Swingweight gurus

[Excelsior75]

As Im 1.92m tall and wrist-to-floor is around 90-91cm, I´ve always had irons extended.
My Titleist 681s (DGS300  130g / Lamkin UTX 52g) have been extended by 1.85cm and the resulting swingweight across the set seems to be around D8
I didnt know this until the other day but Ive been hitting them fairly well for the last 6 months.

Is it true that, the length of the extension attachment is more related to swingweight increase than its actual static weight?

 

 

[Ty_Guy]

25 minutes ago, Excelsior75 said:

As Im 1.92m tall and wrist-to-floor is around 90-91cm, I´ve always had irons extended.
My Titleist 681s (DGS300  130g / Lamkin UTX 52g) have been extended by 1.85cm and the resulting swingweight across the set seems to be around D8
I didnt know this until the other day but Ive been hitting them fairly well for the last 6 months.

Is it true that, the length of the extension attachment is more related to swingweight increase than its actual static weight?

 

 

 

Top of the bell curve assumptions, take a 270g 7i head and a 120 gram shaft at 37". This will swing weight about D2. Add half an inch to play at 37.5" with all other metrics the same and it will swing weight at D5. Plus or minus 3 SW points per .5" or 1.25cm. This is the reason we see ~7g weight increments in iron heads. It keeps SW the same while being able to add or remove .5" per iron.

 

Here is a fun prospective club builder to get swing weight estimates:

https://www.valuegolf.com/golf-club-swingweight-calculator

 

I recommend plugging in 45g-50g for the grip, no matter what you use. An assumed Tour Velvet standard is where these calculators and scales base from. There are lots of arguments out there about weight at or above the hand fulcrum referring to grips. It affects the swing weight differently than weight down the club and will "cheat" the SW scale. Extended clubs can benefit from heavier grips or more top weighted shafts, if it player is compatible with the feel.

 

Even if the calculator's numbers aren't exact, it is very good at seeing the swing weight difference on comparative builds.

Edited May 6 by Ty_Guy

[Excelsior75]

That would tie-in with another extended set I have - Titleist 710MB - lighter heads (6-iron is 258g) and only these have Project X 6.0 shafts (120g), Golf Pride MCC (48g)
Works out at about D2.5-D3

[Stuart_G]

1 hour ago, Excelsior75 said:

Is it true that, the length of the extension attachment is more related to swingweight increase than its actual static weight?

 

Correct.  In fact the added static weight of the extension artificially lowers the swing weight scale reading - relative to the swing weight of what you had if you had butt cut a new shaft to the same longer length.

 

That's also why it's usually better to order over length clubs from the factory - or buy used clubs that came out of the factory at the longer lengths than it is to buy standard length clubs and extend them.    At the factory they may have the option to use lighter heads for those longer orders.  And reducing head weight is really the only reliable solution IF the heavier swing weight is or becomes an issue.   

 

Adding weight to the butt end only changes what the scale reads in terms of swing weight.  What it actually does to the feel is very unpredictable.  But it doesn't do anything to reduce the high club MOI that generally is the real problem to the high head weight feel.

 

1 hour ago, Excelsior75 said:

My Titleist 681s (DGS300  130g / Lamkin UTX 52g) have been extended by 1.85cm and the resulting swingweight across the set seems to be around D8

 

That actually seems high for just a .75" extension.   I'd normally expect a value closer to D6.   Were they standard length before the extensions were added or were they already a bit over length?   Did you buy them new or used?   

 

The point being, there might be tip weights in them that could potentially be removed.

 

 

1 hour ago, Excelsior75 said:

I didnt know this until the other day but Ive been hitting them fairly well for the last 6 months.

 

Then it may not be a problem you need to deal with.  But if you want to test out alternatives, the best way is to take one of the mid or even longer irons in the set and simply choke up.   Try choking up 1/2" and see if it feels and/or performs better for you.    You can even do that during a round for everything above about the PW.

Edited May 6 by Stuart_G

[BREWMASTER95060]

DO THIS
you will get a shorter shaft lenght and more upright lie angle

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MaR14Dru9i4

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 6 by BREWMASTER95060
spelling

[Nessism]

Tall guys are typically strong guys, so a high swingweight is rarely a problem.  As you mentioned, you have been hitting the clubs well for the last six months.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[Excelsior75]

17 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Correct.  In fact the added static weight of the extension artificially lowers the swing weight scale reading - relative to the swing weight of what you had if you had butt cut a new shaft to the same longer length.

 

That's also why it's usually better to order over length clubs from the factory - or buy used clubs that came out of the factory at the longer lengths than it is to buy standard length clubs and extend them.    At the factory they may have the option to use lighter heads for those longer orders.  And reducing head weight is really the only reliable solution IF the heavier swing weight is or becomes an issue.   

 

Adding weight to the butt end only changes what the scale reads in terms of swing weight.  What it actually does to the feel is very unpredictable.  But it doesn't do anything to reduce the high club MOI that generally is the real problem to the high head weight feel.

 

That actually seems high for just a .75" extension.   I'd normally expect a value closer to D6.   Were they standard length before the extensions were added or were they already a bit over length?   Did you buy them new or used?   

 

The point being, there might be tip weights in them that could potentially be removed.

 

Then it may not be a problem you need to deal with.  But if you want to test out alternatives, the best way is to take one of the mid or even longer irons in the set and simply choke up.   Try choking up 1/2" and see if it feels and/or performs better for you.    You can even do that during a round for everything above about the PW.

681:  that is what I thought when I had them extended - thought they were a touch too heavy.

Bought used, great condition/good price. Standard length / lie.
 

Tip-weights was my original thought so I completely took apart the PW - nothing at all inside the hosel section, nothing inside the shaft.
I also checked the static weights of all clubs again another set that someone else owns and the difference was maybe 1-2g on a few of the clubs - 420g for 2-iron through to 470g for the PW.

Only way to really tell is disassemble the entire set and see what´s what.

710: same extender/wraps on these but as I mentioned, lighter shaft and grip - the swingweight throughout is D3-D4 which feels a bit better in terms of comfortability but I miss to the right a lot more with these than the 681s.

3rd set which I didn´t mention or have had checked - Taylormade RAC TP MBs which were D3 at retail and again, I had these extended but by slightly less - 1.5cm

[Stuart_G]

28 minutes ago, Excelsior75 said:

Only way to really tell is disassemble the entire set and see what´s what.

 

Unfortunately - but getting the raw head weights can potentially be important to figure out why they might have ended up where they did.

[Excelsior75]

30 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Unfortunately - but getting the raw head weights can potentially be important to figure out why they might have ended up where they did.

Looking at this:
https://store-k9nvqai7wz.mybigcommerce.com/content/PDFs/Head_MPFs/MPF_TITLEIST.pdf

Irionic that the 681 isn´t listed, but if we take the general consensus that there´s a 6-8g difference between clubheads, the 6-iron would be around 262g - 4-5g heavier than any other 670-680-690-695 range

[Excelsior75]

21 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Correct.  In fact the added static weight of the extension artificially lowers the swing weight scale reading - relative to the swing weight of what you had if you had butt cut a new shaft to the same longer length.

 

That's also why it's usually better to order over length clubs from the factory - or buy used clubs that came out of the factory at the longer lengths than it is to buy standard length clubs and extend them.    At the factory they may have the option to use lighter heads for those longer orders.  And reducing head weight is really the only reliable solution IF the heavier swing weight is or becomes an issue.   

 

Adding weight to the butt end only changes what the scale reads in terms of swing weight.  What it actually does to the feel is very unpredictable.  But it doesn't do anything to reduce the high club MOI that generally is the real problem to the high head weight feel.

 

That actually seems high for just a .75" extension.   I'd normally expect a value closer to D6.   Were they standard length before the extensions were added or were they already a bit over length?   Did you buy them new or used?   

 

The point being, there might be tip weights in them that could potentially be removed.

 

Then it may not be a problem you need to deal with.  But if you want to test out alternatives, the best way is to take one of the mid or even longer irons in the set and simply choke up.   Try choking up 1/2" and see if it feels and/or performs better for you.    You can even do that during a round for everything above about the PW.

Seems like the club-technician didnt do as I asked - I took apart everything, clubhead, shaft, grip, extender.
He inserted an (steel/alluminium) 10g extender into the end of the shaft, which turns out made the extension by 2.54cm / 1 inch - no wonder it was D8.

 

Also, turns out the DGS300 shaft weighs just 123g, so it´s clearly an S200, mis-labelled - obviously quality-control wasnt that good 25 years ago!

So, put everything back together again, with a correct-length extension - 1.25cm - and a slihgtly lighter grip, and swingweight is now D4-D5