New to SoCal, looking at Rolling Hills CC

[caligolfer2103]

Just moved to Torrance and the two closest private clubs are Palos Verdes GC and Rolling Hills CC. PVGC is much more reasonably priced, but the wait list is 5 years! RHCC is more reasonable wait time but initiation + dues have skyrocketed since re-opening... I'm curious, for those who have played it, what their thoughts are for that course as an every day course? I grew up playing the non-links style courses up in NorCal so the links style with wide open fairways and big rolling greens is foreign to me. Almost seems boring, if I dare say. I've played links style courses in the past but those tended to have more undulation along the course that created really interesting lies versus RHCC seems somewhat flat so then the main challenge seems to be whether you can putt on these greens. Long post and my question is long-winded, but given the few options available nearby, I was hoping RHCC would be a no brainer, but questioning whether it's actually worth trying to join (fwiw, it's still a 2+ year wait list).

Edited February 7, 2023 by caligolfer2103

[delftw]

Played the old course prolly 100+ times. Played the redesign 3 times, my buddys dad is a member...what a difference in the 2 layouts lol. I wouldnt call RHCC flat by any means, many downhill/uphill shots. It is definitely a course I could play everyday. I understand prices in So Cal are inflated vs the rest of the country, but last I heard, somewhere in the ballpark of $190/200K..? Me personally, I'd look elsewhere. Still a good course though

[caligolfer2103]

27 minutes ago, delftw said:

Played the old course prolly 100+ times. Played the redesign 3 times, my buddys dad is a member...what a difference in the 2 layouts lol. I wouldnt call RHCC flat by any means, many downhill/uphill shots. It is definitely a course I could play everyday. I understand prices in So Cal are inflated vs the rest of the country, but last I heard, somewhere in the ballpark of $190/200K..? Me personally, I'd look elsewhere. Still a good course though

Yeah, it's running $200k, which just doesn't feel like good value for money. What else is close by though? That's the challenge. The only public course that seems decently easy to get on these days is Terranea's par 3 and maybe Trump, which is pretty pricey itself.

 

Not that I felt RHCC was a bad course by any stretch. Just wasn't sure that I wouldn't get bored playing it. If it were an option, I'd go with PVGC any day of the week.

[tw422]

RHCC is a good course but not great.  PVGC in my opinion is a better course but RHCC is a better overall experience.  Certainly not worth $200k and >$1000 month in dues.  Trump National is just not a good course.  Boring and overly penal.  Public and private golf in the South Bay is tough. Terrible options and either ridiculously expensive or impossible to get tee times on public courses with 5 hr rounds.  

[caligolfer2103]

3 hours ago, tw422 said:

RHCC is a good course but not great.  PVGC in my opinion is a better course but RHCC is a better overall experience.  Certainly not worth $200k and >$1000 month in dues.  Trump National is just not a good course.  Boring and overly penal.  Public and private golf in the South Bay is tough. Terrible options and either ridiculously expensive or impossible to get tee times on public courses with 5 hr rounds.  

Yah, that's the problem... I'm actually not a big golfer, but my 12 yo plays a lot. And so the debate is try to join RHCC (we live < 5 min away) bc the practice facilities are great + the course access vs. getting a nice home "range" set up + supplementing with mooching at friends at PVGC / RHCC for 10 - 15+ rounds a year + playing Terranea a lot, which seems like a great place to get iron / short game work in + using the practice green at Los Verdes. I guess I'm leaning to the latter as it doesn't seem to make sense to spend $250k over the next 6 years to primarily help my kid play golf + for me to play the occasional round.

[tw422]

22 hours ago, caligolfer2103 said:

Yah, that's the problem... I'm actually not a big golfer, but my 12 yo plays a lot. And so the debate is try to join RHCC (we live < 5 min away) bc the practice facilities are great + the course access vs. getting a nice home "range" set up + supplementing with mooching at friends at PVGC / RHCC for 10 - 15+ rounds a year + playing Terranea a lot, which seems like a great place to get iron / short game work in + using the practice green at Los Verdes. I guess I'm leaning to the latter as it doesn't seem to make sense to spend $250k over the next 6 years to primarily help my kid play golf + for me to play the occasional round.

Totally get it and the lure of RHCC being so close makes it tempting.  But man, I've looked at the math (and yes, I get it, private clubs never make financial sense) and that $250k turns into $500-$1M or more in terms of missed opportunity costs over the long.  For that, could send your son to IMG Academy! 

 

You mentioned that you are new to LA (maybe CA?) and what I've found is there are people where money is no object and can write a $200k check with no issue and no concern about missing on future gains and then there are the rest of us.....

 

Getting philosophical here I've found CA to be a really interesting place mainly comprised of the have's and have nots and the have nots are by no means "poor" (can't be to afford a house here).  They are mainly house poor or trying to keep up with the Jones'.  Tough to assess overall but it feels like the crowd that is in LACC, Bel Air, Brentwood and Wilshire are either legacy members that got a better deal (rightfully so) or those where money is no object (a lot of that in LA).  

[caligolfer2103]

7 hours ago, tw422 said:

Totally get it and the lure of RHCC being so close makes it tempting.  But man, I've looked at the math (and yes, I get it, private clubs never make financial sense) and that $250k turns into $500-$1M or more in terms of missed opportunity costs over the long.  For that, could send your son to IMG Academy! 

 

You mentioned that you are new to LA (maybe CA?) and what I've found is there are people where money is no object and can write a $200k check with no issue and no concern about missing on future gains and then there are the rest of us.....

 

Getting philosophical here I've found CA to be a really interesting place mainly comprised of the have's and have nots and the have nots are by no means "poor" (can't be to afford a house here).  They are mainly house poor or trying to keep up with the Jones'.  Tough to assess overall but it feels like the crowd that is in LACC, Bel Air, Brentwood and Wilshire are either legacy members that got a better deal (rightfully so) or those where money is no object (a lot of that in LA).  

We are relatively new to LA but have been in SF / Bay Area for a decade, so the money culture is not new to us. Financially, we've been lucky but not in the "FU" money sense. So, while we could afford the initiation, it's definitely not a no brainer decision and the cost / benefit is definitely weighing on me. It'd be one thing if my wife and other son played, but it's really just younger son + me and so outside of him having a great place to practice / play, it's not like the whole family is going to spend every day there.

 

I think we'll join the waitlist and make a decision when the time comes. Hopefully, I'll have FU money by then ;)

[tw422]

On 2/8/2023 at 5:33 PM, caligolfer2103 said:

We are relatively new to LA but have been in SF / Bay Area for a decade, so the money culture is not new to us. Financially, we've been lucky but not in the "FU" money sense. So, while we could afford the initiation, it's definitely not a no brainer decision and the cost / benefit is definitely weighing on me. It'd be one thing if my wife and other son played, but it's really just younger son + me and so outside of him having a great place to practice / play, it's not like the whole family is going to spend every day there.

 

I think we'll join the waitlist and make a decision when the time comes. Hopefully, I'll have FU money by then 😉

Totally get it - I lived up in Marin for a few years before moving down to Manhattan Beach. There's wealth/comfort and then there is FU money comfort level (varying levels of that here and in SF/Bay Area too).  I'm in the same boat as you - I could not justify writing the check for RHCC and/or Virginia CC for just me as I'm the only one who would play golf (PVGC is only golf). 

 

I'm with you and hoping the FU money is just around the corner.  Then we go to Riviera, LACC or Bel Air (assuming they would even let us in)! 

 

It's a shame there are no mid level clubs close to the South Bay where you can write a 5 figure check (comfortably) and have reasonable dues with good facilities for a family (more so in Orange County).  

[Tarheelnation3]

On 2/8/2023 at 9:58 AM, tw422 said:

Totally get it and the lure of RHCC being so close makes it tempting.  But man, I've looked at the math (and yes, I get it, private clubs never make financial sense) and that $250k turns into $500-$1M or more in terms of missed opportunity costs over the long.  For that, could send your son to IMG Academy! 

 

You mentioned that you are new to LA (maybe CA?) and what I've found is there are people where money is no object and can write a $200k check with no issue and no concern about missing on future gains and then there are the rest of us.....

 

Getting philosophical here I've found CA to be a really interesting place mainly comprised of the have's and have nots and the have nots are by no means "poor" (can't be to afford a house here).  They are mainly house poor or trying to keep up with the Jones'.  Tough to assess overall but it feels like the crowd that is in LACC, Bel Air, Brentwood and Wilshire are either legacy members that got a better deal (rightfully so) or those where money is no object (a lot of that in LA).  

 

Brentwood and Wilshire are NOT in the same stratosphere cost-wise as LACC and Bel Air. As to actual golf, LACC is in its own category and Brentwood is just a terrible track IMO.

 

As to the OP's question, RHCC is a solid course to play once every couple of months. It has about 13-14 really solid "links" style holes, but there are 3-4 that just remind you of the old course and seem out of place in a "links" style course. It isn't particularly difficult to play and is definitely different than 95% of all SoCal courses. The cost of initiation is absurd and if you're dropping that kind of money, join Riv or LACC (although I understand the distance issue). I know they both have waitlists, but I would almost bet you a paycheck that if you got on both, you'd likely get into PVGC just as quickly as you will RHCC. 

 

If I HAD to choose one of the two clubs to join, I would go with PVGC. It's a course I would rather play on a "regular" basis. However, the overall experience is better at RHCC (but I would get bored quickly with the course). 

Edited February 13, 2023 by Tarheelnation3

[caligolfer2103]

On 2/12/2023 at 9:55 PM, Tarheelnation3 said:

 

Brentwood and Wilshire are NOT in the same stratosphere cost-wise as LACC and Bel Air. As to actual golf, LACC is in its own category and Brentwood is just a terrible track IMO.

 

As to the OP's question, RHCC is a solid course to play once every couple of months. It has about 13-14 really solid "links" style holes, but there are 3-4 that just remind you of the old course and seem out of place in a "links" style course. It isn't particularly difficult to play and is definitely different than 95% of all SoCal courses. The cost of initiation is absurd and if you're dropping that kind of money, join Riv or LACC (although I understand the distance issue). I know they both have waitlists, but I would almost bet you a paycheck that if you got on both, you'd likely get into PVGC just as quickly as you will RHCC. 

 

If I HAD to choose one of the two clubs to join, I would go with PVGC. It's a course I would rather play on a "regular" basis. However, the overall experience is better at RHCC (but I would get bored quickly with the course). 

Thanks! That's helpful. We're actually happy social members at RHCC, so I know what you mean about the overall experience. It's fantastic for young families. Sadly, I think the waitlist at RHCC is ~2 years while at PVGC, they told me it is 5+ years!!!  But your detailed thoughts on the overall course structure confirm a lot of what I was thinking. Given it's mostly my younger son who's playing, I think we're going to just manage with him playing mostly at the Terranea par 3 which is a great iron / wedge training course for him. In the meantime, we'll join the waitlist at RHCC and he decides to get serious about golf in a few years, we'll consider pulling the trigger just so he can practice to his heart's desire (we live within walking distance, so there really is no comparably convenient spot for him.)

[AzRoger]

3 hours ago, caligolfer2103 said:

Given it's mostly my younger son who's playing, I think we're going to just manage with him playing mostly at the Terranea par 3 which is a great iron / wedge training course for him. 

That worked pretty good for Tiger, when he was a young kid his mom would drop him off at the Heartwell par 3 course and driving range in Long Beach and he would spend the day there.

[Tarheelnation3]

4 hours ago, caligolfer2103 said:

Thanks! That's helpful. We're actually happy social members at RHCC, so I know what you mean about the overall experience. It's fantastic for young families. Sadly, I think the waitlist at RHCC is ~2 years while at PVGC, they told me it is 5+ years!!!  But your detailed thoughts on the overall course structure confirm a lot of what I was thinking. Given it's mostly my younger son who's playing, I think we're going to just manage with him playing mostly at the Terranea par 3 which is a great iron / wedge training course for him. In the meantime, we'll join the waitlist at RHCC and he decides to get serious about golf in a few years, we'll consider pulling the trigger just so he can practice to his heart's desire (we live within walking distance, so there really is no comparably convenient spot for him.)

I definitely get the distance thing. I lived across the street (105 yards from the tenth tee box to be very exact) at my club for 5 years and being able to walk there at any time was HUGE in terms of an incentive to golf and/or practice. 

[caligolfer2103]

11 hours ago, AzRoger said:

That worked pretty good for Tiger, when he was a young kid his mom would drop him off at the Heartwell par 3 course and driving range in Long Beach and he would spend the day there.

Ah, I didn't realize he grew up on Heartwell! That's pretty cool. Will have to mention that the next time my son plays there.

[tw422]

1 hour ago, caligolfer2103 said:

Ah, I didn't realize he grew up on Heartwell! That's pretty cool. Will have to mention that the next time my son plays there.

From what I was told by long time residents and the pro shop he used to jump the fence to play at the Navy Destroyer Course in Long Beach too.  Might be urban legend but he did grow up in that area.

[daegyu]

On 2/12/2023 at 9:55 PM, Tarheelnation3 said:

 

Brentwood and Wilshire are NOT in the same stratosphere cost-wise as LACC and Bel Air. As to actual golf, LACC is in its own category and Brentwood is just a terrible track IMO.

 

As to the OP's question, RHCC is a solid course to play once every couple of months. It has about 13-14 really solid "links" style holes, but there are 3-4 that just remind you of the old course and seem out of place in a "links" style course. It isn't particularly difficult to play and is definitely different than 95% of all SoCal courses. The cost of initiation is absurd and if you're dropping that kind of money, join Riv or LACC (although I understand the distance issue). I know they both have waitlists, but I would almost bet you a paycheck that if you got on both, you'd likely get into PVGC just as quickly as you will RHCC. 

 

If I HAD to choose one of the two clubs to join, I would go with PVGC. It's a course I would rather play on a "regular" basis. However, the overall experience is better at RHCC (but I would get bored quickly with the course). 

Can you even get on the waitlist for LACC or Riviera without knowing someone? LACC is just something else. I'm a nobody and I could join Wilshire through a couple of contacts. 

[So_Cal]

On 2/12/2023 at 9:55 PM, Tarheelnation3 said:

 

Brentwood and Wilshire are NOT in the same stratosphere cost-wise as LACC and Bel Air. As to actual golf, LACC is in its own category and Brentwood is just a terrible track IMO.

 

As to the OP's question, RHCC is a solid course to play once every couple of months. It has about 13-14 really solid "links" style holes, but there are 3-4 that just remind you of the old course and seem out of place in a "links" style course. It isn't particularly difficult to play and is definitely different than 95% of all SoCal courses. The cost of initiation is absurd and if you're dropping that kind of money, join Riv or LACC (although I understand the distance issue). I know they both have waitlists, but I would almost bet you a paycheck that if you got on both, you'd likely get into PVGC just as quickly as you will RHCC. 

 

If I HAD to choose one of the two clubs to join, I would go with PVGC. It's a course I would rather play on a "regular" basis. However, the overall experience is better at RHCC (but I would get bored quickly with the course). 

Do you really think Brentwood is that bad.  I played the post renovation course in a qualifier.  The greens are lightning fast and smooth and the naturalized areas very pretty.  I thought it was above average 

[Tarheelnation3]

5 minutes ago, So_Cal said:

Do you really think Brentwood is that bad.  I played the post renovation course in a qualifier.  The greens are lightning fast and smooth and the naturalized areas very pretty.  I thought it was above average 

Yes, yes I do. Let's put it this way. I was asked to play in team play there and I turned it down.

[So_Cal]

13 minutes ago, Tarheelnation3 said:

Yes, yes I do. Let's put it this way. I was asked to play in team play there and I turned it down.

Fair enough 

[Yoshifan151]

16 hours ago, daegyu said:

Can you even get on the waitlist for LACC or Riviera without knowing someone? LACC is just something else. I'm a nobody and I could join Wilshire through a couple of contacts. 

Riv is a bit easier since it's corporate owned. LACC you need like 10 references at the minimum lol.

[So_Cal]

I was a little disappointed in LA North.  Don’t get me wrong it’s a great course I was just expecting something like Merion or Augusta based on its ranking.  It’s excellent like top 25 US, but I think top 10 is a little too high.  

[Tarheelnation3]

4 hours ago, So_Cal said:

I was a little disappointed in LA North.  Don’t get me wrong it’s a great course I was just expecting something like Merion or Augusta based on its ranking.  It’s excellent like top 25 US, but I think top 10 is a little too high.  

Agree. Give me Riv all day every day (between the two). 

[caligolfer2103]

Got a chance to replay RHCC this weekend. Fun day, beautiful weather. However, I have to say I was surprised by the condition of the course. TBF, I haven't played other SoCal private golf courses, but even comparing against the NorCal country club course we belonged to before moving to LA (very low key and cheap), this course was in bad shape. Significant dead grass patches through out, divot marks galore throughout the fairway, greens (which seem to have been just punched / fixed up) were already pockmarked with ball marks all over, and weeds everywhere. Was definitely caught off guard and now I'm curious to see how other courses in the area area holding up... but, at least it makes my decision to join the waitlist or not a lot easier.

[pb_n_joe]

I moved down to Marina Del Rey from San Francisco two years ago and I share the same sentiment on how difficult it has been to find a decent private club at the right price and within a reasonable radius. Also looked at PVGC and Rolling Hills in addition to every other club between Encino (el Cab, Braemar, Mountaingate, etc.) down to Long Beach (VCC, Old Ranch).

 

@caligolfer2103 The tough reality is we're both just a couple of years late to the scene. PVGC didn't have a waitlist pre-covid and RHCC jacked up prices post-renovation. Either one would have been a great option at the right price. I agree it's tough to justify the current initiation and $2k monthly dues for RHCC

 

Re: Brentwood, I have to disagree with @Tarheelnation3 on this one. While not as fun as LACC, Riv, El Cab, Bel Air, I think it's still a great challenging track and would happily play there again any time. Good enough to host a US Open qualifier if that means anything. Cost wise - it's in the same ballpark as RHCC. Initiation for LACC is way lower, but requires 10000x more work on the networking side and years of relationship building before consideration.

[caligolfer2103]

Yep. Luckily (I guess), I'm a very very casual golfer, as in I'm fine with it in my life but fine without it as well. It's really my son who I was trying to find a "home" course to practice at that was the issue. For now, I've cobbled together a "solution" through a mix of an indoor golf studio (for technical work), our backyard (for putting and light chipping), RHCC (where we are social members and can get access to the course / practice area through the various junior programs) and Terranea / Trump for short game / on course practice. It's definitely less convenient, but I think it may end up being more effective in the end as Terranea and Trump seem to offer more typical golf course challenges than RHCC anyways. But, that's probably sour grapes because I'm not a member, lol! That being said, there's a nugget of truth as my son tends to score very well at RHCC when he does get an opportunity to play and he's consistently a few strokes back at other courses bc they are more punishing off the tee and to get on the green.

[Schley]

First world problems, but I'd be inclined to go with the closer course.  There are other benefits of club culture like networking, pool and dining for the family, junior programs, utilizing your pro to access other courses occasionally.  I have played pvgc but not rhgc post renovation.  Mclay kidd made a pretty dramatic redo there.  Initially it was well received, I'm also surprised to learn it wasn't in good shape.  Sometimes supers screw up on the chemicals and lose areas.  Hope it comes back.

 

As land is a premium there aren't many courses. Great for other things but golf is tough for anywhere under an hour drive.

[caligolfer2103]

We started practicing / playing more at Harbor Park. 10 minutes from home and small but very efficient short game practice area + $3 greens fee for the kid make it a no brainer. Will see how it works out for rest of the year and whether I start to get annoyed by having to drive him every time he wants to practice / play.

[Calichica]

Hi all. I very appreciate this conversation as I’ve just moved back to the Southbay and am looking for a golf home. I’m a single women and probably cannot afford those fees at PVCC or RHCC. Are there any more reasonably priced clubs in Long Beach or inland people would recommend?? I doubt I have the network for LACC. Thanks!

[rhccmember]

I'm certainly biased as a current RHCC member, but we absolutely love being members there and play the course all the time with zero boredom.  It's a family club and the staff is incredible, we love it.   Feels like we are on vacation every time we step foot on the property. Zero regrets whatsoever paying the initiation fee or ongoing monthly dues.   We live in Hermosa Beach and the 15 to 20 minute drive is totally worth it.