MEMBER TESTING: Mitsubishi Rayon Kuro Kage Silver Dual-Core TiNi shafts. Read reviews here!

[pitchinwedge]

Not sure if it's been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps Toll or someone else can explain the MR lineup? Where does the KK Dual-Core (human versions) and the XT fits among the other MR offerings? For example, the Tensei White, Diamana, etc. Really curious where a stiff flex Dual-Core sits relative to the Diamana D+ Limited and Tensei .

[TollBros]

Not sure if it's been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps Toll or someone else can explain the MR lineup? Where does the KK Dual-Core (human versions) and the XT fits among the other MR offerings? For example, the Tensei White, Diamana, etc. Really curious where a stiff flex Dual-Core sits relative to the Diamana D+ Limited and Tensei .

 

Almost all Mitsubishi shafts follow the red/white/blue structure lineup. High launch/mid spin, mid launch/mid-low spin, low launch/low spin. Fubuki line tends to be more counterbalanced, where Tensei line is more tip heavy more like Diamana. The shafts are often times different ways of achieving similar things, but with a totally different feel and balance point to suit just about any player need possible. Kuro Kage Dual Core proto (TX flex) is basically the white version of dual core, where standard dual core is effectively blue profile. The only shaft this is really unique in terms of following the typical r/w/b pattern would be Tensei Orange. I'm not a Mitsubishi rep or anything, but I've hit it all, and that's how I see the lineup.

[nwlim]

Thanks for the explanation Toll it was very gelpful

[Peanut191]

Not sure if it's been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps Toll or someone else can explain the MR lineup? Where does the KK Dual-Core (human versions) and the XT fits among the other MR offerings? For example, the Tensei White, Diamana, etc. Really curious where a stiff flex Dual-Core sits relative to the Diamana D+ Limited and Tensei .

 

Almost all Mitsubishi shafts follow the red/white/blue structure lineup. High launch/mid spin, mid launch/mid-low spin, low launch/low spin. Fubuki line tends to be more counterbalanced, where Tensei line is more tip heavy more like Diamana. The shafts are often times different ways of achieving similar things, but with a totally different feel and balance point to suit just about any player need possible. Kuro Kage Dual Core proto (TX flex) is basically the white version of dual core, where standard dual core is effectively blue profile. The only shaft this is really unique in terms of following the typical r/w/b pattern would be Tensei Orange. I'm not a Mitsubishi rep or anything, but I've hit it all, and that's how I see the lineup.

 

That's odd. In the Tensei Blue testing thread, it seems like a lot of guys were saying that they had to add weight to the head to get the swingweight back up, or that it was coming out at a lighter SW than what they were gaming before.

 

We're you saying the Tensei White is more tip heavy or the White and Blue are heavier in the tip than most shafts? How would the balance point compare on the KK DC & KK DC XT compared to the Tensei's? Really wish they would list the balance point of the uncut shaft in the specs on the manufacturer's websites.(like, it could say balance point - 23 inches, and that would mean the balance point is 23 inches away from the tip. Seems like they did something like this with some shafts on golf shaft reviews)

 

Just curious, as I find the balance point on the shaft tends to be pretty important for me because I like the feel of a heavier head. Just seems like I can feel where the head is during the swing better that way

[TollBros]

Not sure if it's been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps Toll or someone else can explain the MR lineup? Where does the KK Dual-Core (human versions) and the XT fits among the other MR offerings? For example, the Tensei White, Diamana, etc. Really curious where a stiff flex Dual-Core sits relative to the Diamana D+ Limited and Tensei .

 

Almost all Mitsubishi shafts follow the red/white/blue structure lineup. High launch/mid spin, mid launch/mid-low spin, low launch/low spin. Fubuki line tends to be more counterbalanced, where Tensei line is more tip heavy more like Diamana. The shafts are often times different ways of achieving similar things, but with a totally different feel and balance point to suit just about any player need possible. Kuro Kage Dual Core proto (TX flex) is basically the white version of dual core, where standard dual core is effectively blue profile. The only shaft this is really unique in terms of following the typical r/w/b pattern would be Tensei Orange. I'm not a Mitsubishi rep or anything, but I've hit it all, and that's how I see the lineup.

 

That's odd. In the Tensei Blue testing thread, it seems like a lot of guys were saying that they had to add weight to the head to get the swingweight back up, or that it was coming out at a lighter SW than what they were gaming before.

 

We're you saying the Tensei White is more tip heavy or the White and Blue are heavier in the tip than most shafts? How would the balance point compare on the KK DC & KK DC XT compared to the Tensei's? Really wish they would list the balance point of the uncut shaft in the specs on the manufacturer's websites.(like, it could say balance point - 23 inches, and that would mean the balance point is 23 inches away from the tip. Seems like they did something like this with some shafts on golf shaft reviews)

 

Just curious, as I find the balance point on the shaft tends to be pretty important for me because I like the feel of a heavier head. Just seems like I can feel where the head is during the swing better that way

 

Kuro Kage is more tip heavy than Tensei line, where Tensei is more tip heavy than Fubuki. Like I was trying to say before, there is a progression of balance points, tip, mid and butt stiffness, etc. This allows almost any player who say, wants a white type launch and spin to have that in the type of feel that is most conducive to their swing type. Obviously it's not always going to work out that way, but like I was trying to say before, there should be a shaft that suits every player based on the feel and performance combination. It's why I love their lineup so much.

[mosesgolf]

I currently play the Kuro Kage Tini 70x in my Titleist 915D2 and the Kuro Kage XT 60x in my G30 LS. The Kuro Kage line has been the best shafts I have ever played and I have pretty much played a slew of shafts over the years. It has the best combination of feel, smoothness, length and accuracy for my swing. At the end of the day I'm hitting more fairways than ever with great distance.

[pitchinwedge]

Very helpful explanation, Toll. Would you say tip-heaviness from least to most: Fubuki, Diamana, Tensei, KK? For some reason, I had found the original KK Tini to feel somewhat harsh, whereas the Dual-Core much smoother. Perhaps it was the head itself and not the shaft?

[Peanut191]

Not sure if it's been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps Toll or someone else can explain the MR lineup? Where does the KK Dual-Core (human versions) and the XT fits among the other MR offerings? For example, the Tensei White, Diamana, etc. Really curious where a stiff flex Dual-Core sits relative to the Diamana D+ Limited and Tensei .

 

Almost all Mitsubishi shafts follow the red/white/blue structure lineup. High launch/mid spin, mid launch/mid-low spin, low launch/low spin. Fubuki line tends to be more counterbalanced, where Tensei line is more tip heavy more like Diamana. The shafts are often times different ways of achieving similar things, but with a totally different feel and balance point to suit just about any player need possible. Kuro Kage Dual Core proto (TX flex) is basically the white version of dual core, where standard dual core is effectively blue profile. The only shaft this is really unique in terms of following the typical r/w/b pattern would be Tensei Orange. I'm not a Mitsubishi rep or anything, but I've hit it all, and that's how I see the lineup.

 

That's odd. In the Tensei Blue testing thread, it seems like a lot of guys were saying that they had to add weight to the head to get the swingweight back up, or that it was coming out at a lighter SW than what they were gaming before.

 

We're you saying the Tensei White is more tip heavy or the White and Blue are heavier in the tip than most shafts? How would the balance point compare on the KK DC & KK DC XT compared to the Tensei's? Really wish they would list the balance point of the uncut shaft in the specs on the manufacturer's websites.(like, it could say balance point - 23 inches, and that would mean the balance point is 23 inches away from the tip. Seems like they did something like this with some shafts on golf shaft reviews)

 

Just curious, as I find the balance point on the shaft tends to be pretty important for me because I like the feel of a heavier head. Just seems like I can feel where the head is during the swing better that way

 

Kuro Kage is more tip heavy than Tensei line, where Tensei is more tip heavy than Fubuki. Like I was trying to say before, there is a progression of balance points, tip, mid and butt stiffness, etc. This allows almost any player who say, wants a white type launch and spin to have that in the type of feel that is most conducive to their swing type. Obviously it's not always going to work out that way, but like I was trying to say before, there should be a shaft that suits every player based on the feel and performance combination. It's why I love their lineup so much.

 

Thanks for the info. You seem to have a ton of knowledge on the new shafts. Hopefully your boss works something out with WRX so we can go to a chart or review from you guys instead of directing all of the questions to you. You're probably exhausted by now just answering my questions. Appreciate all of the knowledge.

[TollBros]

Not sure if it's been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps Toll or someone else can explain the MR lineup? Where does the KK Dual-Core (human versions) and the XT fits among the other MR offerings? For example, the Tensei White, Diamana, etc. Really curious where a stiff flex Dual-Core sits relative to the Diamana D+ Limited and Tensei .

 

Almost all Mitsubishi shafts follow the red/white/blue structure lineup. High launch/mid spin, mid launch/mid-low spin, low launch/low spin. Fubuki line tends to be more counterbalanced, where Tensei line is more tip heavy more like Diamana. The shafts are often times different ways of achieving similar things, but with a totally different feel and balance point to suit just about any player need possible. Kuro Kage Dual Core proto (TX flex) is basically the white version of dual core, where standard dual core is effectively blue profile. The only shaft this is really unique in terms of following the typical r/w/b pattern would be Tensei Orange. I'm not a Mitsubishi rep or anything, but I've hit it all, and that's how I see the lineup.

 

That's odd. In the Tensei Blue testing thread, it seems like a lot of guys were saying that they had to add weight to the head to get the swingweight back up, or that it was coming out at a lighter SW than what they were gaming before.

 

We're you saying the Tensei White is more tip heavy or the White and Blue are heavier in the tip than most shafts? How would the balance point compare on the KK DC & KK DC XT compared to the Tensei's? Really wish they would list the balance point of the uncut shaft in the specs on the manufacturer's websites.(like, it could say balance point - 23 inches, and that would mean the balance point is 23 inches away from the tip. Seems like they did something like this with some shafts on golf shaft reviews)

 

Just curious, as I find the balance point on the shaft tends to be pretty important for me because I like the feel of a heavier head. Just seems like I can feel where the head is during the swing better that way

 

Kuro Kage is more tip heavy than Tensei line, where Tensei is more tip heavy than Fubuki. Like I was trying to say before, there is a progression of balance points, tip, mid and butt stiffness, etc. This allows almost any player who say, wants a white type launch and spin to have that in the type of feel that is most conducive to their swing type. Obviously it's not always going to work out that way, but like I was trying to say before, there should be a shaft that suits every player based on the feel and performance combination. It's why I love their lineup so much.

 

Thanks for the info. You seem to have a ton of knowledge on the new shafts. Hopefully your boss works something out with WRX so we can go to a chart or review from you guys instead of directing all of the questions to you. You're probably exhausted by now just answering my questions. Appreciate all of the knowledge.

 

I don't mind the questions if it helps people look in the right direction. There are so many great products to fit just about every player so I know it's helpful to at least be guided in the right direction. Now saying that, I am anxious for us to be able to officially become a part of this great site. I'd also like to add that we've been hitting and evaluating for quite some time so I don't mind questions about older products as well, but there seems to be a great wealth of information here in regards to those. I just try to help where help seems needed.

[TollBros]

Very helpful explanation, Toll. Would you say tip-heaviness from least to most: Fubuki, Diamana, Tensei, KK? For some reason, I had found the original KK Tini to feel somewhat harsh, whereas the Dual-Core much smoother. Perhaps it was the head itself and not the shaft?

 

I'd say that's right, but Diamana and Tensei are close. Now the new dual core is definitely less harsh than the original Kuro Kage. Original were excellent shafts, and I played XT for some time, but the dual core line is definitely an improvement from both a feel and performance perspective.

[GolfCrazy303]

I love the color and graphic design! I'm feeling it. Wish I was able to test something like this.

[TollBros]

Pics of the TX Tour shafts.

[Hokie2k5]

I've had a few more range sessions with the KKDC and my swing feels like it's getting a little closer to "normal" after all layoff due to poor weather and hectic work schedule.

 

I can absolutely say the KKDC is going into the bag for the long haul. Ball flight is good, maybe slightly higher than my D+ but I am really impressed. So much smoother than my D+ and I don't miss it left nearly as much.

 

Got in my first 18 in a long while and the driver was fantastic. Straight and plenty of carry. Played with some of my normal guys that we drive about the same distance and I was hitting it well past them on every whole. I don't know how about roll out yet because our course is completely soaked so there wasn't any rollout whatsoever.

 

I talked to Mitsubishi and they said that the TX flex Dual Core is not the new XT Proto but that the specs are pretty close between the two.

[TollBros]

 

I talked to Mitsubishi and they said that the TX flex Dual Core is not the new XT Proto but that the specs are pretty close between the two.

 

It is based on the original xt profile, and TX is Tour only, 46t carbon, longer tini fibers, higher grade material than standard dual core silver. As I said before, they don't want it called XT, but it is certainly based off that profile with higher grade materials and stiffer tip. Mitsubishi Tour reps call it dual core Tour proto. Trust me, I know.

[Hokie2k5]

I talked to Mitsubishi and they said that the TX flex Dual Core is not the new XT Proto but that the specs are pretty close between the two.

 

It is based on the original xt profile, and TX is Tour only, 46t carbon, longer tini fibers, higher grade material than standard dual core silver. As I said before, they don't want it called XT, but it is certainly based off that profile with higher grade materials and stiffer tip. Mitsubishi Tour reps call it dual core Tour proto. Trust me, I know.

 

I wasn't trying to prove you wrong or anything, just passing along what I heard direct from MRC. Either way, it's a fantastic shaft whether it's a tour proto or not.

[pitchinwedge]

Very helpful explanation, Toll. Would you say tip-heaviness from least to most: Fubuki, Diamana, Tensei, KK? For some reason, I had found the original KK Tini to feel somewhat harsh, whereas the Dual-Core much smoother. Perhaps it was the head itself and not the shaft?

 

I'd say that's right, but Diamana and Tensei are close. Now the new dual core is definitely less harsh than the original Kuro Kage. Original were excellent shafts, and I played XT for some time, but the dual core line is definitely an improvement from both a feel and performance perspective.

 

Thanks for confirming. Glad to know I can still rely on my senses. Boom!

[TollBros]

Very helpful explanation, Toll. Would you say tip-heaviness from least to most: Fubuki, Diamana, Tensei, KK? For some reason, I had found the original KK Tini to feel somewhat harsh, whereas the Dual-Core much smoother. Perhaps it was the head itself and not the shaft?

 

I'd say that's right, but Diamana and Tensei are close. Now the new dual core is definitely less harsh than the original Kuro Kage. Original were excellent shafts, and I played XT for some time, but the dual core line is definitely an improvement from both a feel and performance perspective.

 

Thanks for confirming. Glad to know I can still rely on my senses. Boom!

 

This is one thing Mitsubishi really accels at, in that they are able to make a very tip stiff, ultra low spin shaft, feel smooth and manageable. These new products over the last couple of years are true game changers.

[RonSwanson]

It's been raining in my area since last Thursday, but I couldn't stand it and got out to a covered range for a decent practice session to put this shaft through an initial testing.

 

About me: handicap stayed in the 2's all last season. I will verify all of this on trackman next week hopefully, but from what I remember the last time I was on one; swing speed is usually high 110's (in mid season), but is probably in the lower 110's right now. AOA is usually a couple degrees up, if I remember correctly path is 4-6* from the inside (on my bad swings I have a tendency to come too much from the inside and get stuck). My gamer is a tour issue 2016 M2 10.5 Kuro Kage XM 70 TX set to 1 click toward lower. This driver has been very good to me since I put it in play last season.

 

I started the session with some wedges and irons to get warmed up. I am definitely not in mid-season form, but I was hitting it decent. Moved on to my gamer to get a baseline. I was hitting it solid, but with the ball moving a little more left than what is normal for me. After about 10 shots, I switched in the Dual Core 70 TX in the same setting. As I said in my initial thoughts, it is a great looking shaft and really matches up with the current TaylorMade woods. After the first couple swings it was noticeable that the ball was coming out lower and with less spin that with the XM. Peak height was lower and it appeared the ball kind of dove down a tiny bit at the end of it's flight. It wasn't a knuckle ball, but there was a visible difference between the DC and the XM. I would attribute this to the shaft profile and tip stiffness of the DC vs. the XM. Also, the DC did not turn nearly as much as the XM on what I felt were very similar strikes. I figured this too could be due to the lower spin. I switched shafts back and forth every 5 shots for the next 10 for each shaft. The results were very consistent. I will say, there was not a much difference in feel between the two for me, they are both fantastic feeling shafts.. I think that really speaks to the DC's smoothness and playability since it is definitely a low/low profile.

 

After seeing the same results for a while, on the third round with the DC I made a switch to one click toward higher. Now that I think back on it, I seem to remember that being kind of the magic setting for several other members here with their M2 and after that third round this is the setting where the DC will stay. The launch "window" after the setting change was higher, the little dive was no longer noticeable and the ball flight/curvature (or lack there of) stayed the same. It really brought the shaft the life as the DC seemed to be too low launching and spinning in the 1 click lower setting that I have had success with in the XM. Another unexpected plus to this setting is that my original build of logo down at 1 click toward lower just happened to move both sets of graphics perfectly to each side of the shaft so there is no language or logos staring up at me. I'll add a photo tonight to illustrate.

 

I won't comment on distance yet because I think its impossible to tell on a range with no launch monitor of any kind. As I have said, I hope to have a lot of real data on these two shafts this week if everything works out. All in all, the DC felt familiar to me from playing the previous XT. It definitely showed it's low/low characteristics on the range in initial testing and I'm interested to see if that will still be the case once I get the hard numbers.

 

At this point in testing and it being January, I would probably stick with the XM as it's familiar and for some reason I felt like I had to work ever so slightly more to get the DC to perform at it's best. I think the DC could step into the gamer position once the weather warms and my swing is back to full force.

 

I will update as I get more info.

[wcbjr]

Anyone want to trade my TX for your S? Is that allowed? The TX is just too much for me. Nevermind if the rules don't allow.

[RonSwanson]

Unfortunately, it looks like my trackman session may be pushed to a little later date. I did get the DC out again for another test. I got very similar results from the first test. DC will launch and spin less than the XM good for good. The DC does seem to want to hold a straighter line than the XM. I still think this beast is a little much for me right now, but could be really good once things warm up and I'm more confident in my swing. Time will tell. I will update again when I have more info. If anyone has questions or would like a comparison to another shaft, let me know.

[gioguy21]

Unfortunately, it looks like my trackman session may be pushed to a little later date. I did get the DC out again for another test. I got very similar results from the first test. DC will launch and spin less than the XM good for good. The DC does seem to want to hold a straighter line than the XM. I still think this beast is a little much for me right now, but could be really good once things warm up and I'm more confident in my swing. Time will tell. I will update again when I have more info. If anyone has questions or would like a comparison to another shaft, let me know.

Ron - do you have access to the original KK XT? if so, I'd love a comparison between the DC, XT, and XM. ie spin, launch, etc. i know the DC and the XT should be similar, but wondering how those two feel compared to each other (knowing the XM will feel softer already).

[RonSwanson]

Unfortunately, it looks like my trackman session may be pushed to a little later date. I did get the DC out again for another test. I got very similar results from the first test. DC will launch and spin less than the XM good for good. The DC does seem to want to hold a straighter line than the XM. I still think this beast is a little much for me right now, but could be really good once things warm up and I'm more confident in my swing. Time will tell. I will update again when I have more info. If anyone has questions or would like a comparison to another shaft, let me know.

Ron - do you have access to the original KK XT? if so, I'd love a comparison between the DC, XT, and XM. ie spin, launch, etc. i know the DC and the XT should be similar, but wondering how those two feel compared to each other (knowing the XM will feel softer already).

 

I do not currently have one, but I have used the XT extensively. I think the location I will be using for the trackman test may have one. If so, I will add it to the test.

[pitchinwedge]

Super glad the Dual-Core is one of the stock offerings for the 2017 M1 and M2 drivers. Likely they will be readily available soon on fleabay and other sources and for a good price.

 

Edit: Yup, I see some already.. but what they're asking for is not so exciting.

[nwlim]

Hopefully there isn't an up charge for the TX flex!

[TollBros]

Hopefully there isn't an up charge for the TX flex!

 

There is no retail TX flex. That's the Tour only profile based on the XT. If it does ever come to retail it would be $400+.

[JStang]

Anyone want to trade my TX for your S? Is that allowed? The TX is just too much for me. Nevermind if the rules don't allow.

 

I tried sending you a PM but your inbox must be full?

[pitchinwedge]

Got a chance to hit another Dual-Core from the 2017 M1 fitting cart. Hate to say this, but it did not feel the same as the shaft I've been reviewing. The shaft was not smooth and did not have the same kick. Perhaps its because of the driver heads? Or maybe it's just in my head? Don't know if anyone can answer this (or if it's even cool to ask), but are these shaft really the same?

[gioguy21]

Got a chance to hit another Dual-Core from the 2017 M1 fitting cart. Hate to say this, but it did not feel the same as the shaft I've been reviewing. The shaft was not smooth and did not have the same kick. Perhaps its because of the driver heads? Or maybe it's just in my head? Don't know if anyone can answer this (or if it's even cool to ask), but are these shaft really the same?

pw -- is your shaft the same DC? ie is it an x or s? NOT a TX?

[pitchinwedge]

Got a chance to hit another Dual-Core from the 2017 M1 fitting cart. Hate to say this, but it did not feel the same as the shaft I've been reviewing. The shaft was not smooth and did not have the same kick. Perhaps its because of the driver heads? Or maybe it's just in my head? Don't know if anyone can answer this (or if it's even cool to ask), but are these shaft really the same?

pw -- is your shaft the same DC? ie is it an x or s? NOT a TX?

 

I have the Silver TiNi Dual-Core 60 stiff flex. No X or TX.

 

The shaft from the cart was the same. Just did not feel like it.

[JStang]

Got a chance to hit another Dual-Core from the 2017 M1 fitting cart. Hate to say this, but it did not feel the same as the shaft I've been reviewing. The shaft was not smooth and did not have the same kick. Perhaps its because of the driver heads? Or maybe it's just in my head? Don't know if anyone can answer this (or if it's even cool to ask), but are these shaft really the same?

pw -- is your shaft the same DC? ie is it an x or s? NOT a TX?

 

I have the Silver TiNi Dual-Core 60 stiff flex. No X or TX.

 

The shaft from the cart was the same. Just did not feel like it.

 

Did you have your tipped? It's known that TM tip trims their shafts so they will feel more stout.