Questions stemming from Ricky Fowler on 11

[Noles]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

[Seamus_McDuff]

I think Beem is wrong.

 

 

What Fowler could have done is place a marker where the second drop struck the ground. . He then could have gone up to survey the shot and only placed the ball right before he was ready to hit.

 

 

[enfuego]

I was wondering the same thing on the second shot... Why place the ball and then go look at the shot. With what happened with the first ball he should have dropped the second and hit it right away

[Shilgy]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

[LeoLeo99]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

Did this rule change recently or was it always this?

[finleysg]

My thought during that hole was, why can't professional golf announcers take the time so they can explain a situation like that to their audience?

 

Take the time to learn the rules of the game, that is.

[rogolf]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

Did this rule change recently or was it always this?

That's the Rule in 2019. Out with the old, in with the new.

[KevCarter]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

Did this rule change recently or was it always this?

That's the Rule in 2019. Out with the old, in with the new.

 

ROGOLF, looking for a little help on the ball being in play even if you leave a mark there after replacing. This is one I always needed to show my members in the old decisions book or they wouldn't believe it. I can't seem to find it in the interpretations? A lot of relearning to do...

[rogolf]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

Did this rule change recently or was it always this?

That's the Rule in 2019. Out with the old, in with the new.

 

ROGOLF, looking for a little help on the ball being in play even if you leave a mark there after replacing. This is one I always needed to show my members in the old decisions book or they wouldn't believe it. I can't seem to find it in the interpretations? A lot of relearning to do...

See Rule 14.4, ball is in play when replaced. It doesn't say anything about the marker, but see 14.1a, which says the marker must be removed before the stroke or there is a penalty.

[KevCarter]

 

ROGOLF, looking for a little help on the ball being in play even if you leave a mark there after replacing. This is one I always needed to show my members in the old decisions book or they wouldn't believe it. I can't seem to find it in the interpretations? A lot of relearning to do...

See Rule 14.4, ball is in play when replaced. It doesn't say anything about the marker, but see 14.1a, which says the marker must be removed before the stroke or there is a penalty.

 

Thank You

[antip]

ROGOLF, looking for a little help on the ball being in play even if you leave a mark there after replacing. This is one I always needed to show my members in the old decisions book or they wouldn't believe it. I can't seem to find it in the interpretations? A lot of relearning to do...

See Rule 14.4, ball is in play when replaced. It doesn't say anything about the marker, but see 14.1a, which says the marker must be removed before the stroke or there is a penalty.

Last para of 14.4 helps: A replaced ball is in play even if the ball-marker marking its spot has not been removed. The old decision has been embedded in the new rule.

[rogolf]

ROGOLF, looking for a little help on the ball being in play even if you leave a mark there after replacing. This is one I always needed to show my members in the old decisions book or they wouldn't believe it. I can't seem to find it in the interpretations? A lot of relearning to do...

See Rule 14.4, ball is in play when replaced. It doesn't say anything about the marker, but see 14.1a, which says the marker must be removed before the stroke or there is a penalty.

Last para of 14.4 helps: A replaced ball is in play even if the ball-marker marking its spot has not been removed. The old decision has been embedded in the new rule.

Thanks, didn't read that far, but knew what it would be.

[Mr. Bean]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

The ball is replaced regardless of the influence that moved it.

[antip]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

The ball is replaced regardless of the influence that moved it.

Yes. But you can almost always come up with an abnormal scenario...

 

You've marked your ball on the green and are about to replace and guy from the next tee wanders back apologising saying he had moved your ball exactly one putter length further away on the direct line to the pin because it was interfering with his play and he forgot to replace it. He lays his putter down just in front of your marker and moves it to the new position one putter length closer. In this weird situation, no need to replace where you lifted it from.

[KevCarter]

ROGOLF, looking for a little help on the ball being in play even if you leave a mark there after replacing. This is one I always needed to show my members in the old decisions book or they wouldn't believe it. I can't seem to find it in the interpretations? A lot of relearning to do...

See Rule 14.4, ball is in play when replaced. It doesn't say anything about the marker, but see 14.1a, which says the marker must be removed before the stroke or there is a penalty.

Last para of 14.4 helps: A replaced ball is in play even if the ball-marker marking its spot has not been removed. The old decision has been embedded in the new rule.

 

That's what I needed. Thank You!

[Shilgy]

Rich Beem suggested that if Ricky Fowler had left the tees he used to take relief in place after he placed his ball then he would have been able to replace his ball and not have incurred another penalty stroke. I don't think that is true. Even if the marks (tees) are left in place, once the ball is placed and is at rest, it is in play. Am I correct or is Rich Beem.

 

This brings up another scenario. A player's ball is on the green. He marks and lifts the ball. He then replaces the ball but leaves the mark while reading his putt. His ball rolls to a different spot. Does he replace it to the original spot or play from the new spot?

On the green one the ball is marked and replaced it would need to be put back if the wind moved it.

 

The ball is replaced regardless of the influence that moved it.

I realize that, using wind as an example, but thank you.

[getitdaily]

I was wondering the same thing on the second shot... Why place the ball and then go look at the shot. With what happened with the first ball he should have dropped the second and hit it right away

 

Rickie didn't have the same view of what happened to the first shot that us TV viewers did.

 

The scenario yesterday is an unintended consequence of a rule change that needs to be rescinded. The rule is stupid. Why was "replace your ball if it moves" too difficult?

[The General]

The rule should be amended and say that if your ball moves once in play, by the wind or earthquake or tsunami or whatever, you have the OPTION to replace to original location, no closer or play it where it eventually lies.

 

 

But since they won't fix the dumbest rule in all of sports: a ball in a divot in the fairway - hardly doubt they'll fix a ball moving from "at rest" anytime soon,

[Noles]

I was wondering the same thing on the second shot... Why place the ball and then go look at the shot. With what happened with the first ball he should have dropped the second and hit it right away

 

Rickie didn't have the same view of what happened to the first shot that us TV viewers did.

 

The scenario yesterday is an unintended consequence of a rule change that needs to be rescinded. The rule is stupid. Why was "replace your ball if it moves" too difficult?

I think he meant the second time he placed the ball, which was the 3rd ball used on that hole. He placed it and again went up to the green to look at the shot. Risking the ball rolling back in again.

 

What was the rule change that needs to be rescinded? I'm confused.

[TerpFangolfer]

My thought during that hole was, why can't professional golf announcers take the time so they can explain a situation like that to their audience?

 

Take the time to learn the rules of the game, that is.

 

Agree with this...when Roger said "it's like he hit it in the hazard again", I was like WTF. He thinks the ball rolling in counts as a stroke, plus the penalty to take it back out?

And I think Slugger was confused that he was saying that, bcuz he initially agreed with him...

 

So Roger thought he was on the green in 7, instead of 6...crazy

[QEight]

The rule should be amended and say that if your ball moves once in play, by the wind or earthquake or tsunami or whatever, you have the OPTION to replace to original location, no closer or play it where it eventually lies.

 

Ball is in play about 100% of the time during one hole, unless you pick it up. So after a shot if it rolls down the hill into pond and I have seen it stop, I can move it back to top?

[getitdaily]

I was wondering the same thing on the second shot... Why place the ball and then go look at the shot. With what happened with the first ball he should have dropped the second and hit it right away

 

Rickie didn't have the same view of what happened to the first shot that us TV viewers did.

 

The scenario yesterday is an unintended consequence of a rule change that needs to be rescinded. The rule is stupid. Why was "replace your ball if it moves" too difficult?

I think he meant the second time he placed the ball, which was the 3rd ball used on that hole. He placed it and again went up to the green to look at the shot. Risking the ball rolling back in again.

 

What was the rule change that needs to be rescinded? I'm confused.

 

Wasn't the old rule that a ball at rest, moved, was replaced without penalty regardless of why it moved, unless the player moved it?

[Sawgrass]

I was wondering the same thing on the second shot... Why place the ball and then go look at the shot. With what happened with the first ball he should have dropped the second and hit it right away

 

Rickie didn't have the same view of what happened to the first shot that us TV viewers did.

 

The scenario yesterday is an unintended consequence of a rule change that needs to be rescinded. The rule is stupid. Why was "replace your ball if it moves" too difficult?

I am very curious to learn which rule changed to impact this situation.

[jmkenn0]

The rule should be amended and say that if your ball moves once in play, by the wind or earthquake or tsunami or whatever, you have the OPTION to replace to original location, no closer or play it where it eventually lies.

 

Ball is in play about 100% of the time during one hole, unless you pick it up. So after a shot if it rolls down the hill into pond and I have seen it stop, I can move it back to top?

 

yep that's exactly why the rule is different from the green to everywhere else - unless you want to have 20 minute arguments every round about whether a ball "stopped" momentarily before rolling in the hazard.

 

Now, if you want to caveat the rule to say after taking a penalty stroke and placing the ball, but before playing, that would be somewhat reasonable.

[rogolf]

This isn't the first time that a placed ball was at rest but then rolled back into the "hazard" while the player was surveying his next stroke. It happened to Thomas Levey on the European Tour several years ago. Same procedure and same result - an additional one stroke penalty. Nothing changed on January 1, 2019.

[f22beaver]

unless you want to have 20 minute arguments every round about whether a ball "stopped" momentarily before rolling in the hazard.

 

Thank you for this statement. I have now received total consciousness about why he received the penalty. I kept viewing it only as after the drop, but obviously that's ridiculous now that you've stated it as you did.

[finleysg]

Isn't the only change related to what happens on the green? Or am I mistaken?

 

A few years ago at Augusta, Billy Horschel was on the green, surveying his putt, when the wind blew the ball into a hazard. He had to play from there.

 

What I don't recall is if he had marked his ball. If you mark your ball on the green under the current rules, you are "entitled" to that spot.

[deadsolid...shank]

Isn't the only change related to what happens on the green? Or am I mistaken?

 

A few years ago at Augusta, Billy Horschel was on the green, surveying his putt, when the wind blew the ball into a hazard. He had to play from there.

 

What I don't recall is if he had marked his ball. If you mark your ball on the green under the current rules, you are "entitled" to that spot.

 

If the ball rolls into a more favorable position (or even into the cup) then it has to replaced also?

[TerpFangolfer]

Yes, the exception to 9.3 states that the ball MUST be replaced - if it moves after marking & replacing....you don't get to choose whether you like the new spot better

[Sawgrass]

Yes, the exception to 9.3 states that the ball MUST be replaced - if it moves after marking & replacing....you don't get to choose whether you like the new spot better

If you're on the green and your ball is resting in a position from which natural forces may move it to a more favorable position, delay marking it if you can. If you're on the green and your ball is resting in a position from which natural forces may move it to a less favorable position, mark it as soon as you can.

 

But for heaven's sake, if you've just gingerly placed your ball up-hill from a penalty area after having had to drop twice, don't go around picking up your location-marking tees to neaten things up before you strike it, don't go up to look at the green after placing it in such a precarious position, and don't eat a hot dog while contemplating your next move. Go hit the freakin' ball!