Golf Course Superintendent Ready to Answer Any Questions You May Have

[finleysg]

Does rolling greens stress them out? And is rolling with the greens mower really all the effective, vs using an actual rolling machine?

 

Our course keeps the greens pretty long (for my tastes), but on the rare occasion when they also roll them, putting is much more fun.

[BNGL]

Does rolling greens stress them out? And is rolling with the greens mower really all the effective, vs using an actual rolling machine?

 

Our course keeps the greens pretty long (for my tastes), but on the rare occasion when they also roll them, putting is much more fun.

 

It depends, but generally no. There are however certain situations where an unskilled operator can do some damage. We roll our greens nearly everyday in season, and hardly at all when we close for the summer, unless we have top dressed the greens. After the sand is dry, I will send out four rollers to help work the sand below the canopy. If the operator decelerates and accelerates to quickly you can see some scuffing and tearing of the leaf blade just from the abrasiveness of the sand.

 

I am more worried about mowing stressing the plant, than rolling. Rolling greens has many benefits, including reduction in turf stress, aiding in disease suppression (dollar spot, anthracnose, microdochium patch), and creating a smooth healthy surface. Rolling does a play a roll in green speeds, but there is so many other factors that I would address first before assuming that rolling will increase green speeds. Those include but are not limited to; height of cut, mowing frequency, fertility, soil moisture, use of growth regulators, verticutting, top dressing schedules. All of those play a more vital roll (pun intended!) in green speeds.

 

No they are not as effective, think about it. Where is most of the weight on a triplex greens mower distributed? On the tires, not the rollers. On a greens roller every ounce of weight is put onto those drums.

[duffer987]

Do you have a 'lab' so to speak at the course where you can try stuff out? In regards to different grasses, maintenance techniques, and the like?

Or is it a matter of using the practice green or maybe a corner of the range?

[BNGL]

Do you have a 'lab' so to speak at the course where you can try stuff out? In regards to different grasses, maintenance techniques, and the like?

Or is it a matter of using the practice green or maybe a corner of the range?

 

Uhm yes kind of, very rarely will I ever try anything that I do not know what will happen. There is a saying that we all learn, "Label is law" what that means is the labels on the fertilizers and chemicals will tell me everything that I need to know, the rates to put out the product, how and when to apply it, where to apply it, and what side effects may occur. So I know pretty much exactly what will happen if I put out a certain product and follow the proper application rates.

 

But absolutely if I am doing trials of products, I will try it out on my chipping green or better yet range target greens. Ill actually divide it into squares and setup little experiments with different products and observe the test plots to see if one product works better than any other.

[caniac6]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

[mallrat]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Has the mowing frequency changed?

[BNGL]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Yeah you will typically see that with the 4500D Groundsmasters, when I was in Orlando I had three of those and two Toro sidewinders, great pieces of equipment. They gave us much more maneuverability over the tractor driven pull gang. But you're right, clumping is a problem. It is often necessary to use a blower, one simple solution is to attach the blower to the mower with a trailer hitch. The other benefit is great mobility on slopes, the decks typically manage slopes a lot better than a reel does and it will always be spinning because the motor drives it hydraulically, where as the pull gang is driven off the motion of the wheels.

[BNGL]

Feel free to fire away with any questions or comments guys, up watching football and typically answer back quickly. remember no such thing as a dumb question...only dumb answers! haha

[finleysg]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Yeah you will typically see that with the 4500D Groundsmasters, when I was in Orlando I had three of those and two Toro sidewinders, great pieces of equipment. They gave us much more maneuverability over the tractor driven pull gang. But you're right, clumping is a problem. It is often necessary to use a blower, one simple solution is to attach the blower to the mower with a trailer hitch. The other benefit is great mobility on slopes, the decks typically manage slopes a lot better than a reel does and it will always be spinning because the motor drives it hydraulically, where as the pull gang is driven off the motion of the wheels.

 

I worked a grounds crew for a couple of summers (20+ yrs ago), and we had a 50's era Ford tractor that pulled a gang of cutting reels. My job, after I cut cups, was to jump on the tractor and cut the rough. I could only get 1/2 the course done in one reasonable shift, so in my four days a week schedule, I covered the course twice. The quality of the cut was really nice, and I got to be very good at getting close to trees and other obstacles without having to jump off the tractor and get my reels out of trouble.

 

The places where reels did poorly were the high-traffic areas where carts make the grass lay down.

[caniac6]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Yeah you will typically see that with the 4500D Groundsmasters, when I was in Orlando I had three of those and two Toro sidewinders, great pieces of equipment. They gave us much more maneuverability over the tractor driven pull gang. But you're right, clumping is a problem. It is often necessary to use a blower, one simple solution is to attach the blower to the mower with a trailer hitch. The other benefit is great mobility on slopes, the decks typically manage slopes a lot better than a reel does and it will always be spinning because the motor drives it hydraulically, where as the pull gang is driven off the motion of the wheels.

I have noticed the new mower is more agile than the old tractor, and it probably is a bit faster,but the quality of cut is not as good. Another problem is that I usually am the first guy on the course in the morning, and I don't find ball in the rough anymore because the new mower cuts them in half.

[sdandrea]

Thanks so much for the generous offer and this thread!

 

I wonder why some of my local courses in VA can't seem to maintain quality putting green conditions in the high heat months? Many courses in and around Fredericksburg, VA have some serious issues every August, while others don't.

[BNGL]

Thanks so much for the generous offer and this thread!

 

I wonder why some of my local courses in VA can't seem to maintain quality putting green conditions in the high heat months? Many courses in and around Fredericksburg, VA have some serious issues every August, while others don't.

 

I would imagine courses in this area a majority bent grass putting greens? Bent grass does not handle heat...bent grass just simply cannot grow in the hot humid summers of the southern and mid atlantic regions. You need a dedicated crew to stay on top of it constantly, and 95% of the time that is the difference. One club has a crew that has the necessary budget to sustain the intensive labor necessary to keep the turf alive.

[BNGL]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Yeah you will typically see that with the 4500D Groundsmasters, when I was in Orlando I had three of those and two Toro sidewinders, great pieces of equipment. They gave us much more maneuverability over the tractor driven pull gang. But you're right, clumping is a problem. It is often necessary to use a blower, one simple solution is to attach the blower to the mower with a trailer hitch. The other benefit is great mobility on slopes, the decks typically manage slopes a lot better than a reel does and it will always be spinning because the motor drives it hydraulically, where as the pull gang is driven off the motion of the wheels.

I have noticed the new mower is more agile than the old tractor, and it probably is a bit faster,but the quality of cut is not as good. Another problem is that I usually am the first guy on the course in the morning, and I don't find ball in the rough anymore because the new mower cuts them in half.

 

It is definitely faster and cheaper in the long run. Reel mowers require a lot of maintenance to cut properly. Rotary mowers you just sharpen and go. A reel mower is slightly more complicated...

 

A reel mower cuts with a pinching action, very much like a pair of shears. You have the reel which is typically 9 or 11 bladed that rotates and pinches the leaf blade against something called a bed knife. What this strip of metal does is raise the grass up so that it can be cut. Now depending on what you are trying to do, you can manipulate the angle of the bed knife to get a different cut (too much front angle will scalp; not enough and you won't cut anything it'll just scuff the surface...might have that backwards I usually just let the mechanics deal with it). There has to be a little contact as well, not so much the reel screams when in operation, or worse not even turn, but just enough to create that pinching action at the bottom. To get a good cut, you need a sharp blade, and sharp bed knife (there are even different types of bed knifes). All of that knowledge and maintenance takes time and labor to do and if theres cheaper options out there that still provide a serviceable cut, courses would be remiss to not take advantage.

[augustgolf]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Yeah you will typically see that with the 4500D Groundsmasters, when I was in Orlando I had three of those and two Toro sidewinders, great pieces of equipment. They gave us much more maneuverability over the tractor driven pull gang. But you're right, clumping is a problem. It is often necessary to use a blower, one simple solution is to attach the blower to the mower with a trailer hitch. The other benefit is great mobility on slopes, the decks typically manage slopes a lot better than a reel does and it will always be spinning because the motor drives it hydraulically, where as the pull gang is driven off the motion of the wheels.

I have noticed the new mower is more agile than the old tractor, and it probably is a bit faster,but the quality of cut is not as good. Another problem is that I usually am the first guy on the course in the morning, and I don't find ball in the rough anymore because the new mower cuts them in half.

And shoots 'em out like Nolan Ryan

[spud3]

My home course has put in a lot of great work in drainage for fairways (we're in the rainy PNW), but the bunkers have always been problematic.

 

They just announced a major initiative to rebuild the bunkers. I spoke with the head pro today and he said they are going to be implementing a liner that is essentially a layer of dead grass between the sand and the drainage layer.

 

Is that a good solution for keeping bunkers playable over the wet winters?

 

Thanks again for taking the time to answer all these questions. This thread has been fascinating!

[BNGL]

My home course has put in a lot of great work in drainage for fairways (we're in the rainy PNW), but the bunkers have always been problematic.

 

They just announced a major initiative to rebuild the bunkers. I spoke with the head pro today and he said they are going to be implementing a liner that is essentially a layer of dead grass between the sand and the drainage layer.

 

Is that a good solution for keeping bunkers playable over the wet winters?

 

Thanks again for taking the time to answer all these questions. This thread has been fascinating!

 

Hmm that is interesting, I have not heard of that. I do some research and get back to you.

 

In the meantime, there are some better alternatives I would advise. Polylast liners are great, as are the concrete lined bunkers.

[mallrat]

My home course has put in a lot of great work in drainage for fairways (we're in the rainy PNW), but the bunkers have always been problematic.

 

They just announced a major initiative to rebuild the bunkers. I spoke with the head pro today and he said they are going to be implementing a liner that is essentially a layer of dead grass between the sand and the drainage layer.

 

Is that a good solution for keeping bunkers playable over the wet winters?

 

Thanks again for taking the time to answer all these questions. This thread has been fascinating!

 

I’ll call him tomorrow and ask what they are doing. Heck i’ll probably take a few days this winter and go help him out. He’s been fighting for this for awhile. Imagine all the bunkers on 2 and most likely 3 will be 1st priority along with the green side on 14.

[spud3]

The email they sent to the members said they would start with the four most "used" bunkers (3, 5, 6, and 17). He mentioned they are considering filling in some of the least used (read: don't come into play very often or are overly penal) as well.

[ljrad1995]

Aussie question here. Most of the courses around me use bent grass greens, but I've noticed recently (just finishing up winter down here) that a lot of courses have significant poa invasions on the greens. Would you consider this a problem? If so, whats a decent solution to get rid of the poa?

[burnsniper]

What is the purpose of the tractor with the giant fan looking thing I see driving around on the fairways some mornings?

[caniac6]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

 

Has the mowing frequency changed?

No

[Destroyer]

What is the purpose of the tractor with the giant fan looking thing I see driving around on the fairways some mornings?

 

to blow the clumps of grass after they cut it. it is one of the jobs i do when i work. you can solve the worlds problems when your doing it!

[Destroyer]

let me also say we use it to blow the dew off the fairways in the morning as well. not much but sometimes.

[TheRatt87]

in the last year my course has changed rough mowers, and I don't like the change. We used to use a gang mower pulled by a tractor, and have switched to a Toro mower that looks like a fairway mower, but has multiple rotary decks like a groundsmaster. The result is big clumps of grass, and the rough looks like a hayfield. There were clippings with the old mower, but it looked a lot cleaner after mowing. Our crew is very understaffed, so they really don't have enough people to have a blower follow the mower. I really don't understand the need to switch equipment. The old way, one man on one piece of equipment could do a decent job, now it takes two guys on two pieces of equipment to do a decent job. Not really a question, just an observation.

Has the mowing frequency changed?

No

 

The Groundsmaster rotary deck mower will typically have a better quality of cut compared to a tow-behind reel gang mower, due to some of the nuances with reels that BNGL mentions. My speculation is that the clumping you are seeing is due to a) the Groundsmaster rotary deck mower is actually effectively cutting more of the grass compared to the gang mower, and/or b) the Groundsmaster is set at a lower effective height of cut. In either instance, the Groundsmaster is cutitng more grass so you have more clippings & potential for more clumping.

[BNGL]

Aussie question here. Most of the courses around me use bent grass greens, but I've noticed recently (just finishing up winter down here) that a lot of courses have significant poa invasions on the greens. Would you consider this a problem? If so, whats a decent solution to get rid of the poa?

 

It is up to the individual courses, personally yes I would because if I had an established surface and poa was encroaching I would do everything I could to get rid of it, unless I knew I was transitioning to poa greens, which are perfectly fine putting surfaces. One thing a lot of people don't know or realize is that a weed is merely an undesirable plant in an area of cultivated plants. So that could be a rose bush in the middle of your yard.

 

There are two ways to treat it, pre or post emergent. Is either one better? up to the course, is either significantly cheaper? Depends on how bad the weed pressure is. Pre emergents stop the plant before it germinates, so products such as oxidiazon, prodiamine, indiziflam etc. The trick with these is they stop all germination, so if you want to reseed damaged areas or overseed the area the seed simply won't pop. Post emergence is typically done through a spray, just like you'd do at home. Mix the product into a spray tank and go hunt the weeds spraying each individual one. Make sure to get a non selective herbicide though, one that won't kill everything only the undesired plants, halusulfuron or 2-4D are good ones. At least for control in warm season grasses.

 

Don't ask me to remember the trade names....although just for grins I will try to remember.

 

Oxidiazon-Ronstar

Prodiamine-Barricade

Indiziflam-Specticle

 

Halusulfuron-sedgehammer

2-4D-Speedzone

 

Not counting spelling I think that is 4/5

[mallrat]

T-Zone :)

 

We use 3 of the 4 above but we have found a special treatment for Poa as there are none approved in the US currently; per my understanding. Also I believe you want to be very light on Barricade when spraying it on turf.

[mallrat]

If I remember correctly we use Trimmit (?) to control Poa, which is not what’s is designed for but if you spray it often it seems to regulate if not kill the Poa

[Shilgy]

My home course has put in a lot of great work in drainage for fairways (we're in the rainy PNW), but the bunkers have always been problematic.

 

They just announced a major initiative to rebuild the bunkers. I spoke with the head pro today and he said they are going to be implementing a liner that is essentially a layer of dead grass between the sand and the drainage layer.

 

Is that a good solution for keeping bunkers playable over the wet winters?

 

Thanks again for taking the time to answer all these questions. This thread has been fascinating!

 

Hmm that is interesting, I have not heard of that. I do some research and get back to you.

 

In the meantime, there are some better alternatives I would advise. Polylast liners are great, as are the concrete lined bunkers.

Funny that came up. I had just asked you about bunkers the other day and you mentioned the polylast. When I asked our super about it he was unaware. Which was surprising as they are here in town. But he mentioned to me the sodded based bunkers as well working at a sister course. Sounds like you grow the grass in good and then Roundup it. Once dead it's a very good liner for bunkers. Note, think I have that correct.

[spud3]

My home course has put in a lot of great work in drainage for fairways (we're in the rainy PNW), but the bunkers have always been problematic.

 

They just announced a major initiative to rebuild the bunkers. I spoke with the head pro today and he said they are going to be implementing a liner that is essentially a layer of dead grass between the sand and the drainage layer.

 

Is that a good solution for keeping bunkers playable over the wet winters?

 

Thanks again for taking the time to answer all these questions. This thread has been fascinating!

 

Hmm that is interesting, I have not heard of that. I do some research and get back to you.

 

In the meantime, there are some better alternatives I would advise. Polylast liners are great, as are the concrete lined bunkers.

Funny that came up. I had just asked you about bunkers the other day and you mentioned the polylast. When I asked our super about it he was unaware. Which was surprising as they are here in town. But he mentioned to me the sodded based bunkers as well working at a sister course. Sounds like you grow the grass in good and then Roundup it. Once dead it's a very good liner for bunkers. Note, think I have that correct.

 

That's how it was explained to me by our pro.

 

Given the amount of rain we get here, we need an industrial-strength solution. Hope it works, as the bunkers are really the only complaint I have about our course.

 

They are also discussing filling in several that are not really in play and just suck up the maintenance budget.

[ljrad1995]

Aussie question here. Most of the courses around me use bent grass greens, but I've noticed recently (just finishing up winter down here) that a lot of courses have significant poa invasions on the greens. Would you consider this a problem? If so, whats a decent solution to get rid of the poa?

 

It is up to the individual courses, personally yes I would because if I had an established surface and poa was encroaching I would do everything I could to get rid of it, unless I knew I was transitioning to poa greens, which are perfectly fine putting surfaces. One thing a lot of people don't know or realize is that a weed is merely an undesirable plant in an area of cultivated plants. So that could be a rose bush in the middle of your yard.

 

There are two ways to treat it, pre or post emergent. Is either one better? up to the course, is either significantly cheaper? Depends on how bad the weed pressure is. Pre emergents stop the plant before it germinates, so products such as oxidiazon, prodiamine, indiziflam etc. The trick with these is they stop all germination, so if you want to reseed damaged areas or overseed the area the seed simply won't pop. Post emergence is typically done through a spray, just like you'd do at home. Mix the product into a spray tank and go hunt the weeds spraying each individual one. Make sure to get a non selective herbicide though, one that won't kill everything only the undesired plants, halusulfuron or 2-4D are good ones. At least for control in warm season grasses.

 

Don't ask me to remember the trade names....although just for grins I will try to remember.

 

Oxidiazon-Ronstar

Prodiamine-Barricade

Indiziflam-Specticle

 

Halusulfuron-sedgehammer

2-4D-Speedzone

 

Not counting spelling I think that is 4/5

 

Wow, that was an impressive recollection of spraying chemicals... Great information, really appreciate it.

One other question (These are probably very dumb questions) my home course is a couch based course (bent greens) and so for the majority of the year plays fantastically (firm/fast and brown is beautiful are all well known around here) but we have issues with a couple of tee boxes that get not enough light exposure to hold up to heavy traffic in these times. Negating the possibility of tree removal (the expense and neighbouring houses make this unlikely) have you ever had much success with oversowing certain teeing areas with a different grass? I think our super was thinking of a bent grass oversow of these tees so that during winter they would present better, then in summer the couch would take over again as the bent died off in the heat...