So, Callaway Apex 19 irons

[klbcec]

Was looking at the specs on those. Looks like the pw loft is 43°. My mp4 9-iron has a loft of 43 degrees as well.

Wouldn't be surprised if those irons are a full club longer than my MP4s.

Thoughts?

[CROUSE99]

I wish mfgs would just print the loft on an iron, instead of traditional numbers. Of course, then they couldn't say their new irons are their longest ever. The 43 degree Callaway should go the same distance as your 43 degree Mizuno (when fitted with the same shaft). The fact that one is stamped PW and one is stamped 9 is immaterial. Just one old man's opinion.

[JohnKHawk]

Another thread lamenting the whole loft difference between iron sets. This debate has been done over & over & over....

[CaseyDan]

I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

 

Another Home run for the Apex line.

 

As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

 

[Tree Levino]

> @CaseyDan said:

> I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

>

> Another Home run for the Apex line.

>

> As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

>

 

Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went XXX distance". Many buy into the illusion.

[kauffee]

I play 4-AW in my Apex 19 and I have to say I also really like the AW... more than most gap wedges I’ve had. The Apex are more than a full club longer than my previous set of Mizuno MP57, but I’m sure a lot of that is the lofts are a full club stronger. However on Trackman against other clubs with the same lofts I was getting more ballspeed off the Apex too. 1-2 mph more than the P790 and 3 mph more than the PXG gen 2.

[boggyman]

Played two rounds with mine and dumped them. First round was good, second one round was not so good. Second round was hit or miss. One shot I’d be long, next shot, same distance, same club, I’d be short. Found out quickly they weren’t for my liking. Had a great feel to them, yes, they’re a tad strong lofted, but, no more so than anything else comparable in this category of irons. And after two rounds, the finish was already showing some wear. The forging seems really soft. Loft for loft, they’re as good as anything probably after an adjustment period, but I’m back to my ole reliable Staff Progressives and FG17s. I like the old school lofts much better for some reason.

[Sparky14]

> @JohnKHawk said:

> Another thread lamenting the whole loft difference between iron sets. This debate has been done over & over & over....

And yet there are already a couple of 42* PWs on the market this year.

I predict loft creep will have to move onto wedges soon. Soon, we will see wedges of 50* loft with "56*" stamped on the sole and 36.5" length. The longest 56* wedge ever!

[CaseyDan]

> @balls_deep said:

> > @CaseyDan said:

> > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> >

> > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> >

> > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> >

>

> Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

 

Illusion? It’s a golf club that goes the distance that I want it to go. I don’t care if there’s a letter P, a letter A, or a picture of zebra on the bottom. All I care about is that it goes the distance I want it too.

 

No false idea or belief here.

 

 

 

[edgerat]

I’ll do you one better. I had a set of P790 for a hot second, they have such strong lofts I couldn’t hit them. I would pull 7i and be looking down at a normal 6i loft expecting a 6i swing and feel and it all went to hell real quick. I’m not saying I play OG lofts like a 38deg 7i (although I do have a minty set of Spalding from 1978 lofted this way) but I am used to looking at a 34deg 7i, not 30 or stronger.

[DaveMac]

Yet another thread on modern strong lofts. Certainly the Apex CF 19 will out distance Mizuno MP4, it’s designed to, it’s a completely different iron targeted at a very different golfer.

 

Remember what matters is the ball flight, this is part loft and part head design. If the Apex had traditional lofts, the peak height would be too high for a lot of golfers. Many golfers don’t deliver the club in an efficient manner at impact (insufficient forward shaft lean), the stronger lofts help improve ball speed, while the low cg helps maintain peak height, so helping maximise distance for this type of golfer.

 

Perhaps we should go back to naming irons (Mid Mashie, Mashie, Spade Mashie, Mashie Niblick, Pitching Niblick, Niblick) to stop us bickering about the loft number on the club.

 

As CasyDan said above all that matters is the iron consistently flys the distance you expect.

[braincramp52]

> @JohnKHawk said:

> Another thread lamenting the whole loft difference between iron sets. This debate has been done over & over & over....

 

If they didn't allow threads that had been posted before there would be no more golf forum or any other type of forum.

[Tree Levino]

> @CaseyDan said:

> > @balls_deep said:

> > > @CaseyDan said:

> > > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> > >

> > > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> > >

> > > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> > >

> >

> > Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

>

> Illusion? It’s a golf club that goes the distance that I want it to go. I don’t care if there’s a letter P, a letter A, or a picture of zebra on the bottom. All I care about is that it goes the distance I want it too.

>

> No false idea or belief here.

>

>

>

 

 

When I posted that I thought you might get like that. It's always hard to tell tone on forums. Many people practice a lot with 7i and PW at the range (pretty much always the most used clubs in sets for sale) so many feel most comfortable hitting those clubs. Your AW is a traditional pitching wedge and you obviously know which clubs are going which distance so it's fine. The illusion is when people say "I used to hit my PW 120 and now I hit it 135". Well.. you're not you're hitting the same loft the same distance you always have.

[klbcec]

> @CROUSE99 said:

> I wish mfgs would just print the loft on an iron, instead of traditional numbers. Of course, then they couldn't say their new irons are their longest ever. The 43 degree Callaway should go the same distance as your 43 degree Mizuno (when fitted with the same shaft). The fact that one is stamped PW and one is stamped 9 is immaterial. Just one old man's opinion.

 

Every club in the bag has loft on it except iron sets...

[JDCON]

I thought the new Ben Hogan company was printing lofts on the irons...but I just checked and it would seem their new models no longer do that.

[GolfChannel]

> @JohnKHawk said:

> Another thread lamenting the whole loft difference between iron sets. This debate has been done over & over & over....

 

 

 

[CaseyDan]

> @balls_deep said:

> > @CaseyDan said:

> > > @balls_deep said:

> > > > @CaseyDan said:

> > > > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> > > >

> > > > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> > > >

> > > > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

> >

> > Illusion? It’s a golf club that goes the distance that I want it to go. I don’t care if there’s a letter P, a letter A, or a picture of zebra on the bottom. All I care about is that it goes the distance I want it too.

> >

> > No false idea or belief here.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> When I posted that I thought you might get like that. It's always hard to tell tone on forums. Many people practice a lot with 7i and PW at the range (pretty much always the most used clubs in sets for sale) so many feel most comfortable hitting those clubs. Your AW is a traditional pitching wedge and you obviously know which clubs are going which distance so it's fine. The illusion is when people say "I used to hit my PW 120 and now I hit it 135". Well.. you're not you're hitting the same loft the same distance you always have.

 

I agree. But for those of us that know and understand the loft differences/changes Over the years shouldn’t be criticized or classified as following for the illusion.

[Kmac]

> @balls_deep said:

> > @CaseyDan said:

> > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> >

> > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> >

> > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> >

>

> Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

 

blah blah blah blah blah. So they didnt just hit the 8 whatever distance? Who cares!

 

This is such a tired and over played argument. Just play what you like and move on.

[jjfcpa]

I'm not sure it's the stronger lofts that result in greater distances with the Apex 19's. I have a set of Srixon Z585 with lofts 2 degrees stronger than the standard and I think Apex's are longer. Lofts are comparable for the Apex and Z585's.

[GolfChannel]

> @Kmac said:

> > @balls_deep said:

> > > @CaseyDan said:

> > > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> > >

> > > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> > >

> > > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> > >

> >

> > Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

>

> blah blah blah blah blah. So they didnt just hit the 8 whatever distance? Who cares!

>

> This is such a tired and over played argument. Just play what you like and move on.

 

I don’t care what they label it for the masses, I would just like to know the actual loft of the club a pro is hitting on any given shot.

[Kmac]

> @GolfChannel said:

> > @Kmac said:

> > > @balls_deep said:

> > > > @CaseyDan said:

> > > > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> > > >

> > > > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> > > >

> > > > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

> >

> > blah blah blah blah blah. So they didnt just hit the 8 whatever distance? Who cares!

> >

> > This is such a tired and over played argument. Just play what you like and move on.

>

> I don’t care what they label it for the masses, I would just like to know the actual loft of the club a pro is hitting on any given shot.

 

You mean the lofts on the clubs for Rickie, Spieth and so on? I’d be curious too. Is it some kind of big secret how they actually loft their clubs?

[jjfcpa]

Played 18 holes with the Apex 19's today. I've never been able to hit a 4 iron before and today, well, it was really nice. I just can't say I've ever hit an iron that is as nice feeling as these... even on mishits which appear to be rare.

[GolfChannel]

> @Kmac said:

> > @GolfChannel said:

> > > @Kmac said:

> > > > @balls_deep said:

> > > > > @CaseyDan said:

> > > > > I have the Apex combo se 4-AW. They are just wonderful. Great shape and feel. Very consistent and ball flight is nice and high.

> > > > >

> > > > > Another Home run for the Apex line.

> > > > >

> > > > > As for lofts, always played 4-PW. Decided to try 4-AW and the AW May be my favorite club in the set. Just money. Lofts are lofts. Learn your distances for each club and that is that.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Your AW is probably your favourite because it's your PW. I really wish they would start printing lofts. It makes no sense. I play with guys that go "man I just hit an 8 at that and it went **** distance". Many buy into the illusion.

> > >

> > > blah blah blah blah blah. So they didnt just hit the 8 whatever distance? Who cares!

> > >

> > > This is such a tired and over played argument. Just play what you like and move on.

> >

> > I don’t care what they label it for the masses, I would just like to know the actual loft of the club a pro is hitting on any given shot.

>

> You mean the lofts on the clubs for Rickie, Spieth and so on? I’d be curious too. Is it some kind of big secret how they actually loft their clubs?

 

I do, it would be more realistic than saying 9-iron when we know lofts aren’t standard anymore. Personally, I’m not sure why clubs aren’t randomly spec’d per tournament for legality (probably are and I have no idea).

[DLiver]

I recently put the Apex '19 into play. I can't believe how far AND high these hit the ball. They are also ridiculously forgiving. Not sure how they do it, but it is very impressive.

[teedub21]

I’ve also been playing the Apex Forged 19’s and love them. Not as soft and buttery as my Wilson V6 irons but way longer and more forgiving. I can’t stand the look of a GI iron. Tried to like the Ping G410’s but contrary to what the fans are saying they’re hard as a rock. The new Apex feels great, is easy to hit and has a players look.

[gpleonard]

> @jjfcpa said:

> I'm not sure it's the stronger lofts that result in greater distances with the Apex 19's. I have a set of Srixon Z585 with lofts 2 degrees stronger than the standard and I think Apex's are longer. Lofts are comparable for the Apex and Z585's.

I am just the opposite. I hit the Z585 irons farther and straighter than the Apex CF19 irons. Guess it is the individual player and how it works for them. Both are great iron sets. Just like the look and feel of the Z585 irons better.

 

[vman]

You answered your own question and my thoughts would be that it doesn't matter at all. You've got to play the golf hole in front of you with the clubs you select and nobody, but you, really cares what you're doing it with.> @klbcec said:

> Was looking at the specs on those. Looks like the pw loft is 43°. My mp4 9-iron has a loft of 43 degrees as well.

> Wouldn't be surprised if those irons are a full club longer than my MP4s.

> Thoughts?

 

 

[Cpm881]

I don't care about strong lofts but it's annoying having 5 degree gaps in scoring clubs. And that's what most oems do with strong lofted sets.

[hardten]

I have owned 40+ sets of iron,most top of their particular line at time,all types ie blades,CBs,SGI,GI,etc. Most of the time I seem to always end up with a "players type (for lack of a better description)CB preferably forged" Sure my current Apex 19 irons are a whole different animal to my MacGregor CF 4000s black faced. 40+ years later I can hit that Apex 19 a lot further then the Macs, LOL. Point is what difference does it make? None

[tobiasjd]

> @jjfcpa said:

> I'm not sure it's the stronger lofts that result in greater distances with the Apex 19's. I have a set of Srixon Z585 with lofts 2 degrees stronger than the standard and I think Apex's are longer. Lofts are comparable for the Apex and Z585's.

 

It's not just the loft. The faces are hot. Similar to what you'll experience with thin faced hollow irons. Lower lofts won't hurt the flight as much because the spring faces can launch a little higher and produce ball speeds that create a case of lower lofts producing a higher peak.