Putter Swingweight Sanity Check

[Onohediint]

I have a question for the experts here on the forum.  I have a new putter which feels like a sledgehammer (swingweight measures F9).  My current gamer measures around E2.3.  If the grip on my new putter weighs 60g, I would need to add ~90 grams to the grip end of the putter in order for it to measure around the same as my gamer by my calculations.  Is my math adding up?

 

Thanks in advance!

[Socrates]

That will only make the putter feel heavier.  Your total weight is too high.  Is the putter overlength and what kind is it?

[Onohediint]

It's a custom made head with a stability tour shaft at 34".  Head weight is supposedly around 365g.

[Cwebb]

Just now, Onohediint said:

It's a custom made head with a stability tour shaft at 34".  Head weight is supposedly around 365g.

 

The head weight is too high for that length, in order to get close to your desired swing-weight.

 

A heavier grip only counter balances the scale, it does not make the putter actually swing lighter.

[mjo23]

6 minutes ago, Onohediint said:

It's a custom made head with a stability tour shaft at 34".  Head weight is supposedly around 365g.

365g at 34” with a 60g grip shouldn’t come out out anywhere near F9

 

That would probably be in the upper D range

Edited October 14, 2024 by mjo23

[Onohediint]

Just now, mjo23 said:

365g at 34” with a 60g grip shouldn’t come out out anywhere near F9

 

I'm not actually sure what the head weight is.  I had requested to keep the head weight around 365g, but I don't have a way to verify unfortunately.

[Onohediint]

5 minutes ago, Cwebb said:

 

The head weight is too high for that length, in order to get close to your desired swing-weight.

 

A heavier grip only counter balances the scale, it does not make the putter actually swing lighter.

Pardon my ignorance, but could you explain what you mean by balancing the scale, but not making the putter swing lighter?  I was under the impression that by counterbalancing on the grip end, I could make the putter "feel" like the head wasn't so heavy.  I understand that the total weight of the putter would be heavier.

 

Sorry, very new at all of this so taking this as a learning experience.

[mjo23]

2 hours ago, Onohediint said:

Pardon my ignorance, but could you explain what you mean by balancing the scale, but not making the putter swing lighter?  I was under the impression that by counterbalancing on the grip end, I could make the putter "feel" like the head wasn't so heavy.  I understand that the total weight of the putter would be heavier.

 

Sorry, very new at all of this so taking this as a learning experience.

In your scenario, since you’re playing a traditional length, you need a counter-weight plug for the very end of the shaft. Superstroke is one option, they sell em and they can inserted through the top of their grips.

 

The plus side is that your shaft is a bit lighter than steel, so you have some weight to spare. But if ur SW is really F9 at 34” w/60g grip, then your putter head is so heavy that there’s decent a chance it will still feel like a sledge-hammer even with the counterweighting. Just a heavier overall sledge hammer. But it’s worth trying, it could work out. Good luck.

 

 

[MattM97]

2 hours ago, Onohediint said:

Pardon my ignorance, but could you explain what you mean by balancing the scale, but not making the putter swing lighter?  I was under the impression that by counterbalancing on the grip end, I could make the putter "feel" like the head wasn't so heavy.  I understand that the total weight of the putter would be heavier.

 

Sorry, very new at all of this so taking this as a learning experience.

 

You'll trick the SW scale to be "lighter" but in reality you just added 90g or whatever to your putters total weight making it even heavier.

[Socrates]

19 hours ago, Onohediint said:

I have a question for the experts here on the forum.  I have a new putter which feels like a sledgehammer (swingweight measures F9).  My current gamer measures around E2.3.  If the grip on my new putter weighs 60g, I would need to add ~90 grams to the grip end of the putter in order for it to measure around the same as my gamer by my calculations.  Is my math adding up?

 

Thanks in advance!

 

18 hours ago, Onohediint said:

It's a custom made head with a stability tour shaft at 34".  Head weight is supposedly around 365g.

F9 seems high.  My Ping Valor is 34.75" and only comes out at F2.  Total weight is 538g (grip 68g, shaft 100g, which means the head is ~370g).  Your head is likely North of 370 grams.  Your best bet is if take the shaft off and weigh the head. 

[mjo23]

28 minutes ago, Socrates said:

 

F9 seems high.  My Ping Valor is 34.75" and only comes out at F2.  Total weight is 538g (grip 68g, shaft 100g, which means the head is ~370g).  Your head is likely North of 370 grams.  Your best bet is if take the shaft off and weigh the head. 

Just off the top of my head, I believe this would mean his putter head is around 385-390g (.75” length difference = 4.5g. 7pts higher in SW = 14g). Assuming similar balance points with shafts

 

Actually not quite as heavy as I expected for F9. A counterweight could help with feel, more-so than a super heavy grip, since it’s concentrated at the very top of the shaft - at or above the hands.

Edited October 15, 2024 by mjo23

[PowerCobra98]

Most of the issue is the shaft you're using and the head weight.  Those style shafts (with the steel tip and graphite body) swing weight very high comparatively to either a full steel or full graphite shaft.  Add that heavy head weight into the picture and you have a recipe for heavy swing weight.  I had the same issue when I had the Stability shafts in the past.  Same thing now with the UST All-In Steel tip style...they will always swing weight way higher.

 

Here's an example for you from a few of my own current builds:

 

Putter 1:  34", 360 grams, 75 gram grip, UST All-In Steel Tip Shaft, swing weight D7

 

Putter 2: 34", 360 grams, 75 gram grip, Mitsubishi MMT Graphite Shaft, swing weight D1

 

Putter 3: 34", 360 grams, 75 gram grip, Steel flared and fluted Steel Shaft, swing weight C9

[Stuart_G]

On 10/14/2024 at 1:54 PM, Onohediint said:

I have a question for the experts here on the forum.  I have a new putter which feels like a sledgehammer (swingweight measures F9).  My current gamer measures around E2.3.  If the grip on my new putter weighs 60g, I would need to add ~90 grams to the grip end of the putter in order for it to measure around the same as my gamer by my calculations.  Is my math adding up?

 

Thanks in advance!

 

 

No.  You need to check and compare and then match each component separately.  Grip/butt weight, shaft weight, and head weight (and as such, even total static weight).

 

There is no sanity in just using swing weight values alone to try and match two putters (or any other club for that matter).  It's important to -understanding those specific differences that caused the change in swing weight.

 

On 10/14/2024 at 2:22 PM, Onohediint said:

Pardon my ignorance, but could you explain what you mean by balancing the scale, but not making the putter swing lighter?  I was under the impression that by counterbalancing on the grip end, I could make the putter "feel" like the head wasn't so heavy.  I understand that the total weight of the putter would be heavier.

 

The problem was that the swing weight concept was ONLY ever intended to allow you to adjust either playing length or head weight to match the club feel.  It was never designed to manage butt weight (or shaft weight for that matter).   So while adding more butt weight will make the scale read lower, what it actually might do to the feel is very unpredictable. 

 

Swing weight really has nothing to do with balance - they just found that they could use balance in a very limited context as a short cut to try and match the club MOI.

Edited October 16, 2024 by Stuart_G

[Onohediint]

6 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

 

No.  You need to check and compare and then match each component separately.  Grip/butt weight, shaft weight, and head weight (and as such, even total static weight).

 

There is no sanity in just using swing weight values alone to try and match two putters (or any other club for that matter).  It's important to -understanding those specific differences that caused the change in swing weight.

 

 

The problem was that the swing weight concept was ONLY ever intended to allow you to adjust either playing length or head weight to match the club feel.  It was never designed to manage butt weight (or shaft weight for that matter).   So while adding more butt weight will make the scale read lower, what it actually might do to the feel is very unpredictable. 

 

Swing weight really has nothing to do with balance - they just found that they could use balance in a very limited context as a short cut to try and match the club MOI.

Fair enough!  Thanks for the detailed feedback and the education on this subject.

[Stuart_G]

4 hours ago, Onohediint said:

Fair enough!  Thanks for the detailed feedback and the education on this subject.

 

No problem.  The other point I left out was that it was never meant to match putters either.   There is virtually no rotational acceleration of the club when compared against a full swing.  So swing weight isn't a good metric for putters even if you do keep within the limited context of how swing weight was intended to be used.  e.g. butt weight is very important and so is head weight - but the playing length (or distance between those two weights) isn't really important in the same way it is with a full swing club.

[Rosco1216]

Swingweight for putters is essentially useless.