US Ryder Cup team selections (*** NO LIV DISCUSSIONS ***)

[Forged4ever]

6 hours ago, Hawkeye77 said:

Not even close to the truth - looks on the faces of most and reporting afterward proved it - no need to make stuff up.

Agree 💯 as of the 12 Players on that 2014 Ryder Cup Team, exactly THREE other Players stood behind Mickelson!!

 

THREE‼️

 

The only one that I'll mention is captain spineless, Johnson. He later called and apologized to Tom though the damage was done.

 

Whatever beef that Mickelson had, and in my 30+ years of knowing Tom, the only exchange that we've EVER had that I would classify as a disagreement was over what Mickelson said. I'm not getting into it here, though he had some valid points. 

 

However, what I disagreed vehemently with was his taking that whole situation public. For any of you that have ever been in either a Collegiate or Professional locker room, you know exactly of what I'm speaking when I say that regardless of the sport, WHAT GOES ON IN THE LOCKER ROOM STAYS IN THE LOCKER ROOM!! THIS IS IMMUTABLE AND NOT SITUATIONAL OR OPTIONAL!!

 

The public did not need to know this. Mickelson could have gone to the PGA Commish, Finchem, or any senior executive, or had a Team only meeting and hashed it out. To take it into the public domain was a chicken💩 move and all I know is that if I'd have been in that locker room, and bear in mind that I happened to have agreed on a few of his points, though I would've dropped him before he got a complete sentence out!! 

 

When someone does what he did, the rules, civility & decorum go out the window and it's time to teach a man a lesson that he will NEVER FORGET!!

 

However, regarding who Mickelson spoke for, he spoke for three other spineless pieces of 💩💩, no more.

 

Stay Well Brotha and Thank You for tellin it like it is👊

Richard 

Edited September 4, 2023 by Forged4ever

[juliette91]

On 8/30/2023 at 9:39 AM, LBB said:

LOL…it’s like all the scouts drooling over JT…classic swing, 5 tool player, he’s got the look, ball pops off the bat…he can really hit.  Then Brad Pitt asks…if he can hit, then why doesn’t he hit good?

 

I know golf is different, but that scene did cross my mind earlier this week when people keep arguing for JT based on a ton of factors other than his current play.  There’s no doubt I will be interested to see how he ends up doing.  It’s good for the forum…LOL.

It just seems unfair to leave out let's say Bradley and choose instead JT.  Their records this year cannot compare.  So what if JT is BFFs with Speith.  Who cares?  And who cares that Sam Burns is Scottie's BFF?  Be true to the hard earned records of the players and for G_d's sake pay attention to the freaking course you're going to be playing.  JT on those fairways with his record this year?  C'mon.  This is not about how to have the most cohesive friends' groups.  Look no further than the Europeans.  I guarantee you that Luke Donald is not going around figuring who will like who and who is someone's great friend.  Great play makes better friends than sympathy for the friend you have as he leaves you high and dry on the course.

[Golferpaul]

21 hours ago, RobS said:

I think I explained it in my prior posts.  Based on his description of the RC as an exhibition, I don't think Woods placed much importance on the matches. Is that what you're questioning or do you not think Tiger is in the discussion for greatest match play player?

Good question. 

 

You have to look at a player's entire match play record, not just the RC or the US Am. 

 

I don't have all the data, but you have to also consider Palmer with an RC record of 22-8-2, a US AM win,  and a World Match Play tournament.

 

Sergio with a 25-13-7 RC record was pretty good.

 

Walter Hagen won five PGA Championships in seven years during the match play era.  Pretty salty.  He also went 7-1-1 in the RC.

 

 

 

 

[Ghost of Snead]

1 hour ago, juliette91 said:

It just seems unfair to leave out let's say Bradley and choose instead JT.  Their records this year cannot compare.  So what if JT is BFFs with Speith.  Who cares?  And who cares that Sam Burns is Scottie's BFF?  Be true to the hard earned records of the players and for G_d's sake pay attention to the freaking course you're going to be playing.  JT on those fairways with his record this year?  C'mon.  This is not about how to have the most cohesive friends' groups.  Look no further than the Europeans.  I guarantee you that Luke Donald is not going around figuring who will like who and who is someone's great friend.  Great play makes better friends than sympathy for the friend you have as he leaves you high and dry on the course.

 

Really ? Why did Lowry get picked over Meronk ?

[Pastit]

13 minutes ago, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Really ? Why did Lowry get picked over Meronk ?

Portuguese Masters, Irish and British Opens, 2nd US Open, I won’t go on.  

[Duct Tape]

2 hours ago, juliette91 said:

It just seems unfair to leave out let's say Bradley and choose instead JT.  Their records this year cannot compare.  So what if JT is BFFs with Speith.  Who cares?  And who cares that Sam Burns is Scottie's BFF?  Be true to the hard earned records of the players and for G_d's sake pay attention to the freaking course you're going to be playing.  JT on those fairways with his record this year?  C'mon.  This is not about how to have the most cohesive friends' groups.  Look no further than the Europeans.  I guarantee you that Luke Donald is not going around figuring who will like who and who is someone's great friend.  Great play makes better friends than sympathy for the friend you have as he leaves you high and dry on the course.

This didn’t play well

 

Rose and Lowery picks (both of whom I greatly like) over others seem JT-like 

[Guest RobS]

25 minutes ago, Golferpaul said:

Good question. 

 

You have to look at a player's entire match play record, not just the RC or the US Am. 

 

I don't have all the data, but you have to also consider Palmer with an RC record of 22-8-2, a US AM win,  and a World Match Play tournament.

 

Sergio with a 25-13-7 RC record was pretty good.

 

Walter Hagen won five PGA Championships in seven years during the match play era.  Pretty salty.  He also went 7-1-1 in the RC.

 

 

 

 

I don't disagree.  There are certainly multiple players in the discussion, especially the old timers like Hagen, Jones and Travis.  I personally find TW's 6 straight USGA Am's, 36-0, to be remarkable.  Hagen wasn't too shabby either with a 34-2 record in the PGA  I looked up Tiger's careers singles record which includes, Cups and various world and wgc match plays and the old PGA Grandslam. He was 53-19-2 in singles and 31-35-2 with a partner.  I honestly have no idea how those numbers stack up.

[juliette91]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Really ? Why did Lowry get picked over Meronk ?

Gulp.  Point taken!

[juliette91]

34 minutes ago, juliette91 said:

Gulp.  Point taken!

You are so right.  Forgot that Meronk actually won on the Ryder Cup course!!!!  Shortsightedness and clubby clubby reign on both sides of the pond.

[Titleist99]

Maybe I misheard Luke Donal claim that Europe lead the US in Ryder Cup victories 24/14. I thought it was 27/14 US, with a tie in there somewhere, but I could be wrong....🙂

 

~I mean, it an exhibition match, who cares....It  means more to Europe than the US in my opinion.....

Edited September 4, 2023 by Titleist99

[Golferpaul]

2 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

Maybe I misheard Luke Donal claim that Europe lead the US in Ryder Cup victories 24/14. I thought it was 27/14 US, with a tie in there somewhere, but I could be wrong....🙂

 

~I mean, it an exhibition match, who cares....It  means more to Europe than the US in my opinion.....

Europe leads 11-9-1 beginning 1979

GB and Ireland trail 3-18-1 up to 1977

The USA leads overall at 27-14-2

 

Why do you call it an exhibition match?  Millions of us think it's the most exciting event in golf. 

 

[Shilgy]

4 hours ago, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Really ? Why did Lowry get picked over Meronk ?

Glad I kept scrolling…I was bout to post the same reply.🤣

[Titleist99]

2 hours ago, Golferpaul said:

Europe leads 11-9-1 beginning 1979

GB and Ireland trail 3-18-1 up to 1977

The USA leads overall at 27-14-2

 

Why do you call it an exhibition match?  Millions of us think it's the most exciting event in golf. 

 

I'm aware, this need to be sent to Luke Donald.....🙂 Luke said that Europe had 21 Ryder cups to the US 17. Just heard it again and Damon Hack didn't correct him.

--------------------------------

"Why do you call it an exhibition match?  Millions of us think it's the most exciting event in golf. "

 

Because it's an event that happens every two years....

Played for minimal cash....

Basically, to showcase the players skills.....

just a friendly match that doesn't mean anything to me......

--------------------------------

I know millions love the Ryder Cup, but that don't make it any less of an exhibition match IMO......

 

 

[Pudgelewis]

4 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

I'm aware, this need to be sent to Luke Donald.....🙂 Luke said that Europe had 21 Ryder cups to the US 17. Just heard it again and Damon Hack didn't correct him.

--------------------------------

"Why do you call it an exhibition match?  Millions of us think it's the most exciting event in golf. "

 

Because it's an event that happens every two years....

Played for minimal cash....

Basically, to showcase the players skills.....

just a friendly match that doesn't mean anything to me......

--------------------------------

I know millions love the Ryder Cup, but that don't make it any less of an exhibition match IMO......

 

 

 

Some striking similarities to the Olympics.  What are your thoughts on those?

[The Aspidistra in the Hall]

Lowry has experience, good experience on the plus side. The downside is his driving under pressure has become erratic and his silky short game similar.

Maybe his selection was like a second marriage, a triumph of hope ove experience..

Meronk shaky in the cauldron is the only thing I can see against him. Unlucky, on balance.

[bscinstnct]

13 hours ago, Golferpaul said:

Europe leads 11-9-1 beginning 1979

GB and Ireland trail 3-18-1 up to 1977

The USA leads overall at 27-14-2

 

Why do you call it an exhibition match?  Millions of us think it's the most exciting event in golf. 

 

 

Cause they all sitting around together in Florida all year everyday, then RC time

 

Rickie go up behind Rory on line at Starbucks say like, “USA, USA!”

 

Rory turn around, “Shutup Rickie, not before my mocha latte” 

 

 

 

[juliette91]

20 hours ago, Duct Tape said:

This didn’t play well

 

Rose and Lowery picks (both of whom I greatly like) over others seem JT-like 

Yes they do but you can’t really compare Lowery’s record this year to JTs.  It’s much more of a nuanced call -even J Rose’s-than Johnson’s pick of JT over Bradley or even Gloved.

[MK7Golf21]

20 hours ago, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Really ? Why did Lowry get picked over Meronk ?

 

No idea how well Meronk played or Lowry this year but you are right, Lowry is one of the most liked players on pga tour from what I hear. Euro team looks very good so it will be interesting to see how USA fairs especially considering they haven't won a ryder cup on Euro soil since 1993 I believe. Plus the USA team isn't some dominate force like the last ryder cup, that team might have won on Euro soil.

[Titleist99]

10 hours ago, Pudgelewis said:

 

Some striking similarities to the Olympics.  What are your thoughts on those?

Biggest Exhibition of them all. Mainly a fund rasing event.....🙂imo

[Forged4ever]

Though I am not close to as familiar with the Euro Team, outside of the automatic qualifiers, as I am with the US Team, I'd like to hear from the Gents across the pond on your thoughts regarding Lukerster leaving Adrian Meronk off of the Team?!?!? Aside from him trailing only Rory & Big John in the race to Dubai. 

 

Meronk won the 2023 Australian Open by 5 shots over Adam Scott while also winning the 2022 Irish Open, which was held at Mount Juliet in County Kilkenny two weeks prior to Cam Smith takin the Open. 

 

Maronk then won his THIRD NATIONAL TITLE IN THE PAST YEAR with his victory at the 2023 Italian Open, held at MARCO SIMONE GOLF CLUB⛳️, host of next month's Friggin Ryder Cup!!!

 

THREE NATIONAL TITLES IN THE YEAR LEADING UP TO THE CUP🏆, ALONG WITH SITTING THIRD BEHIND ONLY RORY & RAHM IN THE RACE TO DUBAI!!!

 

WTDOUBLEF?!?!?

 

Bros, did I miss something???

 

Another point that while it is obviously not a major factor if his Play had not supported him getting selected, however as what I would think would be the cherry on top🍒, would be that he would be the first Pole ever selected to the Team. I'm guessing that the Euros would like to also "grow the game," and I see no better flag bearer than a Player of Adrian Meronk's ilk. Then ya take how he's handled this snub, and he has wayyyyyy more of a beef than any and all of the US's supposed snubbees, which is with Class & Decorum!!!

 

He's handled as very very very few in his shoes would have!!

 

So, is more to this than what's been in the press?

 

https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2023/9/5/23859925/ryder-cup-snub-adrian-meronk-high-road#comments

 

Stay Well My Friends👊

RP

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2023 by Forged4ever

[Dutch1008]

4 minutes ago, Forged4ever said:

Though I am not close to as familiar with the Euro Team, outside of the automatic qualifiers, as I am with the US Team, I'd like to hear from the Gents across the pond on your thoughts regarding Lukerster leaving Adrian Meronk off of the Team?!?!? Aside from him trailing only Rory & Big John in the race to Dubai. 

 

Meronk won the 2022 ISPS Australian Open by five shots over Adam Scott last December while also winning the 2022 Irish Open, which was held at Mount Juliet in County Kilkenny two weeks before Cameron Smith won The Open at St. Andrews.

 

Maronk then won his THIRD NATIONAL TITLE IN THE PAST YEAR with his victory at the 2023 Italian Open, held at MARCO SIMONE GOLF CLUB⛳️, host of next month's Friggin Ryder Cup!!!

 

THREE NATIONAL TITLES IN THE YEAR LEADING UP TO THE CUP🏆, ALONG WITH SITTING THIRD BEHIND ONLY RORY & RAHM IN THE RACE TO DUBAI!!!

 

WTDOUBLEF?!?!?

 

Bros, did I miss something???

 

Another point that while it is obviously not a major factor if his Play had not supported him getting selected, however as what I would think would be the cherry on top🍒, would be that he would be the first Pole ever selected to the Team. I'm guessing that the Euros would like to also "grow the game," and I see no better flag bearer than a Player of Adrian Meronk's ilk. Then ya take how he's handled this snub, and he has wayyyyyy more of a beef than any and all of the US's supposed snubbees, which is with Class & Decorum!!!

 

He's handled as very very very few in his shoes would have!!

 

So, is more to this than what's been in the press?

 

Stay Well My Friends👊

RP

I'm not European but here is a brit's take...

 

https://www.nationalclubgolfer.com/tour/news/adrian-meronk-ryder-cup-snub-big-mistake/

 

It's an interesting decision and I think pretty much akin to ZJ snubbing Keegan. Luke chose to invest in experience w/ Rose and Lowry alongside talent and future development w/ Aberg and Hojgaard. I'd speculate that Luke Donald was committed to investing in youth but keeping some experience on the roster. When Robert MacIntyre locked up his auto qualification, that put Luke in the unenviable position of passing up on a deserving player like Meronk.  

 

Based on data golf's stroke gained metric, MacIntyre is by far the weakest player in the Ryder Cup. His current rank is 129th while Meronk is 64th, Hojgaard is 51st, Aberg is 37th, Lowry 52nd, Straka 53rd, and Rose 22nd. Based on that, Donald chose correctly but was handcuffed by the qualification formula.  

[Forged4ever]

30 minutes ago, Dutch1008 said:

I'm not European but here is a brit's take...

 

https://www.nationalclubgolfer.com/tour/news/adrian-meronk-ryder-cup-snub-big-mistake/

 

It's an interesting decision and I think pretty much akin to ZJ snubbing Keegan. Luke chose to invest in experience w/ Rose and Lowry alongside talent and future development w/ Aberg and Hojgaard. I'd speculate that Luke Donald was committed to investing in youth but keeping some experience on the roster. When Robert MacIntyre locked up his auto qualification, that put Luke in the unenviable position of passing up on a deserving player like Meronk.  

 

Based on data golf's stroke gained metric, MacIntyre is by far the weakest player in the Ryder Cup. His current rank is 129th while Meronk is 64th, Hojgaard is 51st, Aberg is 37th, Lowry 52nd, Straka 53rd, and Rose 22nd. Based on that, Donald chose correctly but was handcuffed by the qualification formula.  

Thanks for the link & response Dutch👊

 

Question:

 

You spoke of the stroke gained metric, which has Meronk 64th, which I take is in the world. That said, the article that I linked stated that along with being third in the RTD, Meronk leads the DP World Tour in strokes gained off of the tee. Please explain to me the difference between the two metrics/rankings?

 

Stay Well Brotha🍻

RP

 

 

Edited September 6, 2023 by Forged4ever

[TRS30]

7 hours ago, Forged4ever said:

Though I am not close to as familiar with the Euro Team, outside of the automatic qualifiers, as I am with the US Team, I'd like to hear from the Gents across the pond on your thoughts regarding Lukerster leaving Adrian Meronk off of the Team?!?!? Aside from him trailing only Rory & Big John in the race to Dubai. 

 

Meronk won the 2023 Australian Open by 5 shots over Adam Scott while also winning the 2022 Irish Open, which was held at Mount Juliet in County Kilkenny two weeks prior to Cam Smith takin the Open. 

 

Maronk then won his THIRD NATIONAL TITLE IN THE PAST YEAR with his victory at the 2023 Italian Open, held at MARCO SIMONE GOLF CLUB⛳️, host of next month's Friggin Ryder Cup!!!

 

THREE NATIONAL TITLES IN THE YEAR LEADING UP TO THE CUP🏆, ALONG WITH SITTING THIRD BEHIND ONLY RORY & RAHM IN THE RACE TO DUBAI!!!

 

WTDOUBLEF?!?!?

 

Bros, did I miss something???

 

Another point that while it is obviously not a major factor if his Play had not supported him getting selected, however as what I would think would be the cherry on top🍒, would be that he would be the first Pole ever selected to the Team. I'm guessing that the Euros would like to also "grow the game," and I see no better flag bearer than a Player of Adrian Meronk's ilk. Then ya take how he's handled this snub, and he has wayyyyyy more of a beef than any and all of the US's supposed snubbees, which is with Class & Decorum!!!

 

He's handled as very very very few in his shoes would have!!

 

So, is more to this than what's been in the press?

 

https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2023/9/5/23859925/ryder-cup-snub-adrian-meronk-high-road#comments

 

Stay Well My Friends👊

RP

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think it came down to the number of rookies they wanted on the team. Once MacIntyre qualified and Aberg won it was going to hard for him to get a pick.  

 

Now in saying that Lowry doesn't have a massive amount of RC experience (only played 1) however has won big event in pressurised situations so guess that swung it for him. 

[Bye]

Whichever way LD went, there would have been some questions raised. I genuinely think it was down to getting the right balance of experience in the team. Rose and Lowry add to the experience and bring a good blend of a cool head with JR and some passion with SL. 

 

Aberg looks to be the real deal, it was just a matter of time before he put 4 rounds together. That is all that has been missing. I think he might even play all 5 matches. 

 

For me the only real decision was between Meronk and Hojgaard in the end. I can see the argument for both. Maybe LD felt Hojgaard is just playing a little better at the moment and is a better fit in the team. I think he will only play in the 4 ball's and singles. 

[FriedEgg]

On 9/4/2023 at 1:16 PM, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Really ? Why did Lowry get picked over Meronk ?

 

Meronk is not in the club, just like Keegan isn't

[Dutch1008]

13 hours ago, Forged4ever said:

Thanks for the link & response Dutch👊

 

Question:

 

You spoke of the stroke gained metric, which has Meronk 64th, which I take is in the world. That said, the article that I linked stated that along with being third in the RTD, Meronk leads the DP World Tour in strokes gained off of the tee. Please explain to me the difference between the two metrics/rankings?

 

Stay Well Brotha🍻

RP

Correct, Meronk is 64th in the world in Strokes Gained Total which encompasses putting, around the greens, approach play, and off the tee. His total strokes gained is +0.65 which means he gains +0.65 strokes per round or +2.6 stokes per tournament on the average professional golfer. That +.065 number can be broken down further by it's components...

 

SG - Putting: +0.08

SG - Around the Greens: +0.02

SG - Approach: +0.08

SG - Off the Tee: +0.61

SG - Total: +0.65

 

Effectively, Meronk is just a shade better than tour average in putting, short game, and approach play, but pretty close to the top 10 in the world off the tee. For reference, Scheffler is currently the best player in the world off the tee at +1.2 SG-OTT, Rory is 2nd at +1.07, and Morikawa is 10th at +0.66. 

 

I get my strokes gained info from Data Golf as they incorporate the PGAT, DPWT, and LIV.

 

https://datagolf.com/datagolf-rankings

 

[Forged4ever]

3 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

Correct, Meronk is 64th in the world in Strokes Gained Total which encompasses putting, around the greens, approach play, and off the tee. His total strokes gained is +0.65 which means he gains +0.65 strokes per round or +2.6 stokes per tournament on the average professional golfer. That +.065 number can be broken down further by it's components...

 

SG - Putting: +0.08

SG - Around the Greens: +0.02

SG - Approach: +0.08

SG - Off the Tee: +0.61

SG - Total: +0.65

 

Effectively, Meronk is just a shade better than tour average in putting, short game, and approach play, but pretty close to the top 10 in the world off the tee. For reference, Scheffler is currently the best player in the world off the tee at +1.2 SG-OTT, Rory is 2nd at +1.07, and Morikawa is 10th at +0.66. 

 

I get my strokes gained info from Data Golf as they incorporate the PGAT, DPWT, and LIV.

 

https://datagolf.com/datagolf-rankings

 

Thanks much for takin the time to explain this. I never really understood the depth of the strokes gained and was sort of embarrassed to ask Madison, as I'm sure that she and my Buds assumed that I understood it.

 

Thanks again👊

 

Have a Great Day🍻

RP

Edited September 6, 2023 by Forged4ever

[Poor Mans Ty Webb]

On 9/4/2023 at 11:18 AM, juliette91 said:

This is not about how to have the most cohesive friends' groups.  Look no further than the Europeans.  I guarantee you that Luke Donald is not going around figuring who will like who and who is someone's great friend.  Great play makes better friends than sympathy for the friend you have as he leaves you high and dry on the course.

 

With all due respect, I actually do think that Donald and the Europeans take things like chemistry into consideration when it comes to pairings.  Rahm making such a big deal about Sergio not being able to have a spot on the team stands out in my mind from this year, too.

 

Talent is important, no doubt about it.  And it definitely helps to have good form.  But I've never been on a team where I've been mad at a friend that leaves me "high and dry," and even the best are going to make mistakes.  You can't always control how you play the game, but you can control the person and teammate that you are, and good functioning teams understand that.  The same issue pops up in other sports, and this has been a part of Team USA's problem in the past (e.g. Tiger and Phil in 2004).  You can't necessarily just throw the "best players" together and expect them to do well.  It's a totally different game from week-to-week on the Tour.

[3whacker]

heck of a time to own your own swing, right before the Ryder Cup

[Shilgy]

7 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

Correct, Meronk is 64th in the world in Strokes Gained Total which encompasses putting, around the greens, approach play, and off the tee. His total strokes gained is +0.65 which means he gains +0.65 strokes per round or +2.6 stokes per tournament on the average professional golfer. That +.065 number can be broken down further by it's components...

 

SG - Putting: +0.08

SG - Around the Greens: +0.02

SG - Approach: +0.08

SG - Off the Tee: +0.61

SG - Total: +0.65

 

Effectively, Meronk is just a shade better than tour average in putting, short game, and approach play, but pretty close to the top 10 in the world off the tee. For reference, Scheffler is currently the best player in the world off the tee at +1.2 SG-OTT, Rory is 2nd at +1.07, and Morikawa is 10th at +0.66. 

 

I get my strokes gained info from Data Golf as they incorporate the PGAT, DPWT, and LIV.

 

https://datagolf.com/datagolf-rankings

 

Thanks for that.

 

Using that Meronk has nothing to complain about not being picked.