 15 comment is aimed at the fact that tiger blew fields away in a way that Jack simply couldn't , there shouldn't even be a question that tiger was a far better player than Jack . Jack has a better record as a complete body of work but then again Harrington has a better major record that Greg Norman
[/quote]

Wow.. So much fail in one post.

[AztecGold]

Bottom Line
Tiger and Jack are
Co-GOATs

One is not better than the other.
Both are GREAT

[Forged4ever]

[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1450641570' post='12744100']
[quote name='starsail85' timestamp='1450623688' post='12743190']
[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1450622387' post='12743130']
[quote name='starsail85' timestamp='1450613428' post='12742810']
Don't see Jack winning by 12 or 15
[/quote]

Does larger margin of victory count as two wins?

The notion that JN couldn't achieve superstar status in ANY era is absurd. Like TW, JN is a once in generation talent that would win in any era with any equipment. And win in bunches..
[/quote]

I don't see that Jack had even close to the array of shots you need on a modern tour course. He played on slow greens and there was no need to have any variety and your could get away with real weaknesses

The 12 and 15 comment is aimed at the fact that tiger blew fields away in a way that Jack simply couldn't , there shouldn't even be a question that tiger was a far better player than Jack . Jack has a better record as a complete body of work but then again Harrington has a better major record that Greg Norman
[/quote]

Wow.. So much fail in one post.
[/quote]A couple of things Star-

You're right about Jack of the 60's, 70's and into the 80's not having the shots that today's tracks demand-

He didn't need em, lmao

However, here's how I look at it....

There are 8-9, maybe 10 Champions, and I emphasize Champions, who rose to level of All-Timers, not because of the gear they Played, or the fields that they competed against, or the shots in their armamentarium....

No, they are All-Timers, because what they brought to the table, or I should say course, was an attitude, a focus and discipline and a Confidence that you could put them in ANY era, against ANY Player or field of Players, and they would kick the living s*** outa them just as they did those in there own time.

Jack, Tiger, Sam(who actually did win across 5 decades), Ben Hogan, Sir Walter, Ben, Byron, Lee, Tom and there are a few more but you get where I'm comin from-

If Jack had come of age in post-2000 tourneys, he would have every single shot needed and he would dominate just as he did in the 60's, 70's and into the 80's-

Just as Tiger would or any of the others, because True Greatness is not based on swings or fields or equipment, it's based on a mindset and Attitude.

Regarding Jack not blowing away fields, of course he didn't, lmao

I posted a few of the top-10 finishers in a few of his majors and in the two that I posted, 6 and 8 of the Top-10 were HoFers, including Jack...

You didn't blow away Armie, Lee, Tom Watson, Ray Floyd, Billy Casper or Gary Player, to name a few, lol

Yes, Tiger had a few rounds and tourneys for the ages, however Ernie summed up the attitude of the other other bois(cept Double D and Hal Sutton, both of whom scoffed at the comment) when he said, "when Tiger is on the rest of us are Playing for second," lol. That's coming from a HoFer, sadly. So I attribute some of that domination to Players being beat before they teed off.

Do you think for one millisecond that Arnie or Lee or Gary or Tom or Ray or Johnny or Billy Casper EVER thought that?

Nah, those Boys had heart-

Yep, for an athlete to think that, much less say it, well, that's pathetic-

And Ernie is one of my three favorite Players and as Classy a Man as has ever planted a tee.

But he and the others lacked the mindset of an All-Timer-

But make no mistake, a True All-Timer, regardless of the sport, would be an Campion in ANY Generation-

Jack & Tiger are All-Timers and that's all that really matters at the end of the day-

There is no "right" or "best" answer-

As Aztec said, they're Both Great-

They are both one in a million, and what put em there?

That 5.5" track between their ears that Bob Jones referred to

Stay Well My Friend and have a Very Merry Christmas & a Blessed Holiday Season

All the Best,
RP

[king_biscuit]

Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.

[Forged4ever]

[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]I remember Davis' comment and as an aside, after Playing with Ernie, and we were at my club, we had a great discussion, and he spoke to this, he just spoke to pulling back from always meeting the guys for beers or hanging around the bar with them in Lake Nona. I've Played with him down there as my Sis and Bro-in-Laws are members and the three times we Played, he stopped in for a coke once and left from the locker room the other two times.

This was before his comment(at our club. Lake Nona was after) and I'll admit that I was disappointed because I think it stunned me more then anything-

I mean, Davis Love, it doesn't surprise me-

Luke, though it would disappoint me, it wouldn't surprise me-

Freddie?

Wouldn't surprise me at all-

But Ernie sayin it threw me, lol

But he's still a Class Act and a Gentleman-

At the end if the day, that's the most important thing

Have a Blessed Holiday Season Bro

My Best,
Richard

[bscinstnct]

[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]

"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )

[king_biscuit]

[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450657651' post='12744952']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]

"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )
[/quote]

Sounds like a nice compliment, that's all. Watson in his prime had the heart of a Tiger -- no pun intended

[bscinstnct]

[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450658355' post='12745012']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450657651' post='12744952']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]

"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )
[/quote]

Sounds like a nice compliment, that's all. Watson in his prime had the heart of a Tiger -- no pun intended
[/quote]

I hear you, no doubt Watson would have dug in. But you gotta think he wouldnt want to.




"Watson, who believes he is still good enough to contend this week after a fortnight's practice amid the sheep and horses of the Westward Ho golf course, insisted Woods has no weakness - unlike Nicklaus.

``Jack had power in reserve and that's what you see about Tiger,'' said Watson.

``Jack's only shortcoming was his short game.

``He was a wonderful putter. When he had to make a putt he made that putt.

``I don't think anyone has ever been better at that but his play around the green was not the best.

``With Tiger that dimension is right up there among the best, if not the best.

``If you compare the two they are very similar with the exception of that one little Achilles heel that Jack had.'"

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Golf%3A+Watson+tribute.-a089208989

[Forged4ever]

[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450661533' post='12745220']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450658355' post='12745012']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450657651' post='12744952']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]

"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )
[/quote]

Sounds like a nice compliment, that's all. Watson in his prime had the heart of a Tiger -- no pun intended
[/quote]

I hear you, no doubt Watson would have dug in. But you gotta think he wouldnt want to.




"Watson, who believes he is still good enough to contend this week after a fortnight's practice amid the sheep and horses of the Westward Ho golf course, insisted Woods has no weakness - unlike Nicklaus.

``Jack had power in reserve and that's what you see about Tiger,'' said Watson.

``Jack's only shortcoming was his short game.

``He was a wonderful putter. When he had to make a putt he made that putt.

``I don't think anyone has ever been better at that but his play around the green was not the best.

``With Tiger that dimension is right up there among the best, if not the best.

``If you compare the two they are very similar with the exception of that one little Achilles heel that Jack had.'"

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Golf%3A+Watson+tribute.-a089208989
[/quote]I am obviously biased when it comes to Tom Watson, however I've gotta believe that the Man who spoke as an elder statesman in his 50-60's spoke differently than Tom Watson would have in his 20's and 30's.

I don't know if you remember, however Jack was looked at and talked about by the talking heads as though he was invincible and unbeatable back in the 70's.

I will say that for that two year period during which his "Tiger Slam" occurred, I don't think anyone who's ever Played the game could have done that.

Would having 7-10 HoFers teeing it up in those majors have changed anything?

Would having Jack or Lee or Tom or Gary in his foursome on Sunday changed anything?

Possibly the margin of his victories might not have been as Great, and bear in mind that Jack is my GOAT, though Tiger was on a plane all his own-

Incredible Golf!!

But #1, Tom hardly every gave more than direct 5-6 word answers to questions, lmao

Back in the day, he was not the most entertaining or lively interview, lol

#2, I just don't think he'd let his mind go to the place that would allow him to say anything like he said about Tiger in the last 15 years, cuz they were talking about Jack like he walked on water and Tom never bit-

But the next time I speak to him I'm definitely askin him if he's a fan boi, lmao

Take care Bro

Have a Great week!!

My Best,
RP

[widow-maker]

[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450661533' post='12745220']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450658355' post='12745012']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450657651' post='12744952']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]

"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )
[/quote]

Sounds like a nice compliment, that's all. Watson in his prime had the heart of a Tiger -- no pun intended
[/quote]

I hear you, no doubt Watson would have dug in. But you gotta think he wouldnt want to.




"Watson, who believes he is still good enough to contend this week after a fortnight's practice amid the sheep and horses of the Westward Ho golf course, insisted Woods has no weakness - unlike Nicklaus.

``Jack had power in reserve and that's what you see about Tiger,'' said Watson.

``Jack's only shortcoming was his short game.

``He was a wonderful putter. When he had to make a putt he made that putt.

``I don't think anyone has ever been better at that but his play around the green was not the best.

``With Tiger that dimension is right up there among the best, if not the best.

``If you compare the two they are very similar with the exception of that one little Achilles heel that Jack had.'"

[url="http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Golf%3A+Watson+tribute.-a089208989"]http://www.thefreeli...ute.-a089208989[/url]
[/quote]If Jack had needed a short game to win... he'd have developed it. He worked on what he needed to work on to win.

If Tiger had played in Jack's era, there'd have been some things that he'd have had to change and work on, too. You adapt to what you have to do.

[Shilgy]

[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]Do you watch Feherty? Is not Watson the same as what you denigrate Els for? As an aside so am I.

[king_biscuit]

[quote name='Shilgy' timestamp='1450667628' post='12745614']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]Do you watch Feherty? Is not Watson the same as what you denigrate Els for? As an aside so am I.
[/quote]

Denigrate? Els has stated in multiple interviews that he is an alcoholic and that it affected his game detrimentally. I am not making a value judgment about his character...

[bscinstnct]

[quote name='Forged4ever' timestamp='1450665906' post='12745508']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450661533' post='12745220']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450658355' post='12745012']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450657651' post='12744952']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]

"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )
[/quote]

Sounds like a nice compliment, that's all. Watson in his prime had the heart of a Tiger -- no pun intended
[/quote]

I hear you, no doubt Watson would have dug in. But you gotta think he wouldnt want to.




"Watson, who believes he is still good enough to contend this week after a fortnight's practice amid the sheep and horses of the Westward Ho golf course, insisted Woods has no weakness - unlike Nicklaus.

``Jack had power in reserve and that's what you see about Tiger,'' said Watson.

``Jack's only shortcoming was his short game.

``He was a wonderful putter. When he had to make a putt he made that putt.

``I don't think anyone has ever been better at that but his play around the green was not the best.

``With Tiger that dimension is right up there among the best, if not the best.

``If you compare the two they are very similar with the exception of that one little Achilles heel that Jack had.'"

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Golf%3A+Watson+tribute.-a089208989
[/quote]I am obviously biased when it comes to Tom Watson, however I've gotta believe that the Man who spoke as an elder statesman in his 50-60's spoke differently than Tom Watson would have in his 20's and 30's.

I don't know if you remember, however Jack was looked at and talked about by the talking heads as though he was invincible and unbeatable back in the 70's.

I will say that for that two year period during which his "Tiger Slam" occurred, I don't think anyone who's ever Played the game could have done that.

Would having 7-10 HoFers teeing it up in those majors have changed anything?

Would having Jack or Lee or Tom or Gary in his foursome on Sunday changed anything?

Possibly the margin of his victories might not have been as Great, and bear in mind that Jack is my GOAT, though Tiger was on a plane all his own-

Incredible Golf!!

But #1, Tom hardly every gave more than direct 5-6 word answers to questions, lmao

Back in the day, he was not the most entertaining or lively interview, lol

#2, I just don't think he'd let his mind go to the place that would allow him to say anything like he said about Tiger in the last 15 years, cuz they were talking about Jack like he walked on water and Tom never bit-

But the next time I speak to him I'm definitely askin him if he's a fan boi, lmao

Take care Bro

Have a Great week!!

My Best,
RP
[/quote]

Fantastic and on target.

I would impose only that

For a few years, TW was not playing anyone. He was playing Augusta, Pebble, etc, and beating the living crap out of them.

Kind of like when Hogan didnt care who was in front of him.

I doubt anybody, past, present, future, was getting in TWs way at that time.

[Shilgy]

[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450668085' post='12745634']
[quote name='Shilgy' timestamp='1450667628' post='12745614']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]Do you watch Feherty? Is not Watson the same as what you denigrate Els for? As an aside so am I.
[/quote]

Denigrate? Els has stated in multiple interviews that he is an alcoholic and that it affected his game detrimentally. I am not making a value judgment about his character...
[/quote]my bad then. Misunderstood.

[king_biscuit]

[quote name='Shilgy' timestamp='1450668945' post='12745706']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450668085' post='12745634']
[quote name='Shilgy' timestamp='1450667628' post='12745614']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450655423' post='12744804']
Two other things, Richard: Davis Love actually admitted on TV that he was intimidated playing with Tiger (just pathetic and a big reason I don't like him as a ryder cup captain) and Ernie is an admitted alcoholic (which certainly caused his game to deteriorate in the decade of the 2000s.
[/quote]Do you watch Feherty? Is not Watson the same as what you denigrate Els for? As an aside so am I.
[/quote]

Denigrate? Els has stated in multiple interviews that he is an alcoholic and that it affected his game detrimentally. I am not making a value judgment about his character...
[/quote]my bad then. Misunderstood.
[/quote]

Thanks. I have always been a big Ernie fan, btw.

[JustTheTips]

[quote name='PouncePony' timestamp='1450561427' post='12740670']
Compare the multiple major winners from both eras....

Palmer - 7
Player - 9
[color=#191919]Ballesteros * - 5 late in the Nicklaus era[/color]
[color=#191919]Watson - 8[/color]
[color=#191919]Trevino - 6[/color]
[color=#191919]Floyd - 4[/color]
[color=#191919]Casper - 3[/color]
[color=#191919]Nelson - 3[/color]
[color=#191919]Irwin - 3[/color]
[color=#191919]Miller -[/color]2
[color=#191919]North - 2[/color]

[color=#191919]Vs[/color]

[color=#191919]Mickelson - 5[/color]
[color=#191919]Els - 4[/color]
[color=#191919]McIlroy - 4 * late in Tiger era[/color]
[color=#191919]Harrington - 3[/color]
[color=#191919]Singh - 3[/color]
Olazabal - 2
Daly - 2
O'Meara - 2
Goosen - 2

Jack had 19 runner up finishes in majors; Tiger has 6.

Tiger's domination is incomparable, but which group of guys would you want to play against for all the marbles? 18 majors and 19 runner ups against that competition. Jack is the best of all time.
[/quote]

Lets look at the ratio of majors between them and the 2nd placers
Jack: 18:9
Tiger: 14:5
Tiger is almost 3:1 compared to his competion while Jack was down a 2:1. Seriously lots of majors among a few people is just a sign of lack of depth of the fields. It doesn't tell you anything about the strength of the fields. Think about it this way, If there were 10 Tiger (or jack) clones during his prime, each one would have won less. Does that make them weaker golfers?

[Soloman1]

Montana or Brady?
Tesla or Edison?
Leibniz or Newton?
Nolan Ryan or Walter Johnson?
first wife or second wife?

[Forged4ever]

[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450668277' post='12745650']
[quote name='Forged4ever' timestamp='1450665906' post='12745508']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450661533' post='12745220']
[quote name='king_biscuit' timestamp='1450658355' post='12745012']
[quote name='bscinstnct' timestamp='1450657651' post='12744952']
"He is something supernatural," five-time British Open champion Tom Watson said. "He has raised the bar to a level that only he can jump."

-Tom Watson on Tiger Woods


Sounds a little intimidated ; )
[/quote]

Sounds like a nice compliment, that's all. Watson in his prime had the heart of a Tiger -- no pun intended
[/quote]

I hear you, no doubt Watson would have dug in. But you gotta think he wouldnt want to.




"Watson, who believes he is still good enough to contend this week after a fortnight's practice amid the sheep and horses of the Westward Ho golf course, insisted Woods has no weakness - unlike Nicklaus.

``Jack had power in reserve and that's what you see about Tiger,'' said Watson.

``Jack's only shortcoming was his short game.

``He was a wonderful putter. When he had to make a putt he made that putt.

``I don't think anyone has ever been better at that but his play around the green was not the best.

``With Tiger that dimension is right up there among the best, if not the best.

``If you compare the two they are very similar with the exception of that one little Achilles heel that Jack had.'"

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Golf%3A+Watson+tribute.-a089208989
[/quote]I am obviously biased when it comes to Tom Watson, however I've gotta believe that the Man who spoke as an elder statesman in his 50-60's spoke differently than Tom Watson would have in his 20's and 30's.

I don't know if you remember, however Jack was looked at and talked about by the talking heads as though he was invincible and unbeatable back in the 70's.

I will say that for that two year period during which his "Tiger Slam" occurred, I don't think anyone who's ever Played the game could have done that.

Would having 7-10 HoFers teeing it up in those majors have changed anything?

Would having Jack or Lee or Tom or Gary in his foursome on Sunday changed anything?

Possibly the margin of his victories might not have been as Great, and bear in mind that Jack is my GOAT, though Tiger was on a plane all his own-

Incredible Golf!!

But #1, Tom hardly every gave more than direct 5-6 word answers to questions, lmao

Back in the day, he was not the most entertaining or lively interview, lol

#2, I just don't think he'd let his mind go to the place that would allow him to say anything like he said about Tiger in the last 15 years, cuz they were talking about Jack like he walked on water and Tom never bit-

But the next time I speak to him I'm definitely askin him if he's a fan boi, lmao

Take care Bro

Have a Great week!!

My Best,
RP
[/quote]

Fantastic and on target.

I would impose only that

For a few years, TW was not playing anyone. He was playing Augusta, Pebble, etc, and beating the living crap out of them.

Kind of like when Hogan didnt care who was in front of him.

I doubt anybody, past, present, future, was getting in TWs way at that time.
[/quote]Yes, absolutely, and that's what i was trying to say about that period from just before his "Slam" to a year or even two after-

That's the finest Golf that I've seen in my lifetime and I think the only question was what was the final number gonna be-

I mean, he caused them to change golf courses because of his game, lol

Think about that for a minute, lmao

That's insane, to be at a level that ya cause all the little green jackets to scurry around trying to figure out how to keep their track relevant, lol-

Great analogy to Hogan through that 12 month period-

It's too bad that he couldn't Play in the PGA Championship-


Have a nice week Bro

All the Best,
RP

[playa]

[quote name='Boricua Golf' timestamp='1450369823' post='12731640']
I was watching Golf Central and they had the big four (adding Trevino), Jack, Arnold and Gary, and they were asked about Tiger, is he going to win again and is winning a Major?, they stated that he would if he did the right thing as for rehab and getting a consistent swing, they also stated that the competition these days is so much better and fierce that it will be a constant uphill battle for him to just get a win, let alone a Major, with guys like the current big four, Rory, Jason, Jordan and Ricky, not to mention the others that are just as good...I hope he wins, it would be great for him and his confidence and definitely for golf in general...I have never agreed with the world rankings to an extent, I understand that they are talking about the current best player in the game (back to the big 4), but if we are going by resume, then Jack should still be the number one player in the world and Tiger the number 2, just from the regular tour wins and Majors...Tiger is 416th or something like that in the current world rankings, makes no sense to me, but it is what it is, I know someone here will say something to the extent of what havehe done lately and I agree, but they are the best ever...for now...
[/quote]
In what universe is no majors Fowler part of a 'big four'? Surely it wasn't a quote from any of the golfers taking part in the interview?

[RichardH]

[quote name='playa' timestamp='1450679589' post='12746070']
[quote name='Boricua Golf' timestamp='1450369823' post='12731640']
I was watching Golf Central and they had the big four (adding Trevino), Jack, Arnold and Gary, and they were asked about Tiger, is he going to win again and is winning a Major?, they stated that he would if he did the right thing as for rehab and getting a consistent swing, they also stated that the competition these days is so much better and fierce that it will be a constant uphill battle for him to just get a win, let alone a Major, with guys like the current big four, Rory, Jason, Jordan and Ricky, not to mention the others that are just as good...I hope he wins, it would be great for him and his confidence and definitely for golf in general...I have never agreed with the world rankings to an extent, I understand that they are talking about the current best player in the game (back to the big 4), but if we are going by resume, then Jack should still be the number one player in the world and Tiger the number 2, just from the regular tour wins and Majors...Tiger is 416th or something like that in the current world rankings, makes no sense to me, but it is what it is, I know someone here will say something to the extent of what havehe done lately and I agree, but they are the best ever...for now...
[/quote]
In what universe is no majors Fowler part of a 'big four'? Surely it wasn't a quote from any of the golfers taking part in the interview?
[/quote]

In all the words that have appeared in this thread, that one line was what stuck out to me too, Fowler shouldn't even be in a big 10 list let alone a big 4!

[Scotty1140]

[quote name='RichardH' timestamp='1450700234' post='12746276']
[quote name='playa' timestamp='1450679589' post='12746070']
[quote name='Boricua Golf' timestamp='1450369823' post='12731640']
I was watching Golf Central and they had the big four (adding Trevino), Jack, Arnold and Gary, and they were asked about Tiger, is he going to win again and is winning a Major?, they stated that he would if he did the right thing as for rehab and getting a consistent swing, they also stated that the competition these days is so much better and fierce that it will be a constant uphill battle for him to just get a win, let alone a Major, with guys like the current big four, Rory, Jason, Jordan and Ricky, not to mention the others that are just as good...I hope he wins, it would be great for him and his confidence and definitely for golf in general...I have never agreed with the world rankings to an extent, I understand that they are talking about the current best player in the game (back to the big 4), but if we are going by resume, then Jack should still be the number one player in the world and Tiger the number 2, just from the regular tour wins and Majors...Tiger is 416th or something like that in the current world rankings, makes no sense to me, but it is what it is, I know someone here will say something to the extent of what havehe done lately and I agree, but they are the best ever...for now...
[/quote]
In what universe is no majors Fowler part of a 'big four'? Surely it wasn't a quote from any of the golfers taking part in the interview?
[/quote]

In all the words that have appeared in this thread, that one line was what stuck out to me too, Fowler shouldn't even be in a big 10 list let alone a big 4!
[/quote]
In fact, I'd even go as far as calling this "The big 2" right now. McIlroy has maintained a high level longer than anyone else in this "big 4" with major victories in three separate seasons. Most would agree Spieth has the game and mentality for some longevity, but I need to see Day put together another solid year. Yes, he absolutely steamrolled everyone after his near miss at The Open, but until that point, he was still that guy who everyone was waiting on to fulfill some of his potential.

[Boricua Golf]

[quote name='Scotty1140' timestamp='1450701091' post='12746300']
[quote name='RichardH' timestamp='1450700234' post='12746276']
[quote name='playa' timestamp='1450679589' post='12746070']
[quote name='Boricua Golf' timestamp='1450369823' post='12731640']
I was watching Golf Central and they had the big four (adding Trevino), Jack, Arnold and Gary, and they were asked about Tiger, is he going to win again and is winning a Major?, they stated that he would if he did the right thing as for rehab and getting a consistent swing, they also stated that the competition these days is so much better and fierce that it will be a constant uphill battle for him to just get a win, let alone a Major, with guys like the current big four, Rory, Jason, Jordan and Ricky, not to mention the others that are just as good...I hope he wins, it would be great for him and his confidence and definitely for golf in general...I have never agreed with the world rankings to an extent, I understand that they are talking about the current best player in the game (back to the big 4), but if we are going by resume, then Jack should still be the number one player in the world and Tiger the number 2, just from the regular tour wins and Majors...Tiger is 416th or something like that in the current world rankings, makes no sense to me, but it is what it is, I know someone here will say something to the extent of what havehe done lately and I agree, but they are the best ever...for now...
[/quote]
In what universe is no majors Fowler part of a 'big four'? Surely it wasn't a quote from any of the golfers taking part in the interview?
[/quote]

In all the words that have appeared in this thread, that one line was what stuck out to me too, Fowler shouldn't even be in a big 10 list let alone a big 4!
[/quote]
In fact, I'd even go as far as calling this "The big 2" right now. McIlroy has maintained a high level longer than anyone else in this "big 4" with major victories in three separate seasons. Most would agree Spieth has the game and mentality for some longevity, but I need to see Day put together another solid year. Yes, he absolutely steamrolled everyone after his near miss at The Open, but until that point, he was still that guy who everyone was waiting on to fulfill some of his potential.
[/quote]

It is all about pesonal opinion, so in my opinion, Fowler showed up better than the others, overall, I understand Dustin almost won the US Open, but really that's it...to me consistent play matters, again in "my" opinion, should I or shouldn't I place his name in the conversation of the big 4?, well why not, just for the sake of argument...in reality he had a good year, just did not win a major (like Rory)...but we are entitled to our opinion, I do understand the points made, but again it is "my" opinion...

[EKELLY]

[quote name='Dave230' timestamp='1450368883' post='12731558']
You should include major top 3s in a discussion too. Tiger would be happy to approve. Tiger said this week:

[color=#000000]"Jack's tournament records are incredible, not just his 18 majors (plus two U.S. amateurs) and 73 PGA TOUR wins, but [b]his 19 second-place finishes in the majors, which I think may be his most incredible stat[/b]."[/color]
[/quote]Okay stud, here goes!.....Tiger never had to stare down Lee Trevino or Tom Watson down the stretch or in a playoff. Tiger had Bob May, Rocco Mediate, and Chris DiMarco. Tiger never got BEAT down the stretch by anyone other than YE Yang. Watson and Trevino alone cost Jack 4-5 majors, and we're not even counting Gary Player in the mix. Those 2nd place finishes of Jack's to me are as important as the wins. That number is ridiculous........Tiger had nothing more than a bunch of world class underachievers to beat, and he did!!......Don't get me wrong, what Tiger did was phenomenal, but he didn't have much more than "one-hit wonders" to compete against....Let the debate begin!...LOL

[Forged4ever]

[quote name='widow-maker' timestamp='1450559668' post='12740486']
[quote name='starsail85' timestamp='1450553004' post='12740108']
If anybody played in a weak era it was jack

People forget how low everybody started scoring in the late 80s and early 90s . Look at the winning scores in events they all got lower and lower and then a trend of lengthening courses started

if you compare jacks game in his prime to tigers in every department it's not even close woods was a great deal better in every department apart from possibly driving . Short game isn't even close , would Jack even be able to compete with his chipping and sand play on a modern course with fast greens?

In jacks day everybody played safe for 63 holes then went for it

You haven't been able to do that since the mid 80s
[/quote]Jack's era was a different game, with different equipment. Those guys were hitting 3 irons into a 440 yard hole. You can't compare because they were facing different conditions, different challenges, different equipment. All you've got to go on is how they did against the best of their era. Any comparison you try to make is always going to be "out of context". Just like trying to compare Tiger with today's kids. They're all hitting it further than Tiger and the scoring in majors is going lower. The Driver and ball that Tiger used in the mid 90's is nothing like the driver that Rory, Jason, and Jordan are using today. The fields are getting better because of the equipment, the money is bringing in more competition. But, you can judge Tiger by what he accomplished in his era vs what these young guys accomplish in theirs. That's all we've got. 20 years from now Tiger will be in the afterthought category as the new young guns on Tour will be held as being better than Tiger ever could have been.
[/quote]BINGO!!!

Great observation regarding the equipment!!

Specifically the balls!!!

Jack, who is not known for hyperbole, said that he couldn't imagine the scores back in the 60's and 70's if they'd have had the metal woods and balls of today's Players(this was in 2010), what with all of the HoFers Playing in the 60's and 70's.....

Yea, that was a weak period, LMAO

Okey dokey then....

Just for s**** & giggles, and well, I'm trapped in this IV chair for another hour I looked up that "weak" period between 1965-1980-

Here's the HoFers that planted the tee during this period:

1) Jack
2) Arnie
3) Lee
4) Gary
5) Billy Casper
6) Julius Boros
7) Tom Watson
8) Raymond Floyd
9) Gene Litler
10) Hale Irwin
11) Chi Chi
12) Johnny Miller
13) Tony Jacklin
14) Tom Kite
15) Larry Nelson
16) Hubert Green
17) Lanny Wadkins
18) Larry Nelson

Yeppers, that's a weak 15 year period for sure, LMAO

These guys were what my Teacher and his Younger Bro, Sam, called "Back Niners"

That was a Player who had the game to be at the top of the board on Sunday, back nine of a Major-

There ain't too many Back Niners on Tour today and there STF ain't many HoFers, LMAO

I'm not saying that there aren't some guys that could play and win in any era, because absolutist there are, starting with Rory & Jordan, however I don't think these kids have nearly the "IT" factor or the mental game of the guys above me, and most if those guys were teein it up against each other every week-

Seriously, look at that list again-

Now THOSE are Back Niners!!

But ooooooh baby are those fields deep and look at their six pack and and how far they hit it.....

Ooooooh Babeeeeee....

I love this frickin place, LMAO

Nice post Widow, Stay Well Bro and Happy New Year

Golfingly Yours,
RP

[Shilgy]

[quote name='Forged4ever' timestamp='1451593143' post='12785446']
[quote name='widow-maker' timestamp='1450559668' post='12740486']
[quote name='starsail85' timestamp='1450553004' post='12740108']
If anybody played in a weak era it was jack

People forget how low everybody started scoring in the late 80s and early 90s . Look at the winning scores in events they all got lower and lower and then a trend of lengthening courses started

if you compare jacks game in his prime to tigers in every department it's not even close woods was a great deal better in every department apart from possibly driving . Short game isn't even close , would Jack even be able to compete with his chipping and sand play on a modern course with fast greens?

In jacks day everybody played safe for 63 holes then went for it

You haven't been able to do that since the mid 80s
[/quote]Jack's era was a different game, with different equipment. Those guys were hitting 3 irons into a 440 yard hole. You can't compare because they were facing different conditions, different challenges, different equipment. All you've got to go on is how they did against the best of their era. Any comparison you try to make is always going to be "out of context". Just like trying to compare Tiger with today's kids. They're all hitting it further than Tiger and the scoring in majors is going lower. The Driver and ball that Tiger used in the mid 90's is nothing like the driver that Rory, Jason, and Jordan are using today. The fields are getting better because of the equipment, the money is bringing in more competition. But, you can judge Tiger by what he accomplished in his era vs what these young guys accomplish in theirs. That's all we've got. 20 years from now Tiger will be in the afterthought category as the new young guns on Tour will be held as being better than Tiger ever could have been.
[/quote]BINGO!!!

Great observation regarding the equipment!!

Specifically the balls!!!

Jack, who is not known for hyperbole, said that he couldn't imagine the scores back in the 60's and 70's if they'd have had the metal woods and balls of today's Players(this was in 2010), what with all of the HoFers Playing in the 60's and 70's.....

Yea, that was a weak period, LMAO

Okey dokey then....

LMAO, I frickin love this place!!!!

Nice post Widow, Stay Well Bro and Happy New Year

Golfingly Yours,
RP
[/quote]That's the thing though Richard-we don't know what would have happened. Sure, if they would have had the new equipment sooner they may have Jack-proofed Augusta instead of Tiger-proofed it. But in all fairness Tiger did grow up playing the old stuff so it is not exactly foreign to him. The other thing the new equipment does, as many have mentioned before, is that it levels out the playing field. If only the top players can really control their ball than yeah, they will dominate. But give the whole field of the 60's and 70's the new equipment and maybe those top dogs do not dominate quite as much as they did because the game just got a little more forgiving for the rank and file.

And PS-for those that think Tiger beat a bunch of scrubs while Jack was beating hall of famers...
Finished 2nd to Jack list includes Dave Ragan(who?), Dave Thomas (is that the Wendy's guy?), and Simon Owen. Amongst others. To me the fact that so many of the guys from that era finished top 5 in almost all of the majors points to a lack of top flight competition.