Garmin Approach R50. All-in-one optical LM @ $5K.

[Carolina Golfer 2]

On 11/12/2024 at 9:16 AM, RCGA said:

 

After 30 minutes of squinting down looking at the club data, you're going to say to hell with it and hook up a monitor/TV/projector. At which point you could have just bought an EML for $2,100.  

I use the FSK for a lot more than 30 minutes at a time, and don't get tired of looking at it's screen, and this is a lot larger and higher up.   I don't see the issue.

[JamesFisher1990]

I've thought about this for a while now - Im trying to figure out who the target consumer really is. At first I thought this was an absolute game changer... but I'm not as sure. Yes, very innovative and cool but I'm not actually sure the use case is as wide spread as I thought. TLDR - I am impressed but unsure that it really has widespread appeal and use cases.

 

In my mind, there's 2 main groups of consumers, with one of those groups maybe having a slight side niche: A) Budget conscious types who just want to see a line on a screen of some kind after hitting a ball into a net, and B) enthusiasts. Enthusiasts could probably be broke into subgroups, B1) the golfer who's almost purely looking to train & improve, and B2) the golfer who wants to play captivating simulator golf.

 

This fits the bill nicely for group A) but is very likely out of their price range. Most of these golfers are probably using R10's/Mevo/ST/MLM2. The R50 might pull away a few ST & Mevo users, but that's a big leap in cost for the guy who maybe bangs a handful of balls per week.

 

The enthusiast is likely using a LM that is supported by a PC - GC2/3/4/BLP or Eyemini/QED/XO. The player who wants a visually pleasing and immersive experience and the most accurate data possible won't get most of the benefit of the R50, which is the touch screen. In this case, the R50 is just an expensive connector to 3rd party software.

 

Where I do see this fitting the bill is for golfer B1 - the enthusiast who practices a ton but is mainly only interested in improvement without playing much sim golf. R50 gives you lots of ball & club data, including face to path out of box, plus the impact video. This golfer can take this with him to the range, to the course and practice different shots and techniques and see their club data to help improve. This player probably uses a Mevo or unlocked BLP right now. I think this is well supported because I'm seeing tons and tons of BLPs suddenly going up for sale right now on facebook.

 

Overall, this is a big kudos to R50 to push the boundaries of launch monitors and bringing something actually innovative into the market. I don't think it's going to be game changing for the majority of golfers but now Uneekor and maybe even Bushnell is going to be forced to respond if this does happen to capture more market share than anticipated.

 

[Carolina Golfer 2]

30 minutes ago, JamesFisher1990 said:

I've thought about this for a while now - Im trying to figure out who the target consumer really is. At first I thought this was an absolute game changer... but I'm not as sure. Yes, very innovative and cool but I'm not actually sure the use case is as wide spread as I thought. TLDR - I am impressed but unsure that it really has widespread appeal and use cases.

 

In my mind, there's 2 main groups of consumers, with one of those groups maybe having a slight side niche: A) Budget conscious types who just want to see a line on a screen of some kind after hitting a ball into a net, and B) enthusiasts. Enthusiasts could probably be broke into subgroups, B1) the golfer who's almost purely looking to train & improve, and B2) the golfer who wants to play captivating simulator golf.

 

This fits the bill nicely for group A) but is very likely out of their price range. Most of these golfers are probably using R10's/Mevo/ST/MLM2. The R50 might pull away a few ST & Mevo users, but that's a big leap in cost for the guy who maybe bangs a handful of balls per week.

 

The enthusiast is likely using a LM that is supported by a PC - GC2/3/4/BLP or Eyemini/QED/XO. The player who wants a visually pleasing and immersive experience and the most accurate data possible won't get most of the benefit of the R50, which is the touch screen. In this case, the R50 is just an expensive connector to 3rd party software.

 

Where I do see this fitting the bill is for golfer B1 - the enthusiast who practices a ton but is mainly only interested in improvement without playing much sim golf. R50 gives you lots of ball & club data, including face to path out of box, plus the impact video. This golfer can take this with him to the range, to the course and practice different shots and techniques and see their club data to help improve. This player probably uses a Mevo or unlocked BLP right now. I think this is well supported because I'm seeing tons and tons of BLPs suddenly going up for sale right now on facebook.

 

Overall, this is a big kudos to R50 to push the boundaries of launch monitors and bringing something actually innovative into the market. I don't think it's going to be game changing for the majority of golfers but now Uneekor and maybe even Bushnell is going to be forced to respond if this does happen to capture more market share than anticipated.

 

I fall in the B1 group for sure.  Everything you described in your 2nd to last paragraph is me.  I have very little use for the Sim portion, as I don't have a permanent indoor spot conducive to a LM.   If I had not splurged on a FSK exactly 1 year ago this month, my order would have been in by now.   I ended up trading the FSK to a friend for a fully loaded Mevo+ it has been good.  But I do kind of miss the on unit screen of the FSK even though it was limited to data and only 4 points at a time displayed.    The amount of data and video this shows on the screen is amazing.   

[JamesFisher1990]

1 hour ago, Carolina Golfer 2 said:

I fall in the B1 group for sure.  Everything you described in your 2nd to last paragraph is me.  I have very little use for the Sim portion, as I don't have a permanent indoor spot conducive to a LM.   If I had not splurged on a FSK exactly 1 year ago this month, my order would have been in by now.   I ended up trading the FSK to a friend for a fully loaded Mevo+ it has been good.  But I do kind of miss the on unit screen of the FSK even though it was limited to data and only 4 points at a time displayed.    The amount of data and video this shows on the screen is amazing.   

I've thought about this a little more since then - I also think that just in general... Anyone who currently owns a BLP or was about to buy a BLP is fair game on R50, regardless of what consumer type they are. Economically, as long as the R50 is very accurate in terms of reading ball & club data, I don't see why anyone would want to keep a BLP long term over the R50.

 

All the initial paid reviews of course rave about this thing. I'm interesting in like 1-4 weeks from now, what users here and abroad who purchased with 100% of their own money have to say. Certainly isn't going to cause me to sell my EML for one, but enthusiasts who are more about improvement vs playing should 100% check R50 out.

[Carolina Golfer 2]

16 minutes ago, JamesFisher1990 said:

I've thought about this a little more since then - I also think that just in general... Anyone who currently owns a BLP or was about to buy a BLP is fair game on R50, regardless of what consumer type they are. Economically, as long as the R50 is very accurate in terms of reading ball & club data, I don't see why anyone would want to keep a BLP long term over the R50.

 

All the initial paid reviews of course rave about this thing. I'm interesting in like 1-4 weeks from now, what users here and abroad who purchased with 100% of their own money have to say. Certainly isn't going to cause me to sell my EML for one, but enthusiasts who are more about improvement vs playing should 100% check R50 out.

I agree definitely interested in real life user experience.  That was one reason I waited about 6 months after the WRX'ers had their trip to CA for the FSK experience, to see how often they were still using them and to follow their experiences at home.   The review thread was very helpful in that.  I didn't have any buyer remorse of the FSK, but here were things it didn't' do that I thought it should for that amount.  Such as I kept banging the drum on Descent Angle and shot tracer and the reporting was just so so, or at least for my needs.   MEVO+ actually addressed all those well. but had a few drawbacks, such as ease of set up and having to have a 2nd device for display.

 

 

[acekun]

I think it's the same but want to make sure before I buy -- is the R50's "Path Angle" measuring the same thing as "Club path" on GC Quad/Trackman? That's just a different way to say it?

[enfuego]

Having the computer built in is great at first but what happens in 3-5 years when it is clearly behind? I suppose you switch to GS Pro integration and add on.

[Kenner300]

I’m super interested but not sold on home tee hero. I’d like graphics that match gspro or e6, but then I’d have to buy a laptop. So then why not just go with gc3? Decisions decisions. 

[yinzerniner]

9 hours ago, Kenner300 said:

I’m super interested but not sold on home tee hero. I’d like graphics that match gspro or e6, but then I’d have to buy a laptop. So then why not just go with gc3? Decisions decisions. 

Seems like the R50 can do just about everything the GC3 does, but at a lesser cost and with a few extra features which may or may not be of value in your specific situation.

 

Pretty good rundown of the R50 vs BLP/GC3 below:
https://www.playbetter.com/blogs/golf/garmin-approach-r50-vs-foresight-gc3-and-bushnell-launch-pro?srsltid=AfmBOor5D8iYW3nfSpEWqZnOeM1Qm66zR7HX5DzYoqed5YA-Xmrrztc9

 

Seems it comes down to:

R50 Pros (over the GC3):

-Cost (~$2k less for all ball/club data)

-Screen

-Doesn't require PC or Screen/Monitor/Porjector for sim golf

-Setup ease

-Impact replay option built-in

 

GC3 Pros over R50

-Established brand/tech

-FSX software with 25 courses built in

-Smaller/more portable

Edited November 16, 2024 by yinzerniner

[Muffy]

10 minutes ago, yinzerniner said:

Seems like the R50 can do just about everything the GC3 does, but at a lesser cost and with a few extra features which may or may not be of value in your specific situation.

 

Pretty good rundown of the R50 vs BLP/GC3 below:
https://www.playbetter.com/blogs/golf/garmin-approach-r50-vs-foresight-gc3-and-bushnell-launch-pro?srsltid=AfmBOor5D8iYW3nfSpEWqZnOeM1Qm66zR7HX5DzYoqed5YA-Xmrrztc9

 

Seems it comes down to:

R50 Pros (over the GC3):

-Cost (~$2k less for all ball/club data)

-Screen

-Doesn't require PC or Screen/Monitor/Porjector for sim golf

-Setup ease

-Impact replay option built-in

 

GC3 Pros over R50

-Established brand/tech

-FSX software with 25 courses built in

-Smaller/more portable

There may be other considerations.....what about putting (R50?)?   Does R50 HDMI support 4K output to external images?   Quality of Home Tee Hero ($99/yr) vs. FSX courses (no charge, except have to buy other courses){Garmin R50 manual implies that the resident Home Tee Hero graphics quality is not as high definition as 3rd party software}.    How about battery replacement?  Warranty and support?        Seems like there is more information to learn about the R50, but it is promising.   

[Golfcrzy]

How about having the ability to play your home and local courses, regardless of initial graphic quality? This is already an updated version, no reason they can’t keep updating with firmware. 
 

This would be a great “second” LM just to practice home courses, or at a second home/travel. 
 

I’m heavily invested in FS, but this is very attractive if only to play my local courses and for quick practice sessions - 45 seconds boot to shot. That’s amazing. (Oh, it also has some historical courses that have closes, which is also pretty amazing). 

Edited November 16, 2024 by Golfcrzy

[CBMC]

Am I correct to assume that face angle is only degrees open/closed? And there is no lie angle or dynamic loft?

Edited November 16, 2024 by CBMC

[Kenner300]

3 hours ago, CBMC said:

Am I correct to assume that face angle is only degrees open/closed? And there is no lie angle or dynamic loft?

Pretty sure dynamic loft is there, not sure on other

[enfuego]

Are they doing measured face data points with only 1 dot and the impact camera? Foresight needs 4 dots to do anything more than angle of attack and path.

[kiwihacker]

I've read you still need a gaming computer to run 3rd party apps like GSPro but what about the E6 range and 5 free courses that comes with the Garmin or Awesome Golf? I run those off an iPad with the R10. Do they work on the built in screen or would I still need to use an iPad? 

[txbadger]

From the little information on Garmin’s website, it appears the hitting area isn't that impressive.  There are no dimensions listed that I could see but there is graphical representation that makes it look fairly small and is about 1.5 feet directly in front of the unit.  Anyone have any dimensions of the hitting area?

[kiwihacker]

22 hours ago, Golfcrzy said:

How about having the ability to play your home and local courses, regardless of initial graphic quality? This is already an updated version, no reason they can’t keep updating with firmware. 
 

This would be a great “second” LM just to practice home courses, or at a second home/travel. 
 

I’m heavily invested in FS, but this is very attractive if only to play my local courses and for quick practice sessions - 45 seconds boot to shot. That’s amazing. (Oh, it also has some historical courses that have closes, which is also pretty amazing). 

Agree about the Home Tee Hero. The graphics obviously aren't brilliant but if the gameplay is as realistic as as GSPro being able to practice real life courses that you actually play would be brilliant. I found the gameplay experience on HTH on the R10 pretty ordinary so tend to play the free E6 courses or Awesome Golf instead. Plus the putting is obviously a bonus. 

Edited November 17, 2024 by kiwihacker

[rlb4]

16 hours ago, txbadger said:

From the little information on Garmin’s website, it appears the hitting area isn't that impressive.  There are no dimensions listed that I could see but there is graphical representation that makes it look fairly small and is about 1.5 feet directly in front of the unit.  Anyone have any dimensions of the hitting area?

[txbadger]

1 hour ago, rlb4 said:

thanks for info.  That makes sense given the graphic (which was a rectangle and must be in club mode).   Pretty small... was expecting it to be at least as big as GC3 area given they both have 3 cameras (at least I think they both have 3). 

[vanderputts]

The Garmin arrived tonight. Have a full day tomorrow but will take it out for a spin in the afternoon.

 

Initial impressions are excellent. It’s looks to be very well built and not heavy at all, think two basketballs or whatever equivalent comes to mind. Yea, it’s a good size but appears to be made to serve the function of the screen so its proportional which appears to be a smart move. The case is genuinely excellent.

[Golfcrzy]

More pics and reviews needed 

[snuzzo29]

11 hours ago, vanderputts said:

 

The Garmin arrived tonight. Have a full day tomorrow but will take it out for a spin in the afternoon.

 

Initial impressions are excellent. It’s looks to be very well built and not heavy at all, think two basketballs or whatever equivalent comes to mind. Yea, it’s a good size but appears to be made to serve the function of the screen so its proportional which appears to be a smart move. The case is genuinely excellent.

Looking forward to your review. I am trying to decide between this or a GC3. 

[bird_4_3]

6 hours ago, snuzzo29 said:

Looking forward to your review. I am trying to decide between this or a GC3. 

I am in the same boat.  Curious to see what decision you decide upon.  

[iacas]

3.75" x 8" is not very big. I almost never practice in just ball mode. Only remember to turn that on occasionally when doing sim golf only with my juniors.

[LongNwrong27]

On 11/15/2024 at 8:43 PM, yinzerniner said:

Seems like the R50 can do just about everything the GC3 does, but at a lesser cost and with a few extra features which may or may not be of value in your specific situation.

 

Pretty good rundown of the R50 vs BLP/GC3 below:
https://www.playbetter.com/blogs/golf/garmin-approach-r50-vs-foresight-gc3-and-bushnell-launch-pro?srsltid=AfmBOor5D8iYW3nfSpEWqZnOeM1Qm66zR7HX5DzYoqed5YA-Xmrrztc9

 

Seems it comes down to:

R50 Pros (over the GC3):

-Cost (~$2k less for all ball/club data)

-Screen

-Doesn't require PC or Screen/Monitor/Porjector for sim golf

-Setup ease

-Impact replay option built-in

 

GC3 Pros over R50

-Established brand/tech

-FSX software with 25 courses built in

-Smaller/more portable

Kinda a bold statement to make. Will wait to see if the data stacks up. Foresight stuff is gold standard in accuracy , just saying you can measure spin or AoA doesn’t mean it’s accurate. It would be much more promising if they showed data and even compared to a quad or trackman to verify stuff. 
 

the accuracy of one of these units is far and away the most important thing. If the unit is not accurate it’s useless.
 

Sim golf played on a tiny screen is not really comparable to sim golf on a projector and with a computer/gs pro. Those are two pretty different things. 

Edited November 19, 2024 by doctor220

[chinaski]

1 hour ago, doctor220 said:

Kinda a bold statement to make. Will wait to see if the data stacks up. Foresight stuff is gold standard in accuracy , just saying you can measure spin or AoA doesn’t mean it’s accurate. It would be much more promising if they showed data and even compared to a quad or trackman to verify stuff. 
 

the accuracy of one of these units is far and away the most important thing. If the unit is not accurate it’s useless.
 

Sim golf played on a tiny screen is not really comparable to sim golf on a projector and with a computer/gs pro. Those are two pretty different things. 

 

I agree the accuracy is most important and needs to be verified, but face angle/Face to path is a huge metric not available on BLP/GC3. The ease of just using HDMI direct to a projector or monitor without a PC is very nice. I have been holding out on a launch monitor and BLP/Eye Mini were at the top of the list, but if the accuracy is the same the R50 may win for me.

[yinzerniner]

@iacas

Yeah, just going by initial (hopefully reliable) reviews, and also going by known equipment specs to suppose that the accuracy will be similar to the BLP / GC3. Absolutely agree that Foresight is the standard right now and only direct comparison between the units at a range can give a definitive answer.  Seems like the common 3 camera setup affords similar accuracy and strike area for ball data only, but for ball and club data the hitting area needs to be smaller on the R50 since it's also measuring face angle with a single sticker.

 

A few shots comparing it to a Trackman. Note: They didn't use RCT balls, so the R50 was possibly more accurate vs the Trackman indoors in this test. Numbers seem comparable to when BLP/GC3 are compared to a Trackman.

 

Good video showing some real-time Home Tee Hero play. Graphics look 10x better than previous release, although obviously not nearly as good as GS Pro or similar standalone offerings on a dedicated PC. 

 

Lots of good info from the Breaking 80 in-depth review, and it answers a few questions posted in this thread:

-HDMI output is limited to screen resolution (1280x800)

-Much more of a stepping stone / "gateway" LM, as it doesn't have the advanced features built into the software yet, so anything other than rudimentary range sessions and sim golf will require using other software with a pc/ipad

-New Home Tee Hero looks like a decent upgrade. Graphics are pretty basic albeit two clear steps above the previous release, but the sheer amount of courses that appear to be topographically accurate is a nice little feature for those who want to practice before playing a round somewhere.

 

So for enthusiasts already familiar with good SIM setups the R50 isn't really anything groundbreaking, but for those looking to get into at-home SIM golf it seems like the current best option for specs/features/setup ease/price.

[iacas]

1 hour ago, yinzerniner said:

Seems like the common 3 camera setup affords similar accuracy and strike area for ball data only, but for ball and club data the hitting area needs to be smaller on the R50 since it's also measuring face angle with a single sticker.

 

I don't think it's actually "measuring" face angle — I imagine with a single sticker it's estimating it based on the start line of the ball. Just like how radar units do it — an algorithm, a calculation, not a measurement.

 

1 hour ago, yinzerniner said:

 

A few shots comparing it to a Trackman. Note: They didn't use RCT balls, so the R50 was possibly more accurate vs the Trackman indoors in this test. Numbers seem comparable to when BLP/GC3 are compared to a Trackman.

 

I didn't love that video, but that's mostly because the guy says the AoA is 6.5° "left" or something a few times. (And the AoA seems to vary from what the Trackman says quite a bit.)

 

1 hour ago, yinzerniner said:

-HDMI output is limited to screen resolution (1280x800)

 

That seems awfully low.

 

Thanks for posting the other videos. I'll check them out later. Not because I'm particularly interested, but some of the members at our indoor academy might want to make use of such a thing.

Thank you.

[Golfcrzy]

The videos of home tee hero projected at that resolution look very acceptable for what it is doing. 
 

I immediately thought about playing my home course and surroundings, but as I was watching some in game demos, my back started hurting seeing them bending over to do *everything*. 
 

I need a secondary input method - a mouse, a remote or button box. Just imagine all the input movements you will want to make over the life of this device and the countless times you will be bending over to make slight changes. I’m too practical for that.
 

Hopefully enough people see this need and they implement something for us old farts. 

 

[txbadger]

31 minutes ago, Golfcrzy said:

Hopefully enough people see this need and they implement something

done

 

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