Putted ball hits flagstick laying behind hole

[denkea]

Well, that was only to get your attention to the gist.

 

A putted ball is going past the hole and going to hit the flagstick laying beyond the hole.  Before it hits the flagstick another player picks up the flagstick so the ball doesn't hit it.  Penalty or no?  If so, on who?  

[Mr. Bean]

No penalty. See Rule 11.3 Exception.

 

 

Edited March 19, 2022 by Mr. Bean

[davep043]

As @Mr. Bean says, you may move a few things even while a ball is in motion without penalty, including the flagstick, another ball at rest, or equipment (yours, or anyone else's).

[Mr. Bean]

Those who remember this Rule some 15 years ago also remember how odd it was, I might even say stupid. In those days a ball hitting an attended flagstick cost the player 2 PS. On the other hand, if someone lifted an attended flagstick lying on the ground in order to prevent a ball from hitting it that person got 2 PS. Fortunately that Rule has been changed and IMHO for a very good reason.

[TwistedSister]

10 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

Those who remember this Rule some 15 years ago also remember how odd it was, I might even say stupid. In those days a ball hitting an attended flagstick cost the player 2 PS. On the other hand, if someone lifted an attended flagstick lying on the ground in order to prevent a ball from hitting it that person got 2 PS. Fortunately that Rule has been changed and IMHO for a very good reason.

Isn't it still a penalty to hit and attended flagstick?

[TerpFangolfer]

16 minutes ago, dhacker56 said:

Isn't it still a penalty to hit and attended flagstick?

Negative...see 13.2b(2) - as long as not deliberate 

Accidentally hitting either flagstick or attendee = play it as it lies

Deliberate = see 11.2

 

Good example of when it would be accidental - Bryson's caddie at the Ryder Cup. Was unable to get the stick out of the cup (in the end ball didn't hit, but they talked about how if it had hit would be no pen...vs old rules it would have been)

Edited March 20, 2022 by TerpFangolfer

[oikos1]

On 3/20/2022 at 7:38 AM, Mr. Bean said:

Those who remember this Rule some 15 years ago also remember how odd it was, I might even say stupid. In those days a ball hitting an attended flagstick cost the player 2 PS. On the other hand, if someone lifted an attended flagstick lying on the ground in order to prevent a ball from hitting it that person got 2 PS. Fortunately that Rule has been changed and IMHO for a very good reason.

Oh Mr. Bean, I always knew deep down you had some "rules is stupid guy" in you.  My heart is warmed.  😁

[Mr. Bean]

5 hours ago, oikos1 said:

Oh Mr. Bean, I always knew deep down you had some "rules is stupid guy" in you.  My heart is warmed.  😁

 

To be precise, I have some 'rule WAS stupid' in me 🤓

[ChipStrokes]

1 hour ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

To be precise, I have some 'rule WAS stupid' in me 🤓

sure, now. but before the rule was changed that means you were, by definition, “rule IS stupid” guy. 

[naval2006]

On 3/20/2022 at 7:48 PM, dhacker56 said:

Isn't it still a penalty to hit and attended flagstick?

Anyways, who has a flag attended at WRX level? LOL

[Mr. Bean]

1 hour ago, ChipStrokes said:

sure, now. but before the rule was changed that means you were, by definition, “rule IS stupid” guy. 

 

You should acknowledge that also the Lords are 'this Rule is stupid' guys as they have changed many Rules that were difficult to justify. 

[Mr. Bean]

23 minutes ago, naval2006 said:

Anyways, who has a flag attended at WRX level? LOL

 

I remember when the Rules changed in 2019 lots of people were adamant that nobody will take the pin out from now on. Look what happened. Professionals and top amateurs leave the pin in extremely seldom except for long putts. On social rounds when the score is unimportant people tend to leave it in but when the putt matters the pin is taken out, i.e. attended.

[ChipStrokes]

7 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

You should acknowledge that also the Lords are 'this Rule is stupid' guys as they have changed many Rules that were difficult to justify. 

the lords?

[Mr. Bean]

12 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

the lords?

 

Persons of the Ruling Bodies are often referred as Lords, at least here in Europe.

[ChipStrokes]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Persons of the Ruling Bodies are often referred as Lords, at least here in Europe.

lol i think that’s part of the problem. 

[TwistedSister]

1 hour ago, naval2006 said:

Anyways, who has a flag attended at WRX level? LOL

I will if i can't see the hole. 

[Mr. Bean]

36 minutes ago, dhacker56 said:

I will if i can't see the hole. 

 

How does that help? Isn't the pin in the hole if it is not attended..?

 

Edited March 22, 2022 by Mr. Bean

[TwistedSister]

Just now, Mr. Bean said:

 

How does that help? Isn't the pin in the hole if it is not attended..?

 

I prefer to not have the pin in the hole when I putt.  But if I can not see the hole I want the pin tended so I know where to putt.

[Mr. Bean]

12 minutes ago, dhacker56 said:

I prefer to not have the pin in the hole when I putt.  But if I can not see the hole I want the pin tended so I know where to putt.

 

Must admire your optimism. You cannot see the hole but still believe you can find it with your ball.

[amace04]

2 hours ago, naval2006 said:

Anyways, who has a flag attended at WRX level? LOL

Who doesn't?

[Mr. Bean]

3 minutes ago, amace04 said:

Who doesn't?

 

What would be the purpose of having the pin attended?

[naval2006]

I like the pin out as much as possible but after the new rule I wouldn't ask another golfer to attend the flag when it's not necessary anymore.  At least all the people I play with have stopped doing that altogether.   We just ask flag in or out?

[TwistedSister]

1 hour ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Must admire your optimism. You cannot see the hole but still believe you can find it with your ball.

I have a better putting stroke than I do vision.  Our greens are large and have a lot of undulation.