Are MMT shafts going to swingweight higher than other graphites?

[hammergolf]

Thinking about going back to an older set of irons as the newer hotter faced, stronger lofted, lower spinning irons just don’t seem to work as well for me. Thinking about either going back to Eye 2 or g25 irons. I’m definitely going to reshaft with graphite around 80 ish grams. My question is I know the Eye2 heads were light and I would like to get them around d2 if possible without going crazy with shaft length. 

[Buzzkill]

Curious too.  I’ll eventually want to reshaft my Cat Eyes, I know with Steelfibers, I’ll loss 3 swing weight points, not sure with about Recoils or MMTs.

[hammergolf]

23 minutes ago, Buzzkill said:

Curious too.  I’ll eventually want to reshaft my Cat Eyes, I know with Steelfibers, I’ll loss 3 swing weight points, not sure with about Recoils or MMTs.

I can only relate what happened to me with my PXG irons. The MMTs swingweight at d2 and they were d0 with steelfibers in them.

[raggal62]

I just shafted a 270 gram 7 iron head with a MMT 80 @ 37". With a 50 gram grip and no tip weights it swingweights D2.

[hammergolf]

3 hours ago, raggal62 said:

I just shafted a 270 gram 7 iron head with a MMT 80 @ 37". With a 50 gram grip and no tip weights it swingweights D2.

I won’t know my head weights until I get the irons and pull them. Found a set of Eye 2 + no + in great shape for a good deal. 

[Feelingofgreatness]

Love my mmt in pxg gen4 heads, D3 swing weight with 80S shaft. Never going back to steel again. 

[Red4282]

It all depends on which shaft you compare it too. The mmt is definitely on the heavier side of the swingweight spectrum

[phizzy30]

Eric at New Level built mine and they came out to D3, 1/4' short. 

[mogc60]

They will swingweight heavier than any graphite on the market. My son has had recoil proto 125, Fuji tour spec 115 and the MMT 125. MMT was 3 points heavier than the recoil and 2 points heavier than the Fuji. 

[hammergolf]

1 hour ago, mogc60 said:

They will swingweight heavier than any graphite on the market. My son has had recoil proto 125, Fuji tour spec 115 and the MMT 125. MMT was 3 points heavier than the recoil and 2 points heavier than the Fuji. 

Great, that’s what I was hoping for.

[pjc]

I believe that the MMT and Recoil (most) iron shafts are designed with low balance point's.  That's really all it takes to get "normal" swing weights, except in extremely light shafts, may have to use some tip weights or something.  Aerotek, and a lot of Nippon's have higher balance points, they say for easier to swing??

[driveandputtmachine]

51 minutes ago, pjc said:

I believe that the MMT and Recoil (most) iron shafts are designed with low balance point's.  That's really all it takes to get "normal" swing weights, except in extremely light shafts, may have to use some tip weights or something.  Aerotek, and a lot of Nippon's have higher balance points, they say for easier to swing??

I believe when I tried the 110, 110 proto, 125 and 125 proto, the proto's always swingweighted lighter than the standard recoils, but it has been 7 years since I tested the recoils.   I still have my back-up set of irons with 110 standards.

[Vincent Paquin]

Hello guys, you all seems to know alot about shaft/weight etc
I am currently buying a sets of irons head and I was wondering how do I know what kind of shaft I should put onto them?

I really like the idea of going graphite, the MMT seems like a nice shaft but I wouldn't know which weight I should be buying 

And after that, once I have the shaft, the head, the ferrule, do I just bring them to someone who builds clubs for a living and let him do his thing?

[Pepperturbo]

Swing weight depends on head weight, shaft weight, # of wraps and grip weight.

 

I have both MMT 105s and 125s shaft sets.  Recently pulled MMT 125s (I love those shafts) to install 105s (not as much love.)  MMT 125s easily swing weighted at D2, and MMT 105s easily swing weighted at D1.  

[ForTourUseOnly]

Yes the 105TX and the 125TX swingweight about a point heavier than a DGX100

 

they are very low balance point for graphite which makes it easier to build to normal lengths or even short if needed

[shellbmb]

I found the MMT to be on the heavier side in line with PX and DG.  I did some test builds a while back and kept a chart of all the shafts I tried which is attached.  Same head and same grip so only variable was the shaft. 

 

My only issue with the MMT is the inside diameter of the shaft is quite narrow so if you need to add any swing weight, tip weights are hard to fit.  You have to bore out the inner diameter to get it to fit.  

 

Another thing I also found interesting with my build was I was debating between a T100 and ZX7.  The ZX7 heads had a little deeper insertion depth than the T100 so it made the ZX7 swing weight out a tad heavier which was nice for my goals.  I think the BBGM of the T100 was 1.25" and the ZX7 was 1.0".  Ended up building the ZX7s and has worked out well.  

[Gerr]

Something to consider is what the balance point of a shaft is as that can have an impact on SW.  Not sure what MMT's is vs other graphite shafts.

 

For the same reason that was mentioned in the original post, I am building a set of  Maltby TE Forged irons with MMT 80 Stiff shafts.  Should be interesting.

[Russ757]

My 105s and scoring Wedges all ended up abt 2 pts heavier 

[Russ757]

On 11/7/2022 at 3:54 PM, Pepperturbo said:

Swing weight depends on head weight, shaft weight, # of wraps and grip weight.

 

I have both MMT 105s and 125s shaft sets.  Recently pulled MMT 125s (I love those shafts) to install 105s (not as much love.)  MMT 125s easily swing weighted at D2, and MMT 105s easily swing weighted at D1.  

As they are abt 10 grams different doesn't that make sense? 

[Pepperturbo]

On 11/10/2022 at 10:10 AM, Gerr said:

Something to consider is what the balance point of a shaft is as that can have an impact on SW.  Not sure what MMT's is vs other graphite shafts.

 

For the same reason that was mentioned in the original post, I am building a set of  Maltby TE Forged irons with MMT 80 Stiff shafts.  Should be interesting.

IMO - MMT shafts are a tad more stout due to composite materials, compared to other basic non-composite graphite shafts.  In my experience, bend and kick point are similar in MMT 105TX and 125TX, mid-high, which fits my tempo, a tad higher than mid-bend 105s.  I also have a set of Tensei AV White, high bend shafts which I really liked, and currently testing Tensei AV Red AM(2) low-mid bend shafts.  For some unexplained reason, I do well with mid-high or high bend or low/mid-bend.  Good luck on your build.

Edited November 12, 2022 by Pepperturbo

[Birddog2]

On 11/7/2022 at 12:54 PM, Pepperturbo said:

Swing weight depends on head weight, shaft weight, # of wraps and grip weight.

Don't forget about shaft length. Over length shafts will increase SW.

[Valtiel]

As stated MMT Iron shafts do indeed have a very low balance point designed to mimic steel. Balance point changes a bit based on weight and flex with the lighter weight classes in softer flexes (55g-95g) actually swingweighting heavier than Dynamic Gold steel and the heavier classes (105-125) in stiffer flexes being very similar. 

[Gerr]

I think it comes down to if the MMT 80 Stiff will play closer in flex to a Modus3 105 Stiff or Regular.

 

Modus3 105 Stiff was my previous favorite shaft, got the MMT because of the limited shaft options PXG had without an upcharge and didn't care of the Elevate 95's.  Due to a slower and smoother swing(driver went from 100mph semi-aggressive to 94mph moderate), I wanted the same or lighter than the Modus3 105 Stiff, but also more flexible due, but not all the way to regular.  I went with a 1/2" soft tipped MMT 80 Stiff, but have found my swing to be more random than it was with the Modus3 shafts, maybe too light and/or too flexible?  Considering a reshaft, but before I do that, looking to get more info on what I have.

Edited November 14, 2022 by Gerr

[WristySwing]

For anyone wondering --- just did a build with these for a client.  SM9 wedges, +3/4", MMT 125 Scoring, NDMC grips.  D6.6, D9, D9.9 on 50, 56, 60.  Nothing we could do to lighten them except either shorten (which he didn't want to do) or ream heads a bit also something he didn't want to do.  CB the grips is only a trick on the scale and doesn't change total weight.  Had another guy earlier in the season, P790, MMT 125 +1/2 with Z-Grip Mids.  They came out to D6-D7 IIRC.  In short, these SW HEAVY! 

[MrVanillaGorilla]

On 11/14/2022 at 2:51 PM, WristySwing said:

For anyone wondering --- just did a build with these for a client.  SM9 wedges, +3/4", MMT 125 Scoring, NDMC grips.  D6.6, D9, D9.9 on 50, 56, 60.  Nothing we could do to lighten them except either shorten (which he didn't want to do) or ream heads a bit also something he didn't want to do.  CB the grips is only a trick on the scale and doesn't change total weight.  Had another guy earlier in the season, P790, MMT 125 +1/2 with Z-Grip Mids.  They came out to D6-D7 IIRC.  In short, these SW HEAVY! 

I am considering getting the new P790s with the MMT 125 stiffs.  I currently play the AI200s with Project X 6.0 at 1.25" over standard.  Swingweight on these are D7 and I love that feel.  Sounds like Swingweight should be around D8 with these if I go 1.25"?  

[WristySwing]

10 hours ago, MrVanillaGorilla said:

I am considering getting the new P790s with the MMT 125 stiffs.  I currently play the AI200s with Project X 6.0 at 1.25" over standard.  Swingweight on these are D7 and I love that feel.  Sounds like Swingweight should be around D8 with these if I go 1.25"?  

 

Without knowing the head weights and grip weights it is just a guess. Based on my experience that sounds about right. You can also specify to TM that you want a target swing weight around that level.

[harms39]

I've been reviewing these forums about MMT swing weights for a while as I've been playing them, and am trying to dial things in.

 

I started with Titleist T100s with MMT 95S. They swing weight to D4-D5, but I didn't have a good feel for the club head. Static weight too low I guess. Added a ton of lead tape to get the set up to D6-D8 and they work much better for me, but I don't think it's the ideal setup.

 

I also missed the feeling of Japanese forged irons, so I ordered a set of Miura TC-202s, 1/4" long, MMT 105S (ss 1x) in the irons through 50 degree wedge, MMT 125S in the 54/60 degree wedges. Oddly - the 54 degree wedge (D4.5-D5) swing weights about 1.0-1.5 points lower than the long irons (~D6)!  Now, if you look at a raw MMT shaft, you'll see there's a lot of material toward the tip (the internal diameter is tiny). So my theory is that when you go from 105 to 125 models, the only place to add the extra 20 grams is higher in the shaft which actually moves the balance point up. So even though the shaft is heavier, it will swing weight lower.

 

I spoke with Mitsubishi customer service earlier today to ask about this. The rep said he hears this a lot and based on his understanding of how the shafts are made, he agreed that's probably what's going on. To confirm 100%, he'd have to dig into more details shaft specifications, but I didn't care to ask him to go to that much trouble. He did mention that the 125 scoring wedge shafts have a lower balance point than the 125 iron shafts, but unfortunately Miura doesn't offer the scoring wedge.

 

It should be a simple fix for me. I'll just choke up on the irons for now, and then when I re-grip them I will trim the butt 1/4" (I ordered them long planning on doing this, but wanted the option after I could feel the swing weights). Should bring them down to ~D4 with plenty of static weight, which should work well. For the wedges, I'll try adding a bit of lead tape as I like the swing weight closer to the D7-D9 range.