Can someone please explain swing weights on shorter drivers

[Tpbiker]

I'm thinking of shortening my driver shaft, probably by an inch or so. Before I cut a perfectly good shaft down I'm going to try it out with my mini driver shaft to see what happens.

 

The mini driver is close to 2 inches shorter, and I'm led to believe thats about 24 gms I'd need to add to my driver head to keep same swing weight.

 

I've weighed both the mini driver head and the driver head and there is only a 12 gm difference between the 2. So does that mean the driver and mini driver heads had massively different swing weights to begin with?

 

 

[Socrates]

I would advise that you tread softly on the added weight.  I wouldn't jump right in and add all the weight.  I would add it slowly (lead tape) until you feel it feeling right.  You might be surprised that you don't need all that weight to have it perform well.

[NMarko]

100% agree from my experience. Best to add lead tape a little at a time after you’ve made the final length adjustment. Howard Jones has an awesome DIY driver fit post that would be a great resource.

 

 

[NRJyzr]

10 hours ago, Tpbiker said:

I'm thinking of shortening my driver shaft, probably by an inch or so. Before I cut a perfectly good shaft down I'm going to try it out with my mini driver shaft to see what happens.

 

The mini driver is close to 2 inches shorter, and I'm led to believe thats about 24 gms I'd need to add to my driver head to keep same swing weight.

 

I've weighed both the mini driver head and the driver head and there is only a 12 gm difference between the 2. So does that mean the driver and mini driver heads had massively different swing weights to begin with?

 

 

 

A FWIW comment in addition to the above...  At driver length, each swingweight point is about 1.6 to 1.7 grams.

 

I've also found I like heavier shafts at shorter lengths

 

[Howard_Jones]

10 hours ago, Tpbiker said:

I'm thinking of shortening my driver shaft, probably by an inch or so. Before I cut a perfectly good shaft down I'm going to try it out with my mini driver shaft to see what happens.

 

The mini driver is close to 2 inches shorter, and I'm led to believe thats about 24 gms I'd need to add to my driver head to keep same swing weight.

 

I've weighed both the mini driver head and the driver head and there is only a 12 gm difference between the 2. So does that mean the driver and mini driver heads had massively different swing weights to begin with?

 

 

First of all, (as example) Drivers vs deep faced woods, with the SAME play lenght, and the same head wgt, will give us a driver with +/- 3 SWP LESS than the shallowfaced wood.
The reason is that the woods have a COG closer to its sole, while the drivers "butt to COG" is shorter, since COG is right above the center of the face. Read a driver need more head wgt to deliver the same SW value as a wood does. As example at 45.00" where a typical driver often is, 1 SWP = 1.60 grams, and we need about 3 = 4.95, say 5 grams EXTRA wgt is needed for the driver....

But all this stuff belongs to the WORKSHOP, its got nothing to do with FITTING, and that must be done first. SW values is NOT transferable values, and do NOT represent a certain feel of head wgt.
Most was never fitted to play a certain SW value, and even if you was, we are now talking a different club with different specs = forget that SW value, its no longer valid....

Follow the link above to my DIY driver tune up, and you will make it right on first attempt.
Its only one way to make this right, and that method is described, and is simple, so read it, you will never regret those minutes it takes.



 

[Stuart_G]

12 hours ago, Tpbiker said:

The mini driver is close to 2 inches shorter, and I'm led to believe thats about 24 gms I'd need to add to my driver head to keep same swing weight.

 

You really mean you were mislead to believe that, as well as mislead to believe you would want to keep the swing weight value the same. 

 

Think of it this way, a 3wd is typically 1.5"-2" shorter than a driver, yet the head weight is only about 10 gm heavier than a driver.    Adding that much weight is putting you in the range of a 5wd or 7wd head weight with a 3wd playing length.

 

The swing weight "rules" are not good rules and only meant to be used in very limited contexts.  In fact you'd be better off just throwing them out in most cases.   

 

Even when the rules might be valid, the swing weight system is an imperfect system, so after making such a big change you should never assume you want to keep the swing weight value the same - even if you were actually fit for the original value - which is unlikely if you find you need to cut down the playing length.

Edited June 27 by Stuart_G

[Tpbiker]

Thanks folks. I'll take a look at that link and report back once I've done some testing!

[driveandputtmachine]

Howard and Stuart are two guys you should listen to!

 

I will say that MOST amateurs will be longer and straighter on average with a shorter driver.  Sure the longest shots would be longer with the longer shaft, however if you did a strokes gained I would almost be willing to guarantee that the majority(not all) would have a better strokes gained with the shorter shaft.

 

Now this is not just cutting it down and going for it.  More than likely you will need to add some weight, and using the driver DIY tune up is how I decided how much weight to add to my mini and my driver and my 4 and 7 wood when I did cut any of them down.

[GoldenEagle69]

I tecently cut .75" off the mini driver and upon testing I was surprised to find I liked the feel already and I haven't added any weight to the head.

 

I'd cut lead tape into 1 gram strips and add one at a time if it feels too light. Good luck

[Urb]

Heavier shaft can offset some or most of the SW loss.  That way you're not adding a ton of lead tape to the head, which can make the shaft feel softer.  

[Phabs]

I just shortened one that was D5 @ 45.5” from the factory surprisingly 

 

Took an inch and it was a high C SW

 

Added 5 grams via the weight port and it was mid D2 as a starting point.
 

Shaft design / shaft balance point / shaft counter weighting all play a big part in the amount of weight you need to regain the balance back. 

[Pepperturbo]

6 hours ago, driveandputtmachine said:

Howard and Stuart are two guys you should listen to!

 

I will say that MOST amateurs will be longer and straighter on average with a shorter driver.  Sure the longest shots would be longer with the longer shaft, however if you did a strokes gained I would almost be willing to guarantee that the majority(not all) would have a better strokes gained with the shorter shaft.

 

Now this is not just cutting it down and going for it.  More than likely you will need to add some weight, and using the driver DIY tune up is how I decided how much weight to add to my mini and my driver and my 4 and 7 wood when I did cut any of them down.

100% agree. 

 

My driver playing lengths are either 44.75" (D4) or 44.5" (D3.5), which gets me 245-255+ in the fairway.  But I have a few shafts that jump to 45.5+" and have hit my longest drives 265+ with the those shafts; however, dispersion increases far too much for my liking.  

Edited June 27 by Pepperturbo

[Tpbiker]

A good driver currently gets me out to around 270 ish, a mini driver around 235. But I hit the mini in the fairway more often than not. With the driver it probably doesn't average any further given the amount of awful shots I hit.

 

If I can find something as consistent as the mini that goes around 250 I'd be ecstatic. 

[Stuart_G]

18 hours ago, Urb said:

Heavier shaft can offset some or most of the SW loss.  That way you're not adding a ton of lead tape to the head, which can make the shaft feel softer.  

 

It's possible but I wouldn't make any assumptions about what shaft weight will do to swing weight.   Too much variation in shaft balance points.  It's very possible you could go heavier and end up with a lighter swing weight.

 

Plus, changing shaft weight can have other potential side effects.  So - while it is important to fit oneself properly for shaft weight - changing shaft weight for the sole purpose of managing swing weight is usually a bad idea.

 

[ShortGolfer]

14 hours ago, Tpbiker said:

A good driver currently gets me out to around 270 ish, a mini driver around 235. But I hit the mini in the fairway more often than not. With the driver it probably doesn't average any further given the amount of awful shots I hit.

 

If I can find something as consistent as the mini that goes around 250 I'd be ecstatic. 

Perhaps a fitting with an open mind  and lots of choices would find something?