Your most unpopular Golf opinions?

[BIG STU]

On 7/1/2022 at 11:04 AM, Warrior42111 said:

The big one in my mind at least is to hold off on the demolition of courses for housing.

 

If more people are playing, more courses are going to be profitable. Which can prevent them from being sold. Once a course is sold for housing or retail space it's not going to ever come back to be a course and now you have fewer courses.

Here in the self proclaimed "Golf Capital of the World" the Grand Strand area of SC it does not matter. A course can be profitable and they still may close it to put in more housing. Then again according to loopholes in the law a not so profitable course can close and sit undeveloped and the taxes are lower. 

[BIG STU]

On 7/1/2022 at 4:22 PM, vtpachyderm said:

Thanks and yes - it’s still very misogynistic. When playing with my wife the looks we get when we show up at the tee box is disappointing but then when she manages to out drive them it’s rather funny seeing how it changes. Still doesn’t mean she feels comfortable - middle aged grumpy golfing men have an uncanny way of giving you a look that is so demeaning. Have to learn that to try on my kids 😂😂. 

It is sorta funny on the Women's end the stereotyping. A few years back my lifelong friend visited with his 2 daughters. We had a tee time at on of the courses on the North end. We were teeing off and his oldest daughter then 17 teed off from the mid tees with us. I heard the group behind us grumbling until she teed off and lanced one about 250 down the pike. I turned around and told those grumblers I would take her and play any two of them for $100. They shut up. That daughter went on to play college golf and on the Symetra tour. At the time she was the 3 time women's champion at their private club. And I said womens champion not Jr or girls champ. The younger daughter was no slouch either she was about 13 or so at the time. Yeah you never know. Funny thing was we never saw those guys again all day, I think she shot like 74 that day from the mid mens tees. Her Dad and I were quite a 4 ball team in the day and were hard to beat. That day they took us down.

Edited July 4, 2022 by BIG STU

[GolfTurkey]

I'm going to limit myself to purchases from the big four manufacturers because the resale value of other brands stinks so badly here in Australia.

[Rocky Ball-boa]

On 7/1/2022 at 4:04 PM, Warrior42111 said:

The big one in my mind at least is to hold off on the demolition of courses for housing.

 

If more people are playing, more courses are going to be profitable. Which can prevent them from being sold. Once a course is sold for housing or retail space it's not going to ever come back to be a course and now you have fewer courses.

 

Yeah, agreed. I don't really want golf participation to contract by any means. Or grow. Just stay around the same level 🙂

 

Reading the replies - ultimately it seems like it depends on your own particular circumstances. Some of us lives where if the game grows, we get more courses, and some of us lives in places that's simply run out of space and will never get a new course. 

The point of view on the "the game must grow" seems quite linked to those circumstances.

 

I appreciate everyone's perspectives on this, good conversation!

[itsame]

If it wasn't for its part in the history of golf, St Andrews would be dismissed as bland and uninteresting.

 

The layout is boring and its difficulty mostly resides in ultra deep bunkers which are about as unimaginative as putting trees in the fairway.

[GolfTurkey]

On 7/11/2022 at 12:45 AM, itsame said:

If it wasn't for its part in the history of golf, St Andrews would be dismissed as bland and uninteresting.

 

 

My cousin didn't endear himself when he (sincerely) pointed and asked a staff member there if he was allowed to park "on the field over there" and was very frostily told "that's the course".

[chillybilly]

Some of these are bloody obvious but in this topsy-turvy world have become unpopular at worst, controversial at best:

 

-Music on the course ie speakers. That isn't why we're out there. We're out here to get away from noise of any sort and hear the wind, the birds, the sound of the club on the ball, on the ground etc. Many of these sounds are integral to playing and enjoying the game ie feedback. We might even - gasp - have a conversation. In addition, your musical taste is horrid and the speaker is way too loud despite your claims of 'only I can hear it.' You've heard that track 20,000 times already. Missing the 20,001st repeat on the golf course won't hurt you.

 

-There seems to be a growing culture of not just drinking, not just having a steady intake of beer or whatever, but of getting hound dog-hammered even before the round commences. Granted, this is more prevalent among high handicappers/no handicappers who, if they're honest, are embarrassed and frustrated by their lack of ability and use blind drunkenness as a excuse for horrible golf. We all have stories of people getting absolutely lit on a course and, admittedly, some of the stories are funny especially if witnessed in person. Some of them even involve unlikely success on a particular hole or in a particular round. But drunk golf often means loud golf (voices) and, increasingly, loud music as noted above.

 

-Tee times are a two-way contract. If my time is 8:40 then I should be teeing off at 8:40 or as near to it as possible. By the same token, if the group ahead has a time of 8:32 that's when they should have gone. And...the group behind should be teeing off at 8:48 - assuming 8 minute intervals, obviously, and assuming all are present and ready to go (and admittedly it's often like herding cats to get people to the tee). All that said, the starters are generally horrible doing their most basic duties ie maintaining the tee times. This means the following are NOT adequate substitutes:

 

-'Hit when the fairway clears.'

-'Hit when they're on the green.'

-'They're out of range you can hit now.'

-'It's probably safe.'

-'OK guys you're up'

 

Guess what, Mr Starter? As soon as we rush through the first hole we're going to run smack dab into the back of the same group. There is nothing more maddening and disheartening than to putt out on #1 green only to arrive at #2 and see the group ahead on the tee. More often, you see the group ahead of you waiting on the group ahead of them! That's THREE (3) groups waiting for one tee. If it's hole #1 it makes some sense because - all together now - that's what tee times are for. #2? No chance. Ready golf can't compensate for this madness and neither can those freaky clocks that display one's tee time and demand that you keep pace.

 

Then the course ranger has the cheek to drive up in the opposite direction, give a little wave, and drive on. What?!? Never was the 'Player Assistance' sign on the ranger's cart more ironic than when players definitely need assistance because his colleague the starter isn't doing his job. On the occasions someone flags him down to complain about the bunching up of groups, he might say 'You'll get strung out over the next few holes.' Oh boy - that's a comfort. Nothing ruins a round (for me) more than having to see and watch the group ahead. You can't help but monitor them since you're waiting to play the hole and it's sad to see so many players conduct themselves in appalling, lazy fashion - driving the cart where they shouldn't, hitting extra balls all the time, leaving the cart behind them and having to walk back to it or expecting the cart to drive them to within 6 ft of their ball every time.

 

To be fair there have been starters and courses that religiously adhere to the intervals stated. And guess what? The groups are spaced out adequately. What a concept.

 

-The 'receipt pantomime.' If I play 100 rounds I've had the starter ask for the receipt maybe 5 times. Is it really that common for someone to show up, mount up and attempt to blag his way on the course, especially on a resort and/or remote property? Some courses and properties have finally started to see the folly of the little slips of paper especially when they have digital devices and/or radios.

 

-The starter speech. 'Has anyone played here before?' What if we have? What if we haven't? Who cares? You're going to give the speech regardless and we can predict its content. Front, back, middle pins. Distances measured to center of green (duh), exit the fairway at 100 yds or at the white pole, etc.

 

-Charging for range balls, using range tokens/machines etc. Hotels figured out long ago that charging $75 for a room and $5 for breakfast was silly and fussy when they could charge $90 for a room, give a 'free breakfast' (which many people pass up anyway) and make $10 more in the process.  Raise the price of a round, issue some free range balls and enjoy the calm and goodwill rather than having to ring another transaction. At a muni or a hack track it's understandable since people on the range will frantically hit ball after ball (poorly) or they will take anything that isn't nailed down. But at a nicer course, a resort course etc. it should be part and parcel of the fee. Most of us might get through 10-12 balls no matter how many are in the bag or bucket. It's a warm-up not a practice session. It's especially galling when $7-10 gets you a smallish bucket of weatherbeaten, misshapen spheres worn completely smooth or with dimples barely visible. We don't expect new ProV1s but there is a happy medium possible especially when being charged for the privilege.

[larrybud]

I'm with you except for the starters. Most tee times aren't spaced out enough for a starter to hold back any groups before their times anyway!

Starter speech? Eh, don't care either way.  Others stuff: spot on.

[AngryGilmore]

On 10/8/2019 at 11:05 AM, marmaduk said:

There should be no such thing as pre-booked teetimes. First come first serve. Show up. Sign up. Shut up. Your wait time is called warm up. Do it.

 

I don’t care how many wives or children you have. Make your priorities, Stick to them, and shut up about it. You are not a hero

 

Anyone who has given up golf because of children/family, or any passion in their life for that matter, is weak and the people you gave it up for can see that.

 

Marshals should start… Marshaling And not be lazy retirees looking for free golf.

Thread winner!  

[AngryGilmore]

What Bryson did with his swing is nothing revolutionary.  Moe Norman figured it out decades ago.

[double_d]

On 8/10/2022 at 7:24 AM, chillybilly said:

Some of these are bloody obvious but in this topsy-turvy world have become unpopular at worst, controversial at best:

 

-Music on the course ie speakers. That isn't why we're out there. We're out here to get away from noise of any sort and hear the wind, the birds, the sound of the club on the ball, on the ground etc. Many of these sounds are integral to playing and enjoying the game ie feedback. We might even - gasp - have a conversation. In addition, your musical taste is horrid and the speaker is way too loud despite your claims of 'only I can hear it.' You've heard that track 20,000 times already. Missing the 20,001st repeat on the golf course won't hurt you.

 

-There seems to be a growing culture of not just drinking, not just having a steady intake of beer or whatever, but of getting hound dog-hammered even before the round commences. Granted, this is more prevalent among high handicappers/no handicappers who, if they're honest, are embarrassed and frustrated by their lack of ability and use blind drunkenness as a excuse for horrible golf. We all have stories of people getting absolutely lit on a course and, admittedly, some of the stories are funny especially if witnessed in person. Some of them even involve unlikely success on a particular hole or in a particular round. But drunk golf often means loud golf (voices) and, increasingly, loud music as noted above.

 

-Tee times are a two-way contract. If my time is 8:40 then I should be teeing off at 8:40 or as near to it as possible. By the same token, if the group ahead has a time of 8:32 that's when they should have gone. And...the group behind should be teeing off at 8:48 - assuming 8 minute intervals, obviously, and assuming all are present and ready to go (and admittedly it's often like herding cats to get people to the tee). All that said, the starters are generally horrible doing their most basic duties ie maintaining the tee times. This means the following are NOT adequate substitutes:

 

-'Hit when the fairway clears.'

-'Hit when they're on the green.'

-'They're out of range you can hit now.'

-'It's probably safe.'

-'OK guys you're up'

 

Guess what, Mr Starter? As soon as we rush through the first hole we're going to run smack dab into the back of the same group. There is nothing more maddening and disheartening than to putt out on #1 green only to arrive at #2 and see the group ahead on the tee. More often, you see the group ahead of you waiting on the group ahead of them! That's THREE (3) groups waiting for one tee. If it's hole #1 it makes some sense because - all together now - that's what tee times are for. #2? No chance. Ready golf can't compensate for this madness and neither can those freaky clocks that display one's tee time and demand that you keep pace.

 

Then the course ranger has the cheek to drive up in the opposite direction, give a little wave, and drive on. What?!? Never was the 'Player Assistance' sign on the ranger's cart more ironic than when players definitely need assistance because his colleague the starter isn't doing his job. On the occasions someone flags him down to complain about the bunching up of groups, he might say 'You'll get strung out over the next few holes.' Oh boy - that's a comfort. Nothing ruins a round (for me) more than having to see and watch the group ahead. You can't help but monitor them since you're waiting to play the hole and it's sad to see so many players conduct themselves in appalling, lazy fashion - driving the cart where they shouldn't, hitting extra balls all the time, leaving the cart behind them and having to walk back to it or expecting the cart to drive them to within 6 ft of their ball every time.

 

To be fair there have been starters and courses that religiously adhere to the intervals stated. And guess what? The groups are spaced out adequately. What a concept.

 

-The 'receipt pantomime.' If I play 100 rounds I've had the starter ask for the receipt maybe 5 times. Is it really that common for someone to show up, mount up and attempt to blag his way on the course, especially on a resort and/or remote property? Some courses and properties have finally started to see the folly of the little slips of paper especially when they have digital devices and/or radios.

 

-The starter speech. 'Has anyone played here before?' What if we have? What if we haven't? Who cares? You're going to give the speech regardless and we can predict its content. Front, back, middle pins. Distances measured to center of green (duh), exit the fairway at 100 yds or at the white pole, etc.

 

-Charging for range balls, using range tokens/machines etc. Hotels figured out long ago that charging $75 for a room and $5 for breakfast was silly and fussy when they could charge $90 for a room, give a 'free breakfast' (which many people pass up anyway) and make $10 more in the process.  Raise the price of a round, issue some free range balls and enjoy the calm and goodwill rather than having to ring another transaction. At a muni or a hack track it's understandable since people on the range will frantically hit ball after ball (poorly) or they will take anything that isn't nailed down. But at a nicer course, a resort course etc. it should be part and parcel of the fee. Most of us might get through 10-12 balls no matter how many are in the bag or bucket. It's a warm-up not a practice session. It's especially galling when $7-10 gets you a smallish bucket of weatherbeaten, misshapen spheres worn completely smooth or with dimples barely visible. We don't expect new ProV1s but there is a happy medium possible especially when being charged for the privilege.

I agree with this so much, I could have written it myself.

[Fuscinator]

Watching professional golf is like watching other people eat. Unless you're desperately searching for some answer to your misery, it's worse than soccer.

[The Pearl]

On 8/10/2022 at 12:43 PM, larrybud said:

I'm with you except for the starters. Most tee times aren't spaced out enough for a starter to hold back any groups before their times anyway!

Starter speech? Eh, don't care either way.  Others stuff: spot on.

 

Our best courses changed the intervals to 10 minutes during COVID and have kept it in place. It is amazing how much the speed of play has improved overall. 

[dan360]

Cart girls should flirt more, especially if they're near a green.  Confidence is key when putting.

 

[MelloYello]

I admit that the strength of my feelings about the following varies depending on the day but in general I do agree that:

 

 

(1) Putting has taken on a far too critical role within the game of golf.

 

I do not necessarily even agree that putting as a core skill is even a good thing for the game. Therefore, putting should be returned to an ancillary formality in favor of the long & short games (those being chipping & pitching) as the areas that define one's skill. There should be almost no such thing as "practicing" putting for anything other than long-distance control.

 

The idea that we've created a condition where golfers looking to enjoy the game now have to actively take part in constant maintenance efforts all for the purpose of avoiding dispiriting misses from short range is reprehensible. The fact that so many weekend players routinely agree to concede short putts of one form or another indicates a real desire among recreational golfers that the impact of such putts on the outcome of wagers be minimized. This demonstrates how the need to spend countless hours "practicing" these "shots" is considered less a treasured part of golf and more an unwanted burden.  

 

(2) The quality of green surfaces now being overwhelmingly good due to advances in agronomy, lower green speeds should be embraced as part of the eradication of putting as a core skill. Playing golf under the constant threat of a 3-putt or missing a tap-in is in no way, shape or form a positive for the recreational golfer. 

 

(3) The hole should be enlarged to ensure tap-ins are a formality rather than something to practice. This not only improves scoring but has shown to both speed up play and increase enjoyment. Yet traditionalists remain staunchly against any change whatsoever. 

 

(4) Areas immediately surrounding the hole should be kept relatively flat for obvious reasons. 

 

 

 

At this point in my life, I can now say (as a scratch golfer) that I don't mind driving, approach play, recovery, scrambling, short game and lag putting as necessary "skills" within golf, but I really don't like having to be (or seeing my fellow recreational golfers) concerned with short putts. IMHO, if short putts are required, they should be a formality which are essentially foolproof and which require virtually no real practice. Slower greens and slightly larger holes would ensure this. 

 

I don't want to win or lose based on how well someone can handle short putts. I wouldn't want to win a club championship because an opponent missed a 3-footer. I don't think it's in anyone's interest for short putts to affect the outcome and it's a wet blanket on so many of us that it sucks a lot of fun and enjoyment out of the game by creating an ever-present anxiety and a constant need to practice something so unlike what defines the rest of the game. 

 

.

Edited August 13, 2022 by MelloYello

[vtpachyderm]

19 hours ago, MelloYello said:

I admit that the strength of my feelings about the following varies depending on the day but in general I do agree that:

 

 

(1) Putting has taken on a far too critical role within the game of golf.

 

I do not necessarily even agree that putting as a core skill is even a good thing for the game. Therefore, putting should be returned to an ancillary formality in favor of the long & short games (those being chipping & pitching) as the areas that define one's skill. There should be almost no such thing as "practicing" putting for anything other than long-distance control.

 

The idea that we've created a condition where golfers looking to enjoy the game now have to actively take part in constant maintenance efforts all for the purpose of avoiding dispiriting misses from short range is reprehensible. The fact that so many weekend players routinely agree to concede short putts of one form or another indicates a real desire among recreational golfers that the impact of such putts on the outcome of wagers be minimized. This demonstrates how the need to spend countless hours "practicing" these "shots" is considered less a treasured part of golf and more an unwanted burden.  

 

(2) The quality of green surfaces now being overwhelmingly good due to advances in agronomy, lower green speeds should be embraced as part of the eradication of putting as a core skill. Playing golf under the constant threat of a 3-putt or missing a tap-in is in no way, shape or form a positive for the recreational golfer. 

 

(3) The hole should be enlarged to ensure tap-ins are a formality rather than something to practice. This not only improves scoring but has shown to both speed up play and increase enjoyment. Yet traditionalists remain staunchly against any change whatsoever. 

 

(4) Areas immediately surrounding the hole should be kept relatively flat for obvious reasons. 

 

 

 

At this point in my life, I can now say (as a scratch golfer) that I don't mind driving, approach play, recovery, scrambling, short game and lag putting as necessary "skills" within golf, but I really don't like having to be (or seeing my fellow recreational golfers) concerned with short putts. IMHO, if short putts are required, they should be a formality which are essentially foolproof and which require virtually no real practice. Slower greens and slightly larger holes would ensure this. 

 

I don't want to win or lose based on how well someone can handle short putts. I wouldn't want to win a club championship because an opponent missed a 3-footer. I don't think it's in anyone's interest for short putts to affect the outcome and it's a wet blanket on so many of us that it sucks a lot of fun and enjoyment out of the game by creating an ever-present anxiety and a constant need to practice something so unlike what defines the rest of the game. 

 

.

This is an interesting and slightly perplexing take on putting as to me putting is as important as the rest of the game. Allow me to explain : In my golf group, every time we roll up we play competitively (match or stableford), and pretty much the guy who putts the best wins, and the mind games played when to play a gimmee makes for some very interesting matches. It doesn't seem to matter how hard you practice, but when the pressure is on, all bets are off. My last round, I played as well as I could tee to green, but on that day, my putting was off, and I must have left 5 putts on the course. (3 3 putts, and 2 makeable 4 footers). If i could have made just 2 of those 5 shots, I'm in the money spots.

 

I will wholeheartedly agree with point no. 2 where super fast/slick greens only serve to slow the pace of play and nothing else.

[Righty to Lefty]

If I were Tiger Woods and LIV offered 900 mil guaranteed to limp around the course for 8 events a year over the next couple years...I would have said peace out PGA Tour. He hardly plays anymore anyway and there is absolutely no chance they would ever ban Tiger from playing in the majors.  In the end it would be a win win for the LIV tour and the players on the PGA tour cause it would make them clean up their act for sure.   

[SlothofDespond]

1. Green speeds should rarely be "fast." They should never be fast on weekends when the course is busiest and a bunch casual players are playing. They should especially never be fast in windy conditions or when low level tournaments are played (e.g., mixed golf with a bunch of spouses who play once a month at most).
    
2. Fairways shouldn't be cut so tight. Lengthen the course by minimizing rollout off the tee.
    
3. Traditionalists should be ignored.

[erickhand]

On 5/23/2022 at 6:02 PM, Blaiser said:

My unpopular opinion -- courses should have some sort of verification/tutorial process to make sure players know what they are doing before they are allowed to play.

 

It shouldn't be based on skill, hackers can hack away. Just know how to navigate the course to prevent slow play.

 

Tons of recreational hobbies make you sit through some sort of training to make sure people know what they are doing first. 

 

I know a lot of euro countries do something like this, and I'm all for it.

This is a great idea.  Develop a certification process through tutorials/training and cap it with an exam.  The intent would be to prevent slow play and unnecessary damage to the course.  There are too many casuals out there that do not have a clue how to play the game.  Help the game grow by providing education and certification.  

[vandyfan]

Adam Schupak and Alan Shipnuck’s names are too similar and they should have a 3 hole playoff with the loser changing their name or retiring from golf writing.

[Blaiser]

Amateur golfers should stop marking their golf balls. It makes them look terrible when I buy the used golf balls online. I don't want people knowing I'm a cheap a** by having someone else's initials sloppily scribbled on my ball 🤣

Edited August 17, 2022 by Blaiser

[GingerBubba]

1 - If you hit the green in regulation or less, each putt you make should only count as a half stroke.

 

2 - If you make a horrible swing/strike, but fluke a good result out of it, you should add half a stroke onto your card.

[MelloYello]

7 hours ago, Blaiser said:

Amateur golfers should stop marking their golf balls. It makes them look terrible when I buy the used golf balls online. I don't want people knowing I'm a cheap a** by having someone else's initials sloppily scribbled on my ball 🤣

 

The title says unpopular opinions! 

 

😂

[PhilsFanDrew]

12 hours ago, Blaiser said:

Amateur golfers should stop marking their golf balls. It makes them look terrible when I buy the used golf balls online. I don't want people knowing I'm a cheap a** by having someone else's initials sloppily scribbled on my ball 🤣

 

Nail polish remover should remove sharpie marks. 

[RmoorePE]

A fade is 3x more valuable than a draw. (For right handers)

 

Draws look cool, and run a long ways. That is also their downfall. People waste too much time trying to hit draws.

 

Fades are dependable, don't roll out so much and a much higher percentage of holes are built for the ball to move left to right. There are some courses that have exceptions to this, but think of your favorite courses, a fade probably is a better ball to hit.

[Blaiser]

7 hours ago, PhilsFanDrew said:

 

Nail polish remover should remove sharpie marks. 

 

I've never thought about this. Does it damage the cover at all?

[mshills]

This one is bound to be unpopular!

 

Alcohol should not be sold on-course.

[smoova]

On 8/17/2022 at 12:47 PM, RmoorePE said:

A fade is 3x more valuable than a draw. (For right handers)

 

Draws look cool, and run a long ways. That is also their downfall. People waste too much time trying to hit draws.

 

Fades are dependable, don't roll out so much and a much higher percentage of holes are built for the ball to move left to right. There are some courses that have exceptions to this, but think of your favorite courses, a fade probably is a better ball to hit.

"You can talk to a fade but a hook won't listen." - Lee Trevino 

[becoh]

If it's a warm sunny day, without a cloud in the sky....put the g'd umbrella away. Same goes for these solar shields, full face coverings.

 

Golf is not the hobby for you, if you're scared of the sun. Get some sun, embrace the golfer's tan. Vitamin D is good for you.

[nicoy3k]

If you don’t let a single play through the second that there is an opportunity you are a grade A douchenozzle