Proto Concept - New JDM Company

[Mavrix]

Just ordered a set of Proto Concept for personal use. I’m a club builder from

Germany… 

 

I’ll use C05 in iron 7 to PW and C07 in the iron 6 and 5. 
 

I not decided on shafts yet 🤦‍♂️ will try the Axiom 75 R2 against the MMT 70 R. 
 

Really excited to get this set build for myself. ☺️🤩

[Dragonslayer101]

Came back from Tokyo and picked up the C07 in a 5 and 6 iron, C05 in 7,8,9 and PW. Worked out to be 21,000 yen a head from Double Eagle in Ginza. 

 

I've been through a lot of irons and these have to be one of the straightest I've ever hit. Highly recommend 

[NerdyGolfer]

4 hours ago, Dragonslayer101 said:

Came back from Tokyo and picked up the C07 in a 5 and 6 iron, C05 in 7,8,9 and PW. Worked out to be 21,000 yen a head from Double Eagle in Ginza. 

 

I've been through a lot of irons and these have to be one of the straightest I've ever hit. Highly recommend 

Very nice setup!

[Honman]

Had a really interesting testing session. Would have presumed the 5's were going to be the best iron for me. However the new C03's with the thinner sole were helping me get into the ball better. I'm much more of a picker than I ever realised, and because I was getting into the ball better, the ball speed was higher as well as all the other metrics. 

[Hillviewer]

On 7/29/2023 at 9:29 PM, Mavrix said:

Just ordered a set of Proto Concept for personal use. I’m a club builder from

Germany… 

 

I’ll use C05 in iron 7 to PW and C07 in the iron 6 and 5. 
 

I not decided on shafts yet 🤦‍♂️ will try the Axiom 75 R2 against the MMT 70 R. 
 

Really excited to get this set build for myself. ☺️🤩

Hi, how was comparison between Axiom 75 R2 vs the MMT 70R?

[Obsessed]

can anyone compare the C05 to Callaway CF19? in terms of softness, feeling when ball is struck?

 

Thanks

[NerdyGolfer]

On 9/20/2023 at 4:11 AM, Hillviewer said:

Hi, how was comparison between Axiom 75 R2 vs the MMT 70R?

So I think Axiom shafts feel worlds better than MMT. MMT's are a bit harsh for me because of the added steel strands. Axiom is pure graphite and is one of the best feeling shafts I've played. Super smooth and super stable! Ball flight might be similar on the two as well if that means anything, but I've seen a touch more distance with axiom 

[NerdyGolfer]

5 minutes ago, Obsessed said:

can anyone compare the C05 to Callaway CF19? in terms of softness, feeling when ball is struck?

 

Thanks

I think you'll see the C05's feeling better than the CF19's. Since they are both multi piece forged clubs, it's fairly critical that the manufacturing/ finishing is on point and this is where endo shines. I can't remember who forges the CF19, but you cannot tell the C05's are a two piece forge (face and body are separate). The other thing I'll note is the C05's are deadly straight and much easier to hit than the Apex heads in a comparable body shape. The last thing to consider is Proto's are not known for "distance" even though this is marketed as a player's distance club. They are more "modern" traditional lofting with the 7 being 32 and the PW being 45. But they will be the most consistent (accuracy AND distance) iron you'll ever play!

[sheezymaneezy]

@NerdyGolfer been considering picking up a combo set. 

PW-8 in 01s and then 7-5 in 03s.

I usually play my Epons in my signature, don't struggle with height or anything like that, which is why I am considering the 01s as well.

Thoughts?

 

Also is there much difference between the titanium v ceramic inner?

With the C03s, is there much difference between the older one (black cavity) v the newer C03TC?

 

I notice your signature says you play a straight set of 01s now!

Edited October 27, 2023 by sheezymaneezy

[NerdyGolfer]

On 10/27/2023 at 3:47 AM, sheezymaneezy said:

@NerdyGolfer been considering picking up a combo set. 

PW-8 in 01s and then 7-5 in 03s.

I usually play my Epons in my signature, don't struggle with height or anything like that, which is why I am considering the 01s as well.

Thoughts?

 

Also is there much difference between the titanium v ceramic inner?

With the C03s, is there much difference between the older one (black cavity) v the newer C03TC?

 

I notice your signature says you play a straight set of 01s now!

I just shot you a message, tons to unpack! Sorry I missed this!

 

and for those that care about my long winded message:

 

the new C01’s are substantially better than the old 01’s. The ceramic is MUCH softer than the titanium and they changed from S25C to S20C in the head. So the two changes were massive (imo). They also had some additional weight to play with because they used ceramic (lighter). They also put ceramic in all of the heads, not just 5-7 like before 

 

the new 03’s have changed a good bit. The sole is a touch wider, I believe the blade length is longer too. CG changed as the longer irons were harder to elevate. Overall the head got a touch more bulk to it, but still an excellent (and accurate) iron. Outside of that, the material is the same, so I’d say feel is “similar” since I haven’t hit the two side by side I don’t have a direct comparison.

 

I switched to a full bag of 01’s because they are fairly forgiving for a set of MB’s. I switch between those and another set of CB’s when my ball striking isn’t fully there. The new C01TB’s are just addicting feeling. I’ve found adding the 5i to my bag was a bad idea 😂 originally had 6-P and that was working just fine…the 5 was a bit of a stretch lol

Edited October 31, 2023 by NerdyGolfer

[rorykoepka]

Hoping I could get some help deciding between the first gen models C03 and C05. I got to hit the C03 in the 5-7 irons and really enjoyed it. I was wondering if the C05 is different than the C03 in terms of size, heel to toe length, offset etc? Also if launch characteristics are any different between the models? Loved the shape of the C03 and thought the sole was the perfect width, but if the C05 is the exact same shape and size but has more forgiveness I’d be interested. Thanks everyone!

[gm12673]

I’ve played the OG 03s for the last 2.5 years and have just picked up a set of new 05s in the last 4 weeks. I’d highly recommend the 05s (and I absolutely loved the 03s). To me, the turf interaction remains superb ( I play almost exclusively on firm links turf with tight lies), but the 05s offer a little more forgiveness while retaining  really great feel. I really don’t see any downside in the 05s. And this is coming from someone who has historically favoured musclebacks / narrow soles and top lines. I don’t think you’ll regret the 05s. 5/6 cap FWIW. 

[gm12673]

Should add that the blade length between OG 03s and new 05s is now marginally longer. Offset is as close to identical as makes no difference to my eye - it’s not much in any event. Highly highly recommend these irons and I’ve hit an awful lot of them….

[sheezymaneezy]

I have C01 + C03 combo set, as well as a C05 4i. 

I find looking down at address, the C05 looks much chunkier than the C01 + C03. 
Very easy to hit though!

[rorykoepka]

2 hours ago, gm12673 said:

I’ve played the OG 03s for the last 2.5 years and have just picked up a set of new 05s in the last 4 weeks. I’d highly recommend the 05s (and I absolutely loved the 03s). To me, the turf interaction remains superb ( I play almost exclusively on firm links turf with tight lies), but the 05s offer a little more forgiveness while retaining  really great feel. I really don’t see any downside in the 05s. And this is coming from someone who has historically favoured musclebacks / narrow soles and top lines. I don’t think you’ll regret the 05s. 5/6 cap FWIW. 

Did you ever get to try the og 05? I guess you can’t go wrong with either but you seem to really like the new 05. Doesn’t seem like there’s many people out there with the new 05 quite yet and hard to find reviews of it other than cool clubs robot one (they never reviewed the OG model).

[NerdyGolfer]

25 minutes ago, rorykoepka said:

Did you ever get to try the og 05? I guess you can’t go wrong with either but you seem to really like the new 05. Doesn’t seem like there’s many people out there with the new 05 quite yet and hard to find reviews of it other than cool clubs robot one (they never reviewed the OG model).

Could’ve sworn I responded to this, but it doesn’t look like it ever posted. Not going to regurgitate what others have said, the new C05’s are absolutely fantastic.

 

biggest differences from OG to new:

-FEEL! I cannot state this enough. They used S25C as the base for the OG’s and they moved to S20C for the new ones. Well worth it for that alone.

 

-CG is slightly optimized for each head and I see that improve launch and spin. It’s more consistent and the launch is a touch higher

 

-forgiveness is about the same, maybe a touch better on the new ones (extremely forgiving)

 

-size, offset all the same

 

-sole grind is a little different. Less rounded grind and more linear across the sole. I haven’t noticed much of a change from this, but sole grinds are heavily dependent on AoA and just your delivery in general.

 

overall, I was angry I ever got rid of my OG C05’s (but that’s golf for you!) and really enjoy the new ones. Happy to shoot over pictures if you send me a message

[gm12673]

I didn’t hit the OG 05s, but the new ones are awesome. Personal pref, but I think the new model looks miles better too. 

[rorykoepka]

1 hour ago, gm12673 said:

I didn’t hit the OG 05s, but the new ones are awesome. Personal pref, but I think the new model looks miles better too. 

I’d be all over the new ones if they didn’t have red paint fill…cant stand it for some reason but beautiful otherwise.

 

How are you guys dealing with the non existent resale market for these irons if they don’t work out? It’s really between a great set of used srixons and these but the instant loss in value of proto without ability to resell if it doesn’t work out worries me a bit

[golftech]

3 hours ago, rorykoepka said:

I’d be all over the new ones if they didn’t have red paint fill…cant stand it for some reason but beautiful otherwise.

 

How are you guys dealing with the non existent resale market for these irons if they don’t work out? It’s really between a great set of used srixons and these but the instant loss in value of proto without ability to resell if it doesn’t work out worries me a bit

I’ve gotten 3 years with the c03’s so resell is as good as any set at this point.  In the meantime, great Endo feel, forging and performance.

[rorykoepka]

Does anyone know why Nexgen MG Forged irons look exactly like the new proto concepts including the same cut cavity technology? I know they are owned by the same company golf partner but I don’t understand how they can release the same iron with a different name. The 2nd link also shows the older model that also is the same as proto. Hard to believe proto concept is that much higher end unless nexgen uses cast steel which i believe they don’t. A little fishy here…

 

https://www.golfpartner.jp/shop/usedgoods/h010004_m291/?srsltid=AfmBOoqb2nk2XQU4veo_27VzDfG5tCM3GqTqQT80P_YyFNOYOWF2P2Y6

 

https://www.golfpartner.jp/shop/usedgoods/?search=x&keyword=Mr+forged&image.x=x

[NerdyGolfer]

So my understanding is that these Nexgen models came before Proto concept was a thing. That’s why they look nearly identical. Nexgen has been golf partners house brand for a bit. If you notice they have a driver, wedges and fairway woods that look like they fit with the Proto line. (I’ve been hoping Proto would bring woods and hybrids)
 

It’s a bit goofy if you ask me, but I think they changed a bit with the transition from Nexgen to proto (materials and forging styles). The OG lines from Proto most likely had extreme similarities. But the 2nd generations from Proto have turned them into their own brand. They brought on a CAD designer to optimize the designs and make them stand out as a strong Japanese brand.

 

Nexgen really isn’t available in the states (although it is sold). They’ve spent much less time and energy on those clubs vs pouring quite a bit of R&D into the Proto lines (hence the “luxury” vs house brand).

 

there were some ownership changes as well. Proto concept US has taken the reins of the company vs Proto concept Japan is starting to take a back seat. So, again you can start to see Proto pull away from Nexgen and establish themselves further into the JDM community 

[NerdyGolfer]

11 hours ago, rorykoepka said:

Does anyone know why Nexgen MG Forged irons look exactly like the new proto concepts including the same cut cavity technology? I know they are owned by the same company golf partner but I don’t understand how they can release the same iron with a different name. The 2nd link also shows the older model that also is the same as proto. Hard to believe proto concept is that much higher end unless nexgen uses cast steel which i believe they don’t. A little fishy here…

 

https://www.golfpartner.jp/shop/usedgoods/h010004_m291/?srsltid=AfmBOoqb2nk2XQU4veo_27VzDfG5tCM3GqTqQT80P_YyFNOYOWF2P2Y6

 

https://www.golfpartner.jp/shop/usedgoods/?search=x&keyword=Mr+forged&image.x=x

Forgot to reply to your comment, sorry

[rorykoepka]

10 hours ago, NerdyGolfer said:

So my understanding is that these Nexgen models came before Proto concept was a thing. That’s why they look nearly identical. Nexgen has been golf partners house brand for a bit. If you notice they have a driver, wedges and fairway woods that look like they fit with the Proto line. (I’ve been hoping Proto would bring woods and hybrids)
 

It’s a bit goofy if you ask me, but I think they changed a bit with the transition from Nexgen to proto (materials and forging styles). The OG lines from Proto most likely had extreme similarities. But the 2nd generations from Proto have turned them into their own brand. They brought on a CAD designer to optimize the designs and make them stand out as a strong Japanese brand.

 

Nexgen really isn’t available in the states (although it is sold). They’ve spent much less time and energy on those clubs vs pouring quite a bit of R&D into the Proto lines (hence the “luxury” vs house brand).

 

there were some ownership changes as well. Proto concept US has taken the reins of the company vs Proto concept Japan is starting to take a back seat. So, again you can start to see Proto pull away from Nexgen and establish themselves further into the JDM community 

Thanks for the reply and insight! Unfortunately still doesn’t answer the question. I did just find out that nexgen was forged at endo as well. I don’t understand then how proto concept is justifying their price point on the OG models and even the newer 2nd gen models when the previous budget house brand Nexgen used the same materials and forging. I’ve asked proto concept about this and after multiple messages back and forth about random technical specs they ghosted me after asking what the difference was between Nexgen and Proto concept. This company is more of a marketing play at the moment and I’ll stay away until they give some real answers. Hopefully an authorized dealer is able to get some answers.

Edited November 3, 2024 by rorykoepka

[NerdyGolfer]

3 hours ago, rorykoepka said:

Thanks for the reply and insight! Unfortunately still doesn’t answer the question. I did just find out that nexgen was forged at endo as well. I don’t understand then how proto concept is justifying their price point on the OG models and even the newer 2nd gen models when the previous budget house brand Nexgen used the same materials and forging. It seems a little scummy. I’ve asked proto concept about this and after multiple messages back and forth about random technical specs they ghosted me after asking what the difference was between Nexgen and Proto concept. This company is more of a marketing play at the moment and I’ll stay away until they give some real answers. Very deceiving. Hopefully an authorized dealer is able to get some answers. If they don’t indicate wild differences between the 2 companies and models it’s time for a golf journalist to look into it

I get that and I think I answered the question from as much as I know. I'm saying the heads you put in the link above are old Nexgen branded heads (pre-proto concept). Look at the date on all of the heads, they all say 2015-2018. I think golfpartner ran them as the nexgen brand as a "tester", but switched the name to proto concept to help differentiate between the two brands (affordable vs luxury). Or they likely died on the vine when they were called Nexgen and proto concept resurrected them.

 

I'm not 100%, but I don't believe the current Nexgen models are endo forged (as they all look cast). The current styles of nexgen are wildly different than the ones you showed in the link. They are more like Yamaha and Yonex style heads and more of the forgiving and GI type stuff. Protos gen 2 heads are different as well. 

 

There's nothing shady going on here. Just marketing, that's all. No different than what most US companies do..

 

Nexgen forgings are 2018 and before

Proto Concept started in 2019 (really didn't start selling until late 2020, early 2021)

[rorykoepka]

18 minutes ago, NerdyGolfer said:

I get that and I think I answered the question from as much as I know. I'm saying the heads you put in the link above are old Nexgen branded heads (pre-proto concept). Look at the date on all of the heads, they all say 2015-2018. I think golfpartner ran them as the nexgen brand as a "tester", but switched the name to proto concept to help differentiate between the two brands (affordable vs luxury). Or they likely died on the vine when they were called Nexgen and proto concept resurrected them.

 

I'm not 100%, but I don't believe the current Nexgen models are endo forged (as they all look cast). The current styles of nexgen are wildly different than the ones you showed in the link. They are more like Yamaha and Yonex style heads and more of the forgiving and GI type stuff. Protos gen 2 heads are different as well. 

 

There's nothing shady going on here. Just marketing, that's all. No different than what most US companies do..

 

Nexgen forgings are 2018 and before

Proto Concept started in 2019 (really didn't start selling until late 2020, early 2021)

Totally understand those are before nexgen changed their products into a game improvement cast line. Just pointing out those 2015-2018 heads are nearly identical to what is proto concept today just priced at least twice as expensive as back then and marketed as luxury. The fact that I’m getting more answers from you than proto concept themselves about a simple question says a lot. You’re a great resource here and everyone appreciates it. Proto concept dodging a simple question though is odd. It’s a valid question about a large potential purchase

 

MR forged is the same as C07

MG forged same as C03TC

MT Forged C01

 

https://www.gp-nexgen.jp/forged/

 

 

Edited November 2, 2024 by rorykoepka

[RHenderson]

Not trying to be the fly in the ointment, but after reading this and clicking on your link @rorykoepka it looks to me the irons you are talking about clearly states once you click the translate to English that those irons are : Previous models of the FORGED series.

 

And from my vantage point it looks like Nexgen is Japan only?

 

So I'd like to speak about the new Pro Concept irons? Gen 2 or what ever we are calling them. Coming from a very discrete golfer who has owned just about every club made in the past 3 years, seriously I've owned at least 50 sets of irons, probably closer to 75? Golf is my hobby, at 59 I don't drink, go to bars or party, boat, collect cars, etc. I play golf and love experimenting with golf equipment. If I had to guess I've spent over 50K in golf equipment over the past few years, but hey I'm fortunate to be able to do so, where it does not put us in a bind or harm anyone in my family. Proto Concept: I just bought a Brand New set of CO5TP 4-PW and they are fantastic, super soft, sexy looks, and feel amazing. Are they the greatest iron I've ever hit, probaly not because that is such a loaded question / answer. I just returned from Hilton Head Island, Golf Weeks Senior Amateur Nationals and the irons performed flawlessly, even better down there because of the turf which is way more conducive to good shot than here at home in Indiana. I dont think we can say there is a greatest, simply because of turf conditions but as far as a very nice set of irons these are it, great looks, feel & performance. so I'll give them a grade of A in my opinion.

 

I think golfers get hung up on trying to find a Unicorn? and guys I don't think there is such a creature, especially when it come to golf equipment. With all the Launch monitors and data from today how in the world could one set be better than the next. It's simple: Does the set fit / suit you? Simple as that. If it does then great, it's the best, greatest set for you, and maybe not the best or greatest set for the next guy, and Oh! quite trying to tell me it's the best thing since sliced bread. We are bombarded with this kind of junk, noise, etc. Think about This! how in the World do we expect a Engineer wether he is here in the States or abroad to design a Super Set of irons that are perfect for ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Are we Serious!

 

Come on now golf is such a individual sport and the equipment we use should be as well, you get my point, how in the world can a golfer say this is the greatest set for me, when they never take the time to learn, understand the characteristics and then have those clubs bent, adjusted to thier needs????????? Seriously!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I could go on and on, but Golf is a four letter word! you know that right.? I'ts also a very fickel game, also humbling at times and very rewarding at other times, unless you are a Professional, spending 8-12 hours a day, how in the world can you expect Magic! from your equipment? I know I've gone off the tracks trying to explain this but heres the point. Proto Concept are fantastic irons, made in Japan and forged by Endo! IT does not get any better than that! So if your a guy like me who enjoys the finer things in life these irons will not dissapoint.

 

Rich   

[RHenderson]

Just some FYI I picked up some nice gently used Proto Concept Wedges 50* - 56* - & 60* to complete my set and will start on building them tonight, I'll be putting in Nippon NS Pro 120 S shafts in them to match my irons and hope to play them this weekend.

 

Edited November 5, 2024 by RHenderson

[corky]

They look nice, considered them when replacing wedges but in the end went with some Fourteens.

PC have some new wedges coming soon I believe.

[RHenderson]

4 hours ago, corky said:

They look nice, considered them when replacing wedges but in the end went with some Fourteens.

PC have some new wedges coming soon I believe.

@corky Thanks, funny thing is I'm currently playing Fourteen RM4's and absolutely love them. I only bought these to try and to complete my set if you will. I'm sorta a Wedge Junky and thought it would be nice to have the matching set if ever? Plus I always love trying new wedges and that's great news, as I'm sure I will have to try the new ones as well. LOL

 

The Wedge market is so tuff for companies to crack but that does not mean great wedges don't come around from time to time. A close friend of mine recently bought a set of Kyoei KK Wedges and he loves them, kicked his Vokey's out of his bag back in August and he wont consider anything else. I used to be a putter Ho, and guess old habits are hard to break so I've moved on to Wedges. LOL

 

Thanks

[NerdyGolfer]

7 hours ago, corky said:

They look nice, considered them when replacing wedges but in the end went with some Fourteens.

PC have some new wedges coming soon I believe.

New wedges should be here next year from what I understand. 

 

Fourteen also recently released the RM-W and will be releasing the FRZ wedge to replace the RM-4's soon (RM-W is here to stay)

 

Some of my favorite wedges are from Fujimoto. Docus has a wedge that's lower bounce and is forged by fujimoto. SS400 material and just stupid smooth