Why do I hit steel shafted driver farther and straighter?

[nsxguy]

4 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Have you ever practiced with persimmon woods? Learn to hit those on the screws and the modern equipment will be easy.

 

Yeah, the less forgiving persimmon driver will help him focus more. 🙃

 

 

4 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

I'm still playing it. Wish I could paint a steel shaft to look like graphite so I don't have to answer the question. "So why do you play steel?" 

 

I would think you'd love to answer that question.

 

Just stripe it down the middle past those guys by 30+ yards, as you did in the OP, and tell them "THAT'S why !!!"

[tthomasgolfer605]

3 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Yeah, the less forgiving persimmon driver will help him focus more. 🙃

 

 

 

I would think you'd love to answer that question.

 

Just stripe it down the middle past those guys by 30+ yards, as you did in the OP, and tell them "THAT'S why !!!"

 

7 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Yeah, the less forgiving persimmon driver will help him focus more. 🙃

 

 

 

I would think you'd love to answer that question.

 

Just stripe it down the middle past those guys by 30+ yards, as you did in the OP, and tell them "THAT'S why !!!"

I let quite a few very good players hit it and we're surprised at the performance especially when the wind was blowing.  You have to catch it in the sweet spot though. You'll lose a ton of yardage off the heel. 

[tthomasgolfer605]

35 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Yeah, the less forgiving persimmon driver will help him focus more. 🙃

 

 

 

 

Sarcasm?

[nsxguy]

42 minutes ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Sarcasm?

 

Noooooooo,,,,,,,,,

 

I see the same premise about blades in every blade vs. CB thread on this board,,,,,,,,,,,,, so it must be true !!!

[tthomasgolfer605]

Fair enough. Let's go back to my original post.  Equipment companies have touted that this club goes further, this ball goes further, yet the distance for the average golfer is about 220 yards and the average score is 100 for many years. How do you explain that? Don't give me the courses have gotten longer garbage since there's like 5 sets of tees these days. BTW, I have no reason to lie about my experience with the newer drivers. It's just what happened.

[nsxguy]

14 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Fair enough. Let's go back to my original post.  Equipment companies have touted that this club goes further, this ball goes further, yet the distance for the average golfer is about 220 yards and the average score is 100 for many years. How do you explain that? Don't give me the courses have gotten longer garbage since there's like 5 sets of tees these days. BTW, I have no reason to lie about my experience with the newer drivers. It's just what happened.

 

OK, I'll play,,,,,,, just a little more.

 

Average score ? Give me a break. Percentage-wise there are obviously just as many golfers below the average score, whatever it is, as there are above. That's an average. Means less than nothing.

 

Average distance 220 ? is that more or less than 25 years ago ? And how does that correlate to the average AGE of golfers now that the seniors are playing more than ever with more time and more disposable income ?

 

Distance versus score is not a straight line.

 

Anyway, as for the actual topic. 

 

Firstly I'll note that you already admitted that one poster's anecdotal account of HIS increased yardage via the new technology you totally discounted as "BS" versus YOUR anecdotal info of steel going farther(?) and being "better" for you. When asked if that's what you were saying you said "Pretty much".

 

Secondly you haven't really told us much more than it's better for you. No launch monitor numbers, not even yardage numbers for your steel vs. graphite. Just "steel's better" and "lighter/graphite" isn't as good.

 

Frankly, not much in the way of compelling arguments.

 

Anyway, I totally believe that via better and more efficient bio-mechanics a heavier driver can be swung a BIT faster, more efficiently, than a lighter driver. MUCH faster ? As in 125 gram steel vs. 60/70 weight class graphite. Hmmmmm. Wouldn't think so - but I'd be willing to watch someone do it. Then I'd be convinced.

 

That said, there are 2 particular holes on my old course up in NYC I think about.

 

In the early 90's, with a small(er) headed wooden based driver, on the first one, a very well struck drive of mine would end up about 150 from the center of the green with a firm and fast course. Last time I played, with more normal/average type fairway conditions, the average drive of mine would be 90-100.

 

Similar on the other hole. The well struck drive would hit, granted into an upslope, maybe 30-40 yards short of the top of the fairway and not roll out much, if at all. 3 iron/hybrid to the green

 

Last time I played it that same(?) drive flew the top of the hill.

 

Now you may argue it's the ball, not the driver. Up to you.

 

But even if you attribute ALL of the added distance today to the ball, I doubt anyone would suggest the older, smaller, wooden headed drivers were anywhere near as forgiving as the larger Ti/composite heads of today.

 

Anyway, there's a reason why the real experts around here haven't paid any attention to this thread,,,,,,, so I'll do my best to ignore it now as well.

 

Good luck with your driver. If it works best for you, by all means, rock on

 

 

 

 

 

[tthomasgolfer605]

21 hours ago, nsxguy said:

 

OK, I'll play,,,,,,, just a little more.

 

Average score ? Give me a break. Percentage-wise there are obviously just as many golfers below the average score, whatever it is, as there are above. That's an average. Means less than nothing.

 

Average distance 220 ? is that more or less than 25 years ago ? And how does that correlate to the average AGE of golfers now that the seniors are playing more than ever with more time and more disposable income ?

 

Distance versus score is not a straight line.

 

Anyway, as for the actual topic. 

 

Firstly I'll note that you already admitted that one poster's anecdotal account of HIS increased yardage via the new technology you totally discounted as "BS" versus YOUR anecdotal info of steel going farther(?) and being "better" for you. When asked if that's what you were saying you said "Pretty much".

 

Secondly you haven't really told us much more than it's better for you. No launch monitor numbers, not even yardage numbers for your steel vs. graphite. Just "steel's better" and "lighter/graphite" isn't as good.

 

Frankly, not much in the way of compelling arguments.

 

Anyway, I totally believe that via better and more efficient bio-mechanics a heavier driver can be swung a BIT faster, more efficiently, than a lighter driver. MUCH faster ? As in 125 gram steel vs. 60/70 weight class graphite. Hmmmmm. Wouldn't think so - but I'd be willing to watch someone do it. Then I'd be convinced.

 

That said, there are 2 particular holes on my old course up in NYC I think about.

 

In the early 90's, with a small(er) headed wooden based driver, on the first one, a very well struck drive of mine would end up about 150 from the center of the green with a firm and fast course. Last time I played, with more normal/average type fairway conditions, the average drive of mine would be 90-100.

 

Similar on the other hole. The well struck drive would hit, granted into an upslope, maybe 30-40 yards short of the top of the fairway and not roll out much, if at all. 3 iron/hybrid to the green

 

Last time I played it that same(?) drive flew the top of the hill.

 

Now you may argue it's the ball, not the driver. Up to you.

 

But even if you attribute ALL of the added distance today to the ball, I doubt anyone would suggest the older, smaller, wooden headed drivers were anywhere near as forgiving as the larger Ti/composite heads of today.

 

Anyway, there's a reason why the real experts around here haven't paid any attention to this thread,,,,,,, so I'll do my best to ignore it now as well.

 

Good luck with your driver. If it works best for you, by all means, rock on

 

 

 

 

 

From Golf Digest 2019.  All different ages and handicaps. Still proves nothing right? 

[nsxguy]

8 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

From Golf Digest 2019.  All different ages and handicaps. Still proves nothing right? 

 

I don't know. What is it you're trying to "prove" ?

 

You (last) said "Equipment companies have touted that this club goes further, this ball goes further, yet the distance for the average golfer is about 220 yards and the average score is 100 for many years. How do you explain that?"

 

I gave you MY explanation AND examples. And now you come up with this ? A chart with average hdcp vs average distance off the tee ???

 

OK, I'm done with you too,,,,,,, here,,,,,,

 

You're welcome BTW.  👍

 

[tthomasgolfer605]

You started being rude to me last year. Go get laid or something. 

[bogeypro]

I'd like to see a video and some trackman numbers of this driver vs a more modern setup.  I don't care if its indoors...  I just want to see this.  

[tthomasgolfer605]

1 hour ago, bogeypro said:

I'd like to see a video and some trackman numbers of this driver vs a more modern setup.  I don't care if its indoors...  I just want to see this.  

2 Vids from last year. Face on was steel. DTL was graphite. Last launch monitor reading was 172 ball speed with the x-100. Zeroed out path/face at impact. Didn't get any graphite numbers. 

[baudi]

Good swing. Reminds of Faldo. I estimate it around 105 mph chs.

With 172 bs and a 1.5 sf the chs would be around 114.6 mph chs.

Eyeballing all this could be off  | which is my bad.

[TheDeanAbides]

1 hour ago, baudi said:

Good swing. Reminds of Faldo. I estimate it around 105 mph chs.

With 172 bs and a 1.5 sf the chs would be around 114.6 mph chs.

Eyeballing all this could be off  | which is my bad.

I get a Faldo vibe too, but I'm pretty sure it's faster than 105. 

[tthomasgolfer605]

10 hours ago, baudi said:

Good swing. Reminds of Faldo. I estimate it around 105 mph chs.

With 172 bs and a 1.5 sf the chs would be around 114.6 mph chs.

Eyeballing all this could be off  | which is my bad.

Thanks. I'm not quite sure about the numbers because I don't use trackman or anything. There's days where the ball is getting out there like John Daly, and days like Corey Pavin. Depends on the conditions. I did use a gps app and I lost a bit of yardage in past 2 years but a nice solid drive with no wind is 290-300.

[tthomasgolfer605]

9 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

I get a Faldo vibe too, but I'm pretty sure it's faster than 105. 

I have to hit my driver solidly, or I'll lose some distance. Although distance is way down on my list of things I'm concerned about. 

[bogeypro]

17 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

2 Vids from last year. Face on was steel. DTL was graphite. Last launch monitor reading was 172 ball speed with the x-100. Zeroed out path/face at impact. Didn't get any graphite numbers. 

Damn good swing there.  👍

[chipa]

I tried out my new driver today with a 125 g steel shaft tipped as much as I could so its an SX. I definitely hit it much straighter on the range but no telling about the distance. According to my radar in my small office I'm around102-103 but I always am higher at the range for some reason, so I expect to be around 107-108. Also, the face of the driver is onset instead of offset so that helped the hooks too no doubt.

[tthomasgolfer605]

8 hours ago, bogeypro said:

Damn good swing there.  👍

Thanks. I appreciate that.

[TheDeanAbides]

It really is a good swing. Just looks really efficient and uncomplicated.

[tthomasgolfer605]

4 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

It really is a good swing. Just looks really efficient and uncomplicated.

Thanks Dean. You just explained my approach to it. See the shot. Aim. Fire.

[tthomasgolfer605]

14 hours ago, chipa said:

I tried out my new driver today with a 125 g steel shaft tipped as much as I could so its an SX. I definitely hit it much straighter on the range but no telling about the distance. According to my radar in my small office I'm around102-103 but I always am higher at the range for some reason, so I expect to be around 107-108. Also, the face of the driver is onset instead of offset so that helped the hooks too no doubt.

Bang driver or did you change heads? 

[chipa]

3 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Bang driver or did you change heads? 

 

Yes I did changed heads. I had a 13 deg. mini driver which I liked but my golfing buddy was having problems with his 12 deg. Bang - he was losing it right - so we traded. I never noticed the face was onset but that's not good for people who can't square the clubface. My buddy hasn't been playing long. We both order everything from Monark or Hireko and assemble it. His daughter and my 3 daughters are learning to play so its a lot of fun.

 

 

[Holmes19]

I played a steel shaft years ago in a Titleist 975JVS Hcr, which was then outlawed, I never missed and was as long as my playing partners using graphite.  The outlawing of the high cor rate meant I spent 10yrs with new tech & graphite shafts trying to find consistency and length, the consistency was always a problem, to a point where I fell out of love for the game.  During lockdown, I decided to order a driving net for home, and a Nippon NS Pro stiff shaft for my 910D3 driver.  Now I’m back hitting fairways, long, consistent.  Yes it’s probably 15yrds shorter than a graphite ‘good’ drive would go, but I’m over the “ooh I’ve hit it 10yds further than you” ego trip, and laser straight again.  Subsequently my scores had dropped and I’m loving it 

 

I considered getting a TS3 or TS4 head to go on the steel shaft.  Would have cost me £350 to do this.  Then I watched a pro doing comparisons between 910D3 head all the way through to TS3 head (using the same shaft).  Result was the 910 was straighter and more consistent, the TS3 was 10yrds longer and far greater dispersion 

 

I’m sticking to my 910 with steel shaft, distance is vanity, scores are sanity

[CoachWhitty]

Hello,

 

I realize this is an old post, but I am new to golfwrx and was hoping to weigh in.  For starters, I am an old duffer who was educated in the Sam Snead and Patty Berg method.  I am a classic one-piece "pull swinger".  As a result, I struggled with lighter shafts of the modern driver, even when getting them fitted.  I simply felt that my timing and rhythm were off because I couldn't feel the clubhead.  This was also made worse by the fact that I still game a set of Wilson Staff blades from the 70's which to most feel heavier than sin.  To go from heavy irons to light feeling woods just wasn't working.

 

I tried 95+ graphite shafts and it still didn't feel right so I decided to experiment.  I replaced the graphite with a TrueTemper Sensicore shaft at 130 grams.  The feel is amazing and my distance has consistently been greater than with the graphite shafts.  While I understand clubhead speed potentially could go down, the consistent center strikes with steel shaft that twists less than most graphite shafts more than made up for the loss.

 

 

 

[Hawkeye77]

I wouldn't call Sam Snead a "one piece pull swinger" and many use a similar label popular on the internet for a number of reasons, but I'm not sure what that has to do with wanting heavier shafts in your clubs.

 

Having played Wilson Staff Tour blades for many years when much younger and still having a couple of classic sets of Hogans and Macgregors that are comparable, for sure the shafts are heavier than what I can get along with now, and the overall feel is stiffer than my current irons with modern graphite shafts, but I honestly wouldn't play a round of golf with those old clubs any more - giving too much away in feel and speed vs. my current Mizunos. 

 

If you are "old" and can still generate the speed you need with heavier shafts and find the middle more often then that's what works for you.  I wouldn't dismiss most graphite shafts as necessarily being less likely to "twist", and graphite shafts in drivers are almost universally used by the best players in the world, but again, if a heavier shaft works, enjoy.  Whatever gets you the lowest score . . . wins!  (I read that somewhere). 😀

[CoachWhitty]

Thanks for the reply!  I bring up the Sam Snead method (who used a 14.5 oz/411 gram driver) as a frame of reference.  I swing the club vs hit with the club, something I see a lot of golfers confuse.  This works so much smoother with a club of weight for me (a swing feeling of course).  I was simply responding to the original post that the gentleman started.  He asked why he was having better distance and control with a steel shafted driver and I posted certain things I have experienced that may give similar reasons for him.

Edited July 28, 2024 by CoachWhitty

[EddieEdwards]

I'm currently playing a 100g steel shaft at 43.5".  It's more accurate and distance is similar to 70g and 80g shafts.

[CoachWhitty]

9 hours ago, EddieEdwards said:

I'm currently playing a 100g steel shaft at 43.5".  It's more accurate and distance is similar to 70g and 80g shafts.

Awesome!

 

I am play a 130g shaft that I truly love.  I realize many have told me it is an overweight relic that needs to be hung up on the wall, but when I am 30+ yards past theirs consistently, it's hard to give it up.  I am a swinger of the club, not a hitter.

[Ri_Redneck]

On 7/28/2024 at 7:03 AM, CoachWhitty said:

Hello,

 

I realize this is an old post, but I am new to golfwrx and was hoping to weigh in.  For starters, I am an old duffer who was educated in the Sam Snead and Patty Berg method.  I am a classic one-piece "pull swinger".  As a result, I struggled with lighter shafts of the modern driver, even when getting them fitted.  I simply felt that my timing and rhythm were off because I couldn't feel the clubhead.  This was also made worse by the fact that I still game a set of Wilson Staff blades from the 70's which to most feel heavier than sin.  To go from heavy irons to light feeling woods just wasn't working.

 

I tried 95+ graphite shafts and it still didn't feel right so I decided to experiment.  I replaced the graphite with a TrueTemper Sensicore shaft at 130 grams.  The feel is amazing and my distance has consistently been greater than with the graphite shafts.  While I understand clubhead speed potentially could go down, the consistent center strikes with steel shaft that twists less than most graphite shafts more than made up for the loss.

 

 

 

You, like myself, prefer a traditional feeling club to the modern options available. However, that DOES NOT mean that you can't have some tech on your side. There are plenty of heavier options in graphite shafts out there AND, when you start trying them, throw swingweight out the door and go by feel. SW was okay for steely shafts, but today, traditional SWs just don't work with the shafts available. All of my sets have graphite shafts (woods and irons) and feel very similar to my old steel shafted sets.

 

BT

[Chunkitgood]

Which leads to the possible simple conclusion that the OP’s experience is due to the fact that modern drivers with graphite shafts don’t have a swing weight that’s good for him.