DJ or BK Does it remind you of a Jack Nicklaus Arnold Palmer

[m d g]

No, because Nicklaus and Palmer both had personalities.

[iBanesto]

Who is the most charismatic player on tour now?! 

 

Is there anyone?

[puttfordoux]

I'm sure Jack and Arnie would have loved to be making the kind of money DJ and Bruce are making at their age. It's partly because of them that they are. But they weren't in it for the money. They were in it to make a name for themselves. Sure they had the endorsement deals courtesy of Mark McCormack, but it gave them and the sport visibility at a time when the sport desperately needed it. Now the players are craving for privacy and riches. The thing has turned upside down. Its not DJ and Bruce's fault mind you, but they are the benefactors of it.

Edited September 10, 2020 by puttfordoux

[freowho]

49 minutes ago, iBanesto said:

Who is the most charismatic player on tour now?! 

 

Is there anyone?

Golf is no where near as big as it used to be. Hogan had a ticker tape parade after winning the British Open!

Arnie was like a movie star heart throb. I'll say Paul Newman.

Jack was dependable. Jimmy Stewart.

Trevino was a comic. Jerry Lewis. Only not clumsy.

Tiger was more like an action hero. Stallone.

I can't think of anyone at the moment who would even get an audition.

Maybe Jimenez in Dirty Rotten Scoundrels!

I've just been through the top100 and I can see 3 baddys and 1 potential goofy leading man. Koepka, De Chambeau and Reed are the baddies. Fowler the goofy leading man. 

[iBanesto]

49 minutes ago, freowho said:

Golf is no where near as big as it used to be. Hogan had a ticker tape parade after winning the British Open!

Arnie was like a movie star heart throb. I'll say Paul Newman.

Jack was dependable. Jimmy Stewart.

Trevino was a comic. Jerry Lewis. Only not clumsy.

Tiger was more like an action hero. Stallone.

I can't think of anyone at the moment who would even get an audition.

Maybe Jimenez in Dirty Rotten Scoundrels!

I've just been through the top100 and I can see 3 baddys and 1 potential goofy leading man. Koepka, De Chambeau and Reed are the baddies. Fowler the goofy leading man. 

 

McIlroy is so boring with his PR way of speaking. Though he has made some ill judged comments in the past.

[Ferguson]

2 hours ago, iBanesto said:

Who is the most charismatic player on tour now?! 

 

Is there anyone?

 

 

Phil?

[iBanesto]

4 minutes ago, Ferguson said:

 

 

Phil?

 

Hmm.. Phil will always be FIGJAM.

 

A player that has always shown character and humour is actually Padraig Harrington.

 

Always speaks his mind and loves to talk about stats on tour.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

Probably Phil

[NoTalentLefty]

The one thing I would say either player reminds me of the greats, they wear pants and shirts. I will say DJ never shows his emotions on a bad shot kinda of like Jack.

[Naptime]

Corvettes were under $5000 when Arnie and Jack were in their prime.  Their meager winnings went a long way back then.  ?

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

On 9/8/2020 at 9:14 PM, llewol007 said:

With DJ just winning and with Brooks already recording majors and wins under his belt. Will these two become separated and really have their own camps in terms of golf fans. I myself have always liked DJ's game and he is going to be a force to be reckoned with because of how far he hits the ball. Now Brooks took over for a stretch winning those majors the way he did kinda made me think of how it must of been when Palmer was the guy until Jack Nicklaus came into his own. There was always a love, hate and respect between the two. I for one cant wait to watch this play out and see how many wins and majors these two player end up collecting. 

The newer players are all much more focused. They don’t have the erudite mentality of players from the past.

 

If either of them went back in time, they could completely dominate the game, but the game would not have grown as much as with players like Nicklaus, Trevino, Seve, Faldo, etc. They all had a story back then. The old players certainly had more entertainment value.

 

The newer players are all like huge athletic versions of Hogan from upper middle class families.

All golf and no play.

[miamistomp]

 I disagree with the above comment

   Old pros had to be focused because they had to be competitive to earn

    No endorsement deals, no plush clubhouse perks, no or little air travel

         no gym work, no college career no special meals and often pool caddies

Pack your un air conditioned car and go

    The new guys would not put up with that lifestyle

[bscinstnct]

4 hours ago, freowho said:

Golf is no where near as big as it used to be. Hogan had a ticker tape parade after winning the British Open!

Arnie was like a movie star heart throb. I'll say Paul Newman.

Jack was dependable. Jimmy Stewart.

Trevino was a comic. Jerry Lewis. Only not clumsy.

Tiger was more like an action hero. Stallone.

I can't think of anyone at the moment who would even get an audition.

Maybe Jimenez in Dirty Rotten Scoundrels!

I've just been through the top100 and I can see 3 baddys and 1 potential goofy leading man. Koepka, De Chambeau and Reed are the baddies. Fowler the goofy leading man. 

 

That’s great!

 

I think Arnie more bad @ss than Newman.

 

More like

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by bscinstnct

[llewol007]

It does put in perspective how times have changed for sure. There probably isnt a current player who can hold the jock strap of Arnie and Jack. Even I getting into the game at a later age and born in 77 can only watch the later days of them both but watching specials and other documentaries on them both made me respect them and the players from way back when. Today's game is different for sure and a lot of you are correct if players back then had the technology we have now. That would of been fun to watch. In terms of story lines, there is too much available out there all ready that you know the lives of most of the players on tour. I think that is the biggest difference now and maybe what will keep any player or players from getting to the level of Jack and Arnie. 

[Hawkeye77]

22 hours ago, llewol007 said:

enlighten me because I was born during the time of the Jack and Arnie's rivalry so to assume I am going by the recent trends is not quite correct either. So let me ask you who then who would be a good comparison in today's era. Or will there ever be.

 

Born in '77 is nowhere remotely close to being born in the time of their actual rivalry, or being able to appreciate it when you were old enough to even understand the game, as you said you were in response to a previous post, so ------ no context.  Hit the books!

Edited September 10, 2020 by Hawkeye77

[llewol007]

14 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

Born in '77 is nowhere remotely close to being born in the time of their actual rivalry, or being able to appreciate it when you were old enough to even understand the game, as you said you were in response to a previous post, so ------ no context.  Hit the books!

Too funny Hawkeye. Its no wonder dialogue dies on these forums when we have defenders of the universe always on the prowl. 

[Ferguson]

1 hour ago, bscinstnct said:

 

That’s great!

 

I think Arnie more bad @ss than Newman.

 

More like

 

 

 

 

 

 

And Steve McQueen

 

 

 

[thatsmybikepunk]

On 9/9/2020 at 5:19 AM, Ferguson said:

I never would have thought that.  And more importantly, I never would have said that.  

Classic.

[Hawkeye77]

45 minutes ago, llewol007 said:

Too funny Hawkeye. Its no wonder dialogue dies on these forums when we have defenders of the universe always on the prowl. 

 

LOL, you aren't getting away with that.

 

When it was suggested you didn't really understand much about the historical context, your response was "enlighten me because I was born during the time of the Jack and Arnie's rivalry so to assume I am going by the recent trends is not quite correct either".

 

Well, you weren't.  By 1977, Arnie hadn't won a major in 13 years and Jack had 14, so the changing of the guard and the real on course rivalry was long, long dead by 1977.

 

Were they still "rivals" in their personal lives, checking the scoreboards just because, business lives - sure.  Would you have been perceiving any of that by the early 90s when you were in high school? Nope.

 

I tried to make a helpful suggestion and what I got was basically a snarky "enlighten me because I was there and know what I'm talking about". Not cool when you really weren't.

 

Golf history is out there - take it in, doesn't matter how old you are or how much you think you know, always more to learn and on this subject you have some fascinating learning ahead of you.  Jack/Arnie, anything Bobby Jones, Ouimet and contemporaries across the pond, and again, as I suggested, Hogan/Snead/Nelson.  Seminal periods in golf history.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Hawkeye77

[Hawkeye77]

5 hours ago, iBanesto said:

 

Hmm.. Phil will always be FIGJAM.

 

A player that has always shown character and humour is actually Padraig Harrington.

 

Always speaks his mind and loves to talk about stats on tour.

 

Love the guy, but charisma? Maybe a stretch and the stats thing suggests he's still an accountant at heart, lol.  Still, he'd be right up there with pros that would be a blast to play a round of golf with.

[Ferguson]

1 hour ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

Born in '77 is nowhere remotely close to being born in the time of their actual rivalry, or being able to appreciate it when you were old enough to even understand the game, as you said you were in response to a previous post, so ------ no context.  Hit the books!

 

52 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

LOL, you aren't getting away with that.

 

When it was suggested you didn't really understand much about the historical context, your response was "enlighten me because I was born during the time of the Jack and Arnie's rivalry so to assume I am going by the recent trends is not quite correct either".

 

Well, you weren't.  By 1977, Arnie hadn't won a major in 13 years and Jack had 14, so the changing of the guard and the real on course rivalry was long, long dead by 1977.

 

Were they still "rivals" in their personal lives, checking the scoreboards just because, business lives - sure.  Would you have been perceiving any of that by the early 90s when you were in high school? Nope.

 

I tried to make a helpful suggestion and what I got was basically a snarky "enlighten me because I was there and know what I'm talking about". Not cool.

 

Golf history is out there - take it in, doesn't matter how old you are or how much you think you know, always more to learn and on this subject you have some fascinating learning ahead of you.  Jack/Arnie, anything Bobby Jones, Ouimet and contemporaries across the pond, and again, as I suggested, Hogan/Snead/Nelson.  Seminal periods in golf history.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just when I thought I'd seen it all at WRX, along comes llewol007 posting vicariously as a faux golf historian.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Ferguson

[llewol007]

13 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

LOL, you aren't getting away with that.

 

When it was suggested you didn't really understand much about the historical context, your response was "enlighten me because I was born during the time of the Jack and Arnie's rivalry so to assume I am going by the recent trends is not quite correct either".

 

Well, you weren't.  By 1977, Arnie hadn't won a major in 13 years and Jack had 14, so the changing of the guard and the real on course rivalry was long, long dead by 1977.

 

Were they still "rivals" in their personal lives, checking the scoreboards just because, business lives - sure.  Would you have been perceiving any of that by the early 90s when you were in high school? Nope.

 

I tried to make a helpful suggestion and what I got was basically a snarky "enlighten me because I was there and know what I'm talking about". Not cool when you really weren't.

 

Golf history is out there - take it in, doesn't matter how old you are or how much you think you know, always more to learn and on this subject you have some fascinating learning ahead of you.  Jack/Arnie, anything Bobby Jones, Ouimet and contemporaries across the pond, and again, as I suggested, Hogan/Snead/Nelson.  Seminal periods in golf history.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Im not gonna argue about history and what the players of past have written when it comes to the game and dont get caught up with when or how much golf history I know. You are correct, I was in error as to the time frame that I am going by but to make it seem as if I have no knowledge at all seems a bit too much. And yet who do you think today can be considered a rivalry in a similar way where there were those who loved Arnie more than they did Jack. That is all I am asking. I was using DJ and Brooks as an example of how we are kinda led to pick one player over the other. 

[cxx]

6 hours ago, freowho said:

Golf is no where near as big as it used to be. Hogan had a ticker tape parade after winning the British Open!

Arnie was like a movie star heart throb. I'll say Paul Newman.

Jack was dependable. Jimmy Stewart.

Trevino was a comic. Jerry Lewis. Only not clumsy.

Tiger was more like an action hero. Stallone.

I can't think of anyone at the moment who would even get an audition.

Maybe Jimenez in Dirty Rotten Scoundrels!

I've just been through the top100 and I can see 3 baddys and 1 potential goofy leading man. Koepka, De Chambeau and Reed are the baddies. Fowler the goofy leading man. 

 

DJ might be Sean Penn in Fast Times but BK is a Kardashian.

[Hawkeye77]

16 minutes ago, llewol007 said:

Im not gonna argue about history and what the players of past have written when it comes to the game and dont get caught up with when or how much golf history I know. You are correct, I was in error as to the time frame that I am going by but to make it seem as if I have no knowledge at all seems a bit too much. And yet who do you think today can be considered a rivalry in a similar way where there were those who loved Arnie more than they did Jack. That is all I am asking. I was using DJ and Brooks as an example of how we are kinda led to pick one player over the other. 

 

1. I don't want to argue - but will still encourage anyone to learn more because it's fun and I learn new golf history stuff all the time and will keep at it, because I enjoy it.  And you mentioned the shows - the Arnie and Jack series on GC were great and do give a flavor for the times they came along in, but so much more to flesh out that's interesting (to me anyway).

 

2. I just really don't see it right now.  I want to say Phil (Arnie) and Tiger (Jack) - but when Tiger came along Phil hadn't transcended the game like Palmer had already begun to in the 60s, he hadn't come out winning majors, etc. and Tiger was such a phenom in his own right, the fans were eating him up/loving it - not the same as when Jack played.  It's like Tiger was Jack and Arnie kind of rolled into one (to me that's how I see him) and he still is pretty singular.  If you want to put Tiger in the Arnie role, then we haven't seen anyone like Jack challenge Tiger and it's pretty much too late for a real rivalry.  A few different guys over time have had some good results in the Tiger era, but no young guy coming out and shocking the golf world and sustaining the excellence.  I just don't see the player everybody loves right now (who also so great) that someone else is going to have people stomping the ground trying to make him miss putts - so different now. So much talent now, so much exposure and social media that there aren't just two or three unique marketable guys who are that far ahead of everyone else in on course accomplishment (and sustaining it) - even the guy in the Dutch house painter hat was getting big ads for Wilson, lol, where's he now (and, haha, I can't remember his name). Fowler as recognizable as any, if not more so, and what's he really done? Love him, but he's kind of an example of today's kind of star. 

 

 

Just my $.01.

Edited September 10, 2020 by Hawkeye77

[tiderider]

there's no comparison to make ... at all ... arnie/jack ain't gonna be matched in either collective ability, collective accomplishments or collective rivalry ... one guy was the most beloved golfer ever, and so accomplished he was probably already top 15, if not top 10 all time, and the other started out on a hot streak to becoming the goat ... there's nothing that compares in today's game ... no two players have that mix ... and the fact that their accomplishments are so different - 4 majors vs 23 wins and only 1 major ... 

[m d g]

I know...different times, different competition. But can you imagine what Nicklaus could have done with a 460cc driver and a graphite shaft circa 1965?

He might have BDC long : )

[llewol007]

1 hour ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

1. I don't want to argue - but will still encourage anyone to learn more because it's fun and I learn new golf history stuff all the time and will keep at it, because I enjoy it.  And you mentioned the shows - the Arnie and Jack series on GC were great and do give a flavor for the times they came along in, but so much more to flesh out that's interesting (to me anyway).

 

2. I just really don't see it right now.  I want to say Phil (Arnie) and Tiger (Jack) - but when Tiger came along Phil hadn't transcended the game like Palmer had already begun to in the 60s, he hadn't come out winning majors, etc. and Tiger was such a phenom in his own right, the fans were eating him up/loving it - not the same as when Jack played.  It's like Tiger was Jack and Arnie kind of rolled into one (to me that's how I see him) and he still is pretty singular.  If you want to put Tiger in the Arnie role, then we haven't seen anyone like Jack challenge Tiger and it's pretty much too late for a real rivalry.  A few different guys over time have had some good results in the Tiger era, but no young guy coming out and shocking the golf world and sustaining the excellence.  I just don't see the player everybody loves right now (who also so great) that someone else is going to have people stomping the ground trying to make him miss putts - so different now. So much talent now, so much exposure and social media that there aren't just two or three unique marketable guys who are that far ahead of everyone else in on course accomplishment (and sustaining it) - even the guy in the Dutch house painter hat was getting big ads for Wilson, lol, where's he now (and, haha, I can't remember his name). Fowler as recognizable as any, if not more so, and what's he really done? Love him, but he's kind of an example of today's kind of star. 

 

 

Just my $.01.

Thanks for that Hawkeye and Im of the same. I love the history of golf and love when the greats sit around and talk about how it use to be when they played. Makes you appreciate the challenges they had back then and how much they had to overcome. There was no NetJets to the next tournament. I threw DJ and Brooks out there just to get the ball rolling and believe me, I like their game but they bring too much other stuff to the game that turns me off. When I was watching Brooks getting massaged during the PGA at Harding, I was laughing to myself and thinking what do other players think let alone all the players from the past think. You are right, there will probably be no real rivalry again. I almost thought Rory and Speith had a chance but each had their own set backs and as much success as they had, they dont have enough to get to that tier either. No developing story lines that we slowing take in. With the advent of social media it is shoved down our throats and I can only take so much of that. Tiger sure did have everybody including myself following him ever so close so he was probably his own rival in a way. 

[Dr. Block]

This whole thread really sums up the evolution of the touring professional through the years. From home grown skills, dash, and charisma, to mostly PC and completely honed by the science of sport.  

[Hawkeye77]

5 hours ago, llewol007 said:

Thanks for that Hawkeye and Im of the same. I love the history of golf and love when the greats sit around and talk about how it use to be when they played. Makes you appreciate the challenges they had back then and how much they had to overcome. There was no NetJets to the next tournament. I threw DJ and Brooks out there just to get the ball rolling and believe me, I like their game but they bring too much other stuff to the game that turns me off. When I was watching Brooks getting massaged during the PGA at Harding, I was laughing to myself and thinking what do other players think let alone all the players from the past think. You are right, there will probably be no real rivalry again. I almost thought Rory and Speith had a chance but each had their own set backs and as much success as they had, they dont have enough to get to that tier either. No developing story lines that we slowing take in. With the advent of social media it is shoved down our throats and I can only take so much of that. Tiger sure did have everybody including myself following him ever so close so he was probably his own rival in a way. 

 

Honestly, for me I'm more interested in whether they can be persuaded to come to blows out there - are they even buddies any more? That wouldn't be boring!

 

Interesting and unique take, Tiger his own rival --- that's got me thinking so won't be such a boring Thursday evening after all.

[iBanesto]

19 hours ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

Love the guy, but charisma? Maybe a stretch and the stats thing suggests he's still an accountant at heart, lol.  Still, he'd be right up there with pros that would be a blast to play a round of golf with.

 

I actually didn't say Harrington had charisma, I said character lol.

 

Hmm for some reason my original post wasn't quoted as well. That's annoying.

Edited September 11, 2020 by iBanesto