Golf Course Superintendent Ready to Answer Any Questions You May Have

[mallrat]

Yep, same style island tee boxes. When built they are fine but ours have gone from ground level to 8-10” off the ground from 12 years of a pretty aggressive top dressing program. Now all the edges get burned up because they slope and get chewed up from people stepping on them and taking equipment (walking top dressers, walk mowers) on and off. Then add in the pain of spraying them and they take a LOT of work.

 

Edit... at 1 of our courses they are used for ascetics (sp?)

[sethdavidsdad]

BNGL what would case a sprinkler system to have constant blow outs. The pipes are old but only a little over 20 years. We are having blow outs every couple of days.

[BNGL]

BNGL what would case a sprinkler system to have constant blow outs. The pipes are old but only a little over 20 years. We are having blow outs every couple of days.

 

They’re old. That’s near the lifetime of a system. Gotta think about all the stress that’s place on it, all that water being moved and water hammers if air gets into the systems 20 years is a long time, especially if you have a lot of grit in your water (sand and/or salt). A lot of older installs are just bell ends with a gasket, then the fixes will be glued in or just knock ons with a gasket.

[mallrat]

Ours are 13 years old and we replace something every day. Heads, internals, quick couplers, you name it. None are blowing out but constant maintenance at this point. It’s also time for new satellites but that’s not happening.

[augustgolf]

Ours are 13 years old and we replace something every day. Heads, internals, quick couplers, you name it. None are blowing out but constant maintenance at this point. Its also time for new satellites but thats not happening.

Just wait til the mains start to go

[Schley]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

[mallrat]

Ours are 13 years old and we replace something every day. Heads, internals, quick couplers, you name it. None are blowing out but constant maintenance at this point. It’s also time for new satellites but that’s not happening.

Just wait til the mains start to go

 

We have a bigger issue, we might need a new pump. It’s gone out like 5 or 6 times this summer and was done for almost 2 weeks. Good thing is we can use the pump from the other course just takes a little longer and puts extra stress on it.

 

You guys want to see a freaked out super, watch them come in in the morning and see that only 5% of their water program ran overnight because the pump went out when it’s 100 degrees for the 5th day in a row.

[BNGL]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

 

Matty started that project after the 2016 event I think, when they had to stop play to pump and fix the bunkers after a heavy rain moved through. They had to do work on all the bunkers, except for two, those were lined with something called Polylast. It initially started out as a liner for horse trailers and kennels, because it lets water percolate and non slip. I am not sure who had the idea to put it in a bunker, but it works great. It allows the water to percolate at any point of contact, because it is porous, and it prevents contamination of the bunker sand so it stays the same color pretty much the whole time (obviously some contamination from the face or algae could occur, but nothing from underneath). It seems relatively easy to install, they come in big rolls and you just roll it out and cut it to fit, I would assume that there is an adhesive to keep the strips together. And it is just recycled rubber from tires so its environmentally friendly. I do not have it, but I have seen them and so far the reviews are extremely positive.

[BNGL]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

Ours are 13 years old and we replace something every day. Heads, internals, quick couplers, you name it. None are blowing out but constant maintenance at this point. It's also time for new satellites but that's not happening.

Just wait til the mains start to go

 

We have a bigger issue, we might need a new pump. It's gone out like 5 or 6 times this summer and was done for almost 2 weeks. Good thing is we can use the pump from the other course just takes a little longer and puts extra stress on it.

 

You guys want to see a freaked out super, watch them come in in the morning and see that only 5% of their water program ran overnight because the pump went out when it's 100 degrees for the 5th day in a row.

 

Been there, not fun at all. Replaced a pump, then a VFD maybe two week later. We stayed the night at the shop a couple nights to make sure that the pumps stayed on, that was a good time actually just talking shooting the breeze playing pool and ping pong in the break room. Scary part was walking to the pump station in the dark, down a little path that was known for mocassins and our irrigation pond was home to a 10 foot long alligator....creepy feeling taking the light over the pond and seeing these two yellow eyes seemingly staring right at you.

[ebrasmus21]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

Ours are 13 years old and we replace something every day. Heads, internals, quick couplers, you name it. None are blowing out but constant maintenance at this point. It's also time for new satellites but that's not happening.

Just wait til the mains start to go

 

We have a bigger issue, we might need a new pump. It's gone out like 5 or 6 times this summer and was done for almost 2 weeks. Good thing is we can use the pump from the other course just takes a little longer and puts extra stress on it.

 

You guys want to see a freaked out super, watch them come in in the morning and see that only 5% of their water program ran overnight because the pump went out when it's 100 degrees for the 5th day in a row.

 

Been there, not fun at all. Replaced a pump, then a VFD maybe two week later. We stayed the night at the shop a couple nights to make sure that the pumps stayed on, that was a good time actually just talking shooting the breeze playing pool and ping pong in the break room. Scary part was walking to the pump station in the dark, down a little path that was known for mocassins and our irrigation pond was home to a 10 foot long alligator....creepy feeling taking the light over the pond and seeing these two yellow eyes seemingly staring right at you.

 

BNGL - that shouldn't have scared you. That's called dinner.

 

"Gator, the other white meat."

 

"Water Moccasin, the other other white meat."

[augustgolf]

I've had gator...water moc...not yet

[mallrat]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

Ours are 13 years old and we replace something every day. Heads, internals, quick couplers, you name it. None are blowing out but constant maintenance at this point. It's also time for new satellites but that's not happening.

Just wait til the mains start to go

 

We have a bigger issue, we might need a new pump. It's gone out like 5 or 6 times this summer and was done for almost 2 weeks. Good thing is we can use the pump from the other course just takes a little longer and puts extra stress on it.

 

You guys want to see a freaked out super, watch them come in in the morning and see that only 5% of their water program ran overnight because the pump went out when it's 100 degrees for the 5th day in a row.

 

Been there, not fun at all. Replaced a pump, then a VFD maybe two week later. We stayed the night at the shop a couple nights to make sure that the pumps stayed on, that was a good time actually just talking shooting the breeze playing pool and ping pong in the break room. Scary part was walking to the pump station in the dark, down a little path that was known for mocassins and our irrigation pond was home to a 10 foot long alligator....creepy feeling taking the light over the pond and seeing these two yellow eyes seemingly staring right at you.

 

Snakes scare the poop out of me.

 

There is only 1 pump guy in the state of Oregon so pump issues can take a WHILE.

[Shilgy]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

 

Matty started that project after the 2016 event I think, when they had to stop play to pump and fix the bunkers after a heavy rain moved through. They had to do work on all the bunkers, except for two, those were lined with something called Polylast. It initially started out as a liner for horse trailers and kennels, because it lets water percolate and non slip. I am not sure who had the idea to put it in a bunker, but it works great. It allows the water to percolate at any point of contact, because it is porous, and it prevents contamination of the bunker sand so it stays the same color pretty much the whole time (obviously some contamination from the face or algae could occur, but nothing from underneath). It seems relatively easy to install, they come in big rolls and you just roll it out and cut it to fit, I would assume that there is an adhesive to keep the strips together. And it is just recycled rubber from tires so its environmentally friendly. I do not have it, but I have seen them and so far the reviews are extremely positive.

How does that product compare to capillary cement?

[BNGL]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

 

Matty started that project after the 2016 event I think, when they had to stop play to pump and fix the bunkers after a heavy rain moved through. They had to do work on all the bunkers, except for two, those were lined with something called Polylast. It initially started out as a liner for horse trailers and kennels, because it lets water percolate and non slip. I am not sure who had the idea to put it in a bunker, but it works great. It allows the water to percolate at any point of contact, because it is porous, and it prevents contamination of the bunker sand so it stays the same color pretty much the whole time (obviously some contamination from the face or algae could occur, but nothing from underneath). It seems relatively easy to install, they come in big rolls and you just roll it out and cut it to fit, I would assume that there is an adhesive to keep the strips together. And it is just recycled rubber from tires so its environmentally friendly. I do not have it, but I have seen them and so far the reviews are extremely positive.

How does that product compare to capillary cement?

 

Almost the exact same thing, I have the concrete bunkers (part of the last renovation) at my club right now. Only difference I can think of would be that polylast is made of recycled rubber and can be installed by your own crew, because it comes prefabricated all you need to do is unroll it and cut it, but again they do the same thing. Id think there would also be the benefit of ease when redoing bunkers down the road? I have yet to do a renovation of bunkers that have the concrete in it, with the polylast you can literally cut it out of a bunker or add more by cutting more and installing it.

[Shilgy]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

 

Matty started that project after the 2016 event I think, when they had to stop play to pump and fix the bunkers after a heavy rain moved through. They had to do work on all the bunkers, except for two, those were lined with something called Polylast. It initially started out as a liner for horse trailers and kennels, because it lets water percolate and non slip. I am not sure who had the idea to put it in a bunker, but it works great. It allows the water to percolate at any point of contact, because it is porous, and it prevents contamination of the bunker sand so it stays the same color pretty much the whole time (obviously some contamination from the face or algae could occur, but nothing from underneath). It seems relatively easy to install, they come in big rolls and you just roll it out and cut it to fit, I would assume that there is an adhesive to keep the strips together. And it is just recycled rubber from tires so its environmentally friendly. I do not have it, but I have seen them and so far the reviews are extremely positive.

How does that product compare to capillary cement?

 

Almost the exact same thing, I have the concrete bunkers (part of the last renovation) at my club right now. Only difference I can think of would be that polylast is made of recycled rubber and can be installed by your own crew, because it comes prefabricated all you need to do is unroll it and cut it, but again they do the same thing. Id think there would also be the benefit of ease when redoing bunkers down the road? I have yet to do a renovation of bunkers that have the concrete in it, with the polylast you can literally cut it out of a bunker or add more by cutting more and installing it.

Thank you. Is the polylast as effective at preventing bunker face washouts?

[Malvern]

BNGL,

 

Any experience using products that add oxygen and ozone to water. Reduces bacteria in the water and chemical use, improves turf growth and resilience.

 

https://www.nanobubble.com.au/

[BNGL]

Played Riviera this last Saturday and they are almost done with their Bunker renovation. They are installing the tire ground up mesh membrane with tar on the joints like merion cc. Early results are positive. Bngl what do you know about this new technology??

 

Matty started that project after the 2016 event I think, when they had to stop play to pump and fix the bunkers after a heavy rain moved through. They had to do work on all the bunkers, except for two, those were lined with something called Polylast. It initially started out as a liner for horse trailers and kennels, because it lets water percolate and non slip. I am not sure who had the idea to put it in a bunker, but it works great. It allows the water to percolate at any point of contact, because it is porous, and it prevents contamination of the bunker sand so it stays the same color pretty much the whole time (obviously some contamination from the face or algae could occur, but nothing from underneath). It seems relatively easy to install, they come in big rolls and you just roll it out and cut it to fit, I would assume that there is an adhesive to keep the strips together. And it is just recycled rubber from tires so its environmentally friendly. I do not have it, but I have seen them and so far the reviews are extremely positive.

How does that product compare to capillary cement?

 

Almost the exact same thing, I have the concrete bunkers (part of the last renovation) at my club right now. Only difference I can think of would be that polylast is made of recycled rubber and can be installed by your own crew, because it comes prefabricated all you need to do is unroll it and cut it, but again they do the same thing. Id think there would also be the benefit of ease when redoing bunkers down the road? I have yet to do a renovation of bunkers that have the concrete in it, with the polylast you can literally cut it out of a bunker or add more by cutting more and installing it.

Thank you. Is the polylast as effective at preventing bunker face washouts?

 

Supposedly yes. I know before starting their renovation of bunkers at Riviera, they had done two of their worst ones, and when the had the rains that halted play, all but two of their bunkers washed out. Those two were the ones that had polylast installed.

[BNGL]

BNGL,

 

Any experience using products that add oxygen and ozone to water. Reduces bacteria in the water and chemical use, improves turf growth and resilience.

 

https://www.nanobubble.com.au/

 

I have not heard of it being used on golf courses or sports turf, although it was only a matter of time, I did hear that it was being used for hydroponics and waste water applications. I can see where it would be useful in reducing chemical dependency, and some cultural practices (which would preserve conditions instead of poking holes etc), we can introduce oxygen to the profile chemically and physically. Putting it in the water is a good idea, it all comes down to cost though. If it is affordable, then it will be a necessity for golf courses and a boon for the industry, But if it is not than it will just be a luxury that only the best courses can afford.

 

Thanks for the link with the articles though, will check it out!

[howellhandmade]

http://whgcturf.blogspot.com/2018/

 

Thought I'd post this blog link here just because others interested in the subject are probably following this thread. I thought Wild Horse was amazing, and the turf especially so. The greens were like bristle dart boards -- full irons into greens that would have left craters back home made ball marks barely 1/3 of a ball in depth. The greens weren't super fast, but they were super smooth and dense. Most of the greens I play around Pittsburgh (and admittedly I don't play the gest ones) seem thin and fragile by comparison -- every footstep and ball mark shows in the veneer of grass. The fairways, too; many areas of many local courses are constantly on the verge of reverting to swamp, so you have to be careful not to hit too steeply or the ground will disintegrate under the ball like hitting out of pudding. The fairways at Wild Horse punish in the opposite way, if you are not assertive enough in a downward strike the turf will fight back.

 

http://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/gcnew/article/2007may54.pdf

 

http://feedtheball.com/2018/01/31/wild-horse-little-course-prairie/

 

I gather from reading that much of the difference is a matter of ideal prairie soil, sandy and fine, not too organic. I started reading with the question in mind of why all courses can't be like Wild Horse, and I gather that it's a matter of local conditions vs. expense. If you build a golf course on pudding you can put all the sand you want on top and you'll just get sandy pudding. No doubt it's possible to truck in enough sand to build a non-water-soluble course in western PA but I don't get to play those courses. I don't know if you care to comment, BNGL; I imagine that parts of FL face the same battle against sogginess and not all courses can afford to build an adequate foundation.

[BNGL]

http://whgcturf.blogspot.com/2018/

 

Thought I'd post this blog link here just because others interested in the subject are probably following this thread. I thought Wild Horse was amazing, and the turf especially so. The greens were like bristle dart boards -- full irons into greens that would have left craters back home made ball marks barely 1/3 of a ball in depth. The greens weren't super fast, but they were super smooth and dense. Most of the greens I play around Pittsburgh (and admittedly I don't play the gest ones) seem thin and fragile by comparison -- every footstep and ball mark shows in the veneer of grass. The fairways, too; many areas of many local courses are constantly on the verge of reverting to swamp, so you have to be careful not to hit too steeply or the ground will disintegrate under the ball like hitting out of pudding. The fairways at Wild Horse punish in the opposite way, if you are not assertive enough in a downward strike the turf will fight back.

 

http://archive.lib.m...e/2007may54.pdf

 

http://feedtheball.c...course-prairie/

 

I gather from reading that much of the difference is a matter of ideal prairie soil, sandy and fine, not too organic. I started reading with the question in mind of why all courses can't be like Wild Horse, and I gather that it's a matter of local conditions vs. expense. If you build a golf course on pudding you can put all the sand you want on top and you'll just get sandy pudding. No doubt it's possible to truck in enough sand to build a non-water-soluble course in western PA but I don't get to play those courses. I don't know if you care to comment, BNGL; I imagine that parts of FL face the same battle against sogginess and not all courses can afford to build an adequate foundation.

 

I will peruse those links at a later time, thank you for sharing.

 

Let me start by saying any superintendent worth their weight could maintain a golf course on the moon given the right budget and means (just look at Shadow Creek in Vegas lol). That is hyperbole obviously, but I think you get the point, its all budget just like everything else in life. That is one of the bigger challenges facing nearly every club, do more with less. I worked three clubs in Orlando (Kissimmee-Lake Beuna Vista to be exact), which is built on swamp, one course was capped with four inches of sand through out the property and it drained phenomenally well almost too well. The other didn't drain at all, and would be CPO for a few days after the rain. And the final club was endowed enough to make the investment in cultural programs, verticutting, aerifiying, and topdressing the fairways which helped the water percolate through the profile, but also provided a firm tight surface for the best players in the world every spring.

 

That tightness you're describing is more a result of cultural programs than height of cut. I know a club that maintains there greens at nearly an inch (Id have to reach out to him to verify but I think that was the height), but you bounce balls and run shots up to hole locations rather than fly them because the greens and surrounds are so firm.

 

You're totally correct, not every course can afford the foundation to be in tournament shape all the time. BUT that being said, not every club on TV does either, my place right now looks totally different in summer than it does when we hold our soft opening in 4 weeks time, and more different still when we really get cooking in November.

[BNGL]

http://whgcturf.blogspot.com/2018/

 

Thought I'd post this blog link here just because others interested in the subject are probably following this thread. I thought Wild Horse was amazing, and the turf especially so. The greens were like bristle dart boards -- full irons into greens that would have left craters back home made ball marks barely 1/3 of a ball in depth. The greens weren't super fast, but they were super smooth and dense. Most of the greens I play around Pittsburgh (and admittedly I don't play the gest ones) seem thin and fragile by comparison -- every footstep and ball mark shows in the veneer of grass. The fairways, too; many areas of many local courses are constantly on the verge of reverting to swamp, so you have to be careful not to hit too steeply or the ground will disintegrate under the ball like hitting out of pudding. The fairways at Wild Horse punish in the opposite way, if you are not assertive enough in a downward strike the turf will fight back.

 

http://archive.lib.m...e/2007may54.pdf

 

http://feedtheball.c...course-prairie/

 

I gather from reading that much of the difference is a matter of ideal prairie soil, sandy and fine, not too organic. I started reading with the question in mind of why all courses can't be like Wild Horse, and I gather that it's a matter of local conditions vs. expense. If you build a golf course on pudding you can put all the sand you want on top and you'll just get sandy pudding. No doubt it's possible to truck in enough sand to build a non-water-soluble course in western PA but I don't get to play those courses. I don't know if you care to comment, BNGL; I imagine that parts of FL face the same battle against sogginess and not all courses can afford to build an adequate foundation.

 

 

Everyone should read the last article howie hand made posted, granted i just read it quickly but one thing to key in on, the very best courses fit in naturally with the surrounding land. One of the things not a lot of supers realize, is that we are environmental stewards and it is our job to utilize science and research in the best ways possible that will provide a benefit to all. Someone once asked why he should be paying to support a municipal golf course when he does not play golf or derive any benefit from it. Well he is getting a benefit, golf courses are the best at providing habitat to wildlife, cooling the surrounding environment, filtering storm water runoff, protecting topsoil from erosion are just a few of the benefits, and a club that is built fitting the surrounds land only exemplifies those benefits.

[BNGL]

What's your opinion on houses built on the fairways edge? Florida resident myself and while my normal track doesn't have any housing lots, I have played on both public and semi-private courses with houses and fenced in back yards 10 paces away from the fairway.

 

Any negative effects from their yards trickle onto the course?

 

I think that I missed this question, so I beg your pardon.

 

Typically no there is not any problems coming from yards. I have houses bordering only two holes directly, and yes there is some encroachment of St. Augustine into the ground of the course, but we just edge it out and spray it. The biggest problem I have noticed is not so much related to turf, as it is the relationship between the course and the residents, and golfers going into their yards to find golf balls. Although there have been a few instances in the past where I was asked to not water the course because it was also watering their yard, or to adjust mowing schedules to a more normal hour. Those comments are heeded when possible, but for the most part my commitment is to the course and making sure that the guests of the course are accommodated. The residents bought a house on a course, be prepared to deal with some inconveniences.

[howellhandmade]

 

 

That tightness you're describing is more a result of cultural programs than height of cut. I know a club that maintains there greens at nearly an inch (Id have to reach out to him to verify but I think that was the height), but you bounce balls and run shots up to hole locations rather than fly them because the greens and surrounds are so firm.

 

You're totally correct, not every course can afford the foundation to be in tournament shape all the time. BUT that being said, not every club on TV does either, my place right now looks totally different in summer than it does when we hold our soft opening in 4 weeks time, and more different still when we really get cooking in November.

 

Yes, that's the impression exactly; hard to say just what the length was because it was like the face of a brush. Not only was it a wonderful playing surface, but it also seemed very healthy and resilient. With the low-angle morning sun on courses at home they often look like a rodeo happened after a few groups. At Wild Horse I could look back and you couldn't tell our group had been there. If that is the result of cultural programs I wish other courses would adopt them.

[mallrat]

Interesting take on the turf and what you guys are talking about and maybe BNGL can expand on this. I feel a lot of courses and people get caught up in mow height. Maybe I was lucky in that my 1st Super (who is viewed as a rising star in this neck of the woods) is a huge believer in healthy turf with a higher mow height will always play better than questionable practices with a closer mow. At that course the closest we ever mowed greens was .135 and the greens stayed around a 9.5 - 10 on the stimp. For a course that sees 62k+ rounds per year to stay smooth is pretty crazy.

[BNGL]

That tightness you're describing is more a result of cultural programs than height of cut. I know a club that maintains there greens at nearly an inch (Id have to reach out to him to verify but I think that was the height), but you bounce balls and run shots up to hole locations rather than fly them because the greens and surrounds are so firm.

 

You're totally correct, not every course can afford the foundation to be in tournament shape all the time. BUT that being said, not every club on TV does either, my place right now looks totally different in summer than it does when we hold our soft opening in 4 weeks time, and more different still when we really get cooking in November.

 

Yes, that's the impression exactly; hard to say just what the length was because it was like the face of a brush. Not only was it a wonderful playing surface, but it also seemed very healthy and resilient. With the low-angle morning sun on courses at home they often look like a rodeo happened after a few groups. At Wild Horse I could look back and you couldn't tell our group had been there. If that is the result of cultural programs I wish other courses would adopt them.

 

I would say that yes a majority of what you're seeing is a result of proper cultural practices. It costs money to do that though, and you'll lose money as well because golfers do not want to play on a recently aerified surface (just look up any thread on here about aerifications). So every day courses are put in a pickle of do I or don't I? They know the benefits long term, but short term is it worth it???

[BNGL]

Interesting take on the turf and what you guys are talking about and maybe BNGL can expand on this. I feel a lot of courses and people get caught up in mow height. Maybe I was lucky in that my 1st Super (who is viewed as a rising star in this neck of the woods) is a huge believer in healthy turf with a higher mow height will always play better than questionable practices with a closer mow. At that course the closest we ever mowed greens was .135 and the greens stayed around a 9.5 - 10 on the stimp. For a course that sees 62k+ rounds per year to stay smooth is pretty crazy.

 

Absolutely it is unfortunately a competition between the fastest and the firmest, part of it is just shear ego. For members it means something to be able to say, "our club is 14 feet 2 inches" even though they have no clue what that is like. When the PGA would come through we'd be cutting down as low as .080 in the weeks before the event, then I would slowly increase the heights cutting at .095 for the event proper. But even then there would not be anything other than a dust of grass in the buckets from greens. The reason? They're kept lean.

 

What does lean mean? Well the same way if I starve you for a week, you'll get thinner. If I hold back nutrients from the turf the leaf blade will get thinner thus reducing friction and contributing to fast green speeds. Another factor that will limit growth is the application of Plant Growth Regulators (PGR) like a product called Primo. What a PGR does is affect the reproduction of Gibrellic Acid (GA) which is the primary growth hormone in the plant (basically Primo prevents the elongation of the cells in the plant). Doing this slows down plant growth.

[howellhandmade]

 

I would say that yes a majority of what you're seeing is a result of proper cultural practices. It costs money to do that though, and you'll lose money as well because golfers do not want to play on a recently aerified surface (just look up any thread on here about aerifications). So every day courses are put in a pickle of do I or don't I? They know the benefits long term, but short term is it worth it???

 

According to the superintendent's blog they aerify the greens early and late, and try to leave them alone during the season. They were aerifying fairways when I played, and while it affected two holes, it was only two, and had no effect on my score. That's messed up if you lose more golfers by aerifying greens than you gain by having by having great ones. Granted, some aerification jobs are more of a hindrance than others, but most of the solid tine aerifications have no impact on play at all. At least, by my standards. It's not like I was going to break the course record anyway.

 

I'm sorry there's not more appreciation for the needs of the course, but I suppose when people drop trash and can't be bothered to fix divots or ball marks it shouldn't be a surprise.

[howellhandmade]

Interesting take on the turf and what you guys are talking about and maybe BNGL can expand on this. I feel a lot of courses and people get caught up in mow height. Maybe I was lucky in that my 1st Super (who is viewed as a rising star in this neck of the woods) is a huge believer in healthy turf with a higher mow height will always play better than questionable practices with a closer mow. At that course the closest we ever mowed greens was .135 and the greens stayed around a 9.5 - 10 on the stimp. For a course that sees 62k+ rounds per year to stay smooth is pretty crazy.

 

Absolutely it is unfortunately a competition between the fastest and the firmest, part of it is just shear ego. For members it means something to be able to say, "our club is 14 feet 2 inches" even though they have no clue what that is like. When the PGA would come through we'd be cutting down as low as .080 in the weeks before the event, then I would slowly increase the heights cutting at .095 for the event proper. But even then there would not be anything other than a dust of grass in the buckets from greens. The reason? They're kept lean.

 

 

I'm trying to find the height of the greens in the superintendent's blog. It seems to me that there's some room for interpretation in the terms "firm" and "fast." Wild Horse was firm like cork, I can't imagine anyone not finding them not firm enough. Everybody I've read or talked to who has played there seems to like them. And if a green is "fast" but the grass is like a coat of paint on the dirt and every ball mark and footstep raises a ding that makes your ball hop, what good is the speed? I loved putting on surfaces that were uniform and true. Grrrrrr, people.

[BNGL]

Interesting take on the turf and what you guys are talking about and maybe BNGL can expand on this. I feel a lot of courses and people get caught up in mow height. Maybe I was lucky in that my 1st Super (who is viewed as a rising star in this neck of the woods) is a huge believer in healthy turf with a higher mow height will always play better than questionable practices with a closer mow. At that course the closest we ever mowed greens was .135 and the greens stayed around a 9.5 - 10 on the stimp. For a course that sees 62k+ rounds per year to stay smooth is pretty crazy.

 

Absolutely it is unfortunately a competition between the fastest and the firmest, part of it is just shear ego. For members it means something to be able to say, "our club is 14 feet 2 inches" even though they have no clue what that is like. When the PGA would come through we'd be cutting down as low as .080 in the weeks before the event, then I would slowly increase the heights cutting at .095 for the event proper. But even then there would not be anything other than a dust of grass in the buckets from greens. The reason? They're kept lean.

 

 

I'm trying to find the height of the greens in the superintendent's blog. It seems to me that there's some room for interpretation in the terms "firm" and "fast." Wild Horse was firm like cork, I can't imagine anyone not finding them not firm enough. Everybody I've read or talked to who has played there seems to like them. And if a green is "fast" but the grass is like a coat of paint on the dirt and every ball mark and footstep raises a ding that makes your ball hop, what good is the speed? I loved putting on surfaces that were uniform and true. Grrrrrr, people.

 

Exactly. I slow greens are better than bare dirt. There is a tool to measure uniform firmness across greens and compare between clubs, although it is hardly ever used. The only times wed use it was prepping for tournaments.

 

My greens now are three seasons old, so there is not much organic built up because I do keep them lean. Couple that with using the right kind of sand that penetrates the canopy, but not the surface and rolling regularly I will rarely have ballmarks from our octogenarian membership. But because ANGC, and Cypress Point are the same way I gotta compete with that.

[BNGL]

What's your opinion on houses built on the fairways edge? Florida resident myself and while my normal track doesn't have any housing lots, I have played on both public and semi-private courses with houses and fenced in back yards 10 paces away from the fairway.

 

Any negative effects from their yards trickle onto the course?

 

I just remembered a funny story from Augusta National. A member was going through a particularly nasty divorce with his wife, Hord Hardin (chairman of the club then) offered up one of the cabins on property (yes there is cabins on property, wait a few years there is a good chance they'll add on to the property), he could stay as long as he needed. At first he declined but reluctantly moved in, thing was he had a dog. Initially it was all good, but eventually the dog droppings got to be a problem, and Hord knocked on the cabin door, the member answered and Hord gave him a broom and dustpan and said, "We spend enough money on fertilizers, we don't need your help!"