Using cigar smoke to determine wind direction

[Mr. Bean]

6 minutes ago, Pepperturbo said:

 

 

The world doesn't revolve around your or my wishes.  The people you talk of do that because cigarette butts don't disintegrate.  I as much as said that.  If I smoked cigarettes I wouldn't throw them on the ground either, but I wouldn't throw them in the course trash receptacles either, not even in a cup.  That's how fires start.   

 

 

On my home course we have ash trays attached to ball washing devices by every tee box. But not only that, people around here are clever enough to extinguish the butts with water before throwing them into a trash bin. That's how you avoid fires.

[Golferpaul]

On 5/11/2023 at 4:35 PM, Mr. Bean said:

 

You know, some smokers around here carry a small plastic cup with a lid and they put the cigarette butts in it. Then they empty it after the round. Very smart, neat and safe. But I am sure you will come up with reasons why you could not do the same.

Cigarette butts don't decompose very fast because they contain plastic and they should not be tossed on the ground.  Cigar stubs decompose.

[Mr. Bean]

8 hours ago, Golferpaul said:

Cigarette butts don't decompose very fast because they contain plastic and they should not be tossed on the ground.  Cigar stubs decompose.

 

So do snuff pillows but still they look disgusting on the grass, just like cigar stubs. That is why they should NOT be tossed around on the course DESPITE the fact that they decompose. Throwing trash on the course is simply rude and adolecent behavior, period.

 

The plastic cup is a way of avoiding setting trash bins on fire, otherwise those smokers would toss their cigarette butts in a trash bin nearby.

[Augster]

Banana peels shouldn’t be thrown in bag less trash cans also. Someone is going to have to physically peel it out of there. (See what I did?)

 

If the course has bagless trash cans, throw the banana peel somewhere it won’t be seen in the environment. Trash workers at your course thank you in advance. 

[stevopagolf]

On 5/10/2023 at 1:12 PM, nsxguy said:

 

Why ? His playing partner was right.

 

Have you even read the previous dozen or so posts prior to yours ?

Yes I read all those posts.  My opinion is that it is ridiculous.  Do you think smoke at 6 feet is going to give you the real indication of what the wind is doing 100 feet in the air?   Did you see golf from the 60 and 70s where a large percentage of PGA players smoked cigarettes?   Do you think Arnie was penalized for "wind aiding" ?  NO

[Mr. Bean]

23 minutes ago, Augster said:

Banana peels shouldn’t be thrown in bag less trash cans also. Someone is going to have to physically peel it out of there. (See what I did?)

 

Oh my, you guys sure are way behind in development...

[nsxguy]

15 minutes ago, stevopagolf said:

Yes I read all those posts.  My opinion is that it is ridiculous.  Do you think smoke at 6 feet is going to give you the real indication of what the wind is doing 100 feet in the air?   Did you see golf from the 60 and 70s where a large percentage of PGA players smoked cigarettes?   Do you think Arnie was penalized for "wind aiding" ?  NO

 

Ahhhhh, I see. So you're not claiming using cigar(ette) smoke to determine wind direction ISN'T against the rules.

 

You're a member of the "Rules am stupid" and/or "It's stupid to throw grass (or whatever) to determine wind direction" crowd.

 

Got it. 👍

 

Good grief. What a conundrum for Mr. B !!!

 

 

[stevopagolf]

5 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Ahhhhh, I see. So you're not claiming using cigar(ette) smoke to determine wind direction ISN'T against the rules.

 

You're a member of the "Rules am stupid" and/or "It's stupid to throw grass (or whatever) to determine wind direction" crowd.

 

Got it. 👍

 

Good grief. What a conundrum for Mr. B !!!

 

 

No rules are not stupid.  This interpretation of a rule I find stupid.  Here Jack and Arnie breaking a rule

Edited May 14, 2023 by stevopagolf
picture

[nsxguy]

9 minutes ago, stevopagolf said:

No rules are not stupid.  This interpretation of a rule I find stupid.  Here Jack and Arnie breaking a rule

 

I thought you said you'd read all the prior posts to your original one ?

 

Neither one of them is breaking a rule.

 

Smoking is NOT against the rules.

 

Using the smoke to determine wind direction IS against the rules.

 

That was posted before you originally did, including 1 or more comments as to relying on the integrity of the player.

 

 

Edited May 14, 2023 by nsxguy

[Mr. Bean]

25 minutes ago, stevopagolf said:

Yes I read all those posts.  My opinion is that it is ridiculous.  Do you think smoke at 6 feet is going to give you the real indication of what the wind is doing 100 feet in the air?   Did you see golf from the 60 and 70s where a large percentage of PGA players smoked cigarettes?   Do you think Arnie was penalized for "wind aiding" ?  NO

 

I must say I have no clue why you are participating on the Rules Forum as you do not seem to agree what the Rules are or how they are to be interpreted. Maybe you would be better off on some other forum.

 

But as you are here I will try to explain something to you.

 

Rules are often black and white, and more often they are b&w the better. That means there will be less interpretations to be made on the spot and, even more beneficial, in the Scoring Area.

 

Whether smoke of a cigarette at 6 feet above the ground gives you better information than grass thrown in the air at 6 feet us completely irrelevant. Artificial objects are NOT to be used. It is very clear and for most people easily to be distinguished from natural things.

[Mr. Bean]

2 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

Smoking is NOT against the rules.

 

Using the smoke to SPECIFICALLY determine wind direction IS against the rules.

 

 

Let us be careful out there 😉

[charliebrown]

On 5/5/2023 at 12:52 PM, Golferpaul said:

One of my golf buddies says it is illegal to use cigar smoke to determine wind direction.  I can't find any rule that says it's illegal.  

 

Any thoughts?

I love the internet. 

[ChipStrokes]

late in the final round of the pga championship, i believe it was after his meltdown on 16, hovland and his caddy were discussing an approach shot.

 

they were trying to gauge the wind and one said to the other "look at the american flag on the clubhouse, it's coming in off the left" or something to that effect.

 

allowed? not allowed? or does no one really care?

[Mr. Bean]

2 hours ago, ChipStrokes said:

late in the final round of the pga championship, i believe it was after his meltdown on 16, hovland and his caddy were discussing an approach shot.

 

they were trying to gauge the wind and one said to the other "look at the american flag on the clubhouse, it's coming in off the left" or something to that effect.

 

allowed? not allowed? or does no one really care?

 

I believe 2 out of 3 of your questions have been answered in this thread already. Afa the 3rd is concerned all those care who want to play by the Rules.

[ChipStrokes]

15 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

I believe 2 out of 3 of your questions have been answered in this thread already. Afa the 3rd is concerned all those care who want to play by the Rules.

with all eyes on the final group of a major and the situation being discussed loudly enough for the broadcast to catch it clearly, why wasn’t it addressed and penalized?

[Mr. Bean]

1 hour ago, ChipStrokes said:

with all eyes on the final group of a major and the situation being discussed loudly enough for the broadcast to catch it clearly, why wasn’t it addressed and penalized?

 

Are you asking this seriously..?

[ChipStrokes]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Are you asking this seriously..?

i am. 

[Mr. Bean]

Well. the flag had not been put there by Hovland or his caddie so the information that flag gave was public information and everyone was free to use it.

 

This has been explained in this thread that if there are any objects or substances the player has not put into place himself or with the purpose of gauging the wind it is allowed to use any information such objects or substances give to any player.

[ChipStrokes]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

Well. the flag had not been put there by Hovland or his caddie so the information that flag gave was public information and everyone was free to use it.

 

This has been explained in this thread that if there are any objects or substances the player has not put into place himself or with the purpose of gauging the wind it is allowed to use any information such objects or substances give to any player.

i think it was also said in this thread that smoke from the clubhouse chimney couldn’t be used to gauge wind. 

 

why can a flag be used to do it but chimney smoke can’t?

 

neither was out there by the player or caddy. neither was out there with the sole intention of giving a read on wind. 

[Mr. Bean]

8 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

i think it was also said in this thread that smoke from the clubhouse chimney couldn’t be used to gauge wind. 

 

 

That is not correct. It has been said that it certainly CAN be used. Again, the smoke has not been created by any specific player.

[ChipStrokes]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

That is not correct. It has been said that it certainly CAN be used. Again, the smoke has not been created by any specific player.

i went back and read and see now that you were being tongue in cheek with your reply about the chimney.  my bad. i’m all clear now. 

 

good one, beanbot!!

[Mr. Bean]

12 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

i went back and read and see now that you were being tongue in cheek with your reply about the chimney.  my bad. i’m all clear now. 

 

 

Maybe you had missed my post right after that one:

 

"Anything that is already there you may use but you may not install and use anything artificial to gauge the direction or speed of the wind. Existing things may be trees, flags, smoke, dust, tumbleweed, dead leaves and even publicly available weather data from a nearby weather station. You yourself may make use of anything natural you find from the course, such as throwing grass or fine dirt in the air."

 

[ChipStrokes]

1 minute ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Maybe you had missed my post right after that one:

 

"Anything that is already there you may use but you may not install and use anything artificial to gauge the direction or speed of the wind. Existing things may be trees, flags, smoke, dust, tumbleweed, dead leaves and even publicly available weather data from a nearby weather station. You yourself may make use of anything natural you find from the course, such as throwing grass or fine dirt in the air."

 

yea i saw it. that was the context that cleared up the first post. 

[Schulzmc]

Mr. Bean’s sarcasm is sometimes so thick it is hard to detect. LOL