Sorry Rant on Entitled "Members"

[Pnwpingi210]

8 minutes ago, goudok said:

@Pnwpingi210 @Shilgy i am not disagreeing with you, I am just seeing the other side of this issue and being a member at a “semi private” course where they increased number of leagues that take 3 hours to play 9 holes.

my membership states “unlimited play” that’s what they sell it as.

I understand why they have leagues and events, no i dont think membership at a semi private gets me a wank after a round, but if a membership says “unlimited golf” some people will take it as unlimited golf, just like unlimited data that telecom providers sell you, there are restrictions and slowing down of data speeds.  So nobody should complain about it?  A vast majority of people complain about telcos slowing things down after certain amount of data used.  I am literally on a vacation right now, and they advertised happy hour during certain times, but when we go there the bar was closed.  Airlines overbook, someone whom booked first might get kicked off because someone paid more for that seat, should the first person not complain? Someone will always complain about it.  So why should members not complain about some league where they paid for 100-150x more than the league?  

OP has no idea how many leagues that course has, OP did not say how much the members pay, and their agreement.  At the end of the day members paid ahead of time and even if it’s a semi private they should not be treated like scums because they already paid and not brining any more money that given day.

And now that you mentioned about my agreement, I just found it in my email and it says,  “Some tee times might be blocked to outside events”.  So at which point should a member start complaining?  1 event a week? 2? 4? 5?  7? It’s different for every person, someone will always be unhappy, someone from league whom paid to play, a member whom wants to play at exact same time as league. 

This happened to me.  Part of the perks is being able to book 4 weeks in advance, which i did, i had some friends coming to town to visit me.  They canceled a tee time because of some guy bought out league for that day.  Are we saying i should not complain? Again, i didn;t i went elsewhere I know enough people that work in the golf industry to get a tee time, but just asking.

Yeah.  False equivalence. 

 

 

 

[goudok]

Just now, Pnwpingi210 said:

Yeah.  False equivalence. 

 

 

 

Yup

[Pnwpingi210]

7 minutes ago, goudok said:

Yup

If you came in with that logic to the membership desk, I would politely and strongly offer you a full refund and cancellation of your membership.    There’s a severed disconnect on what you think that 750 bucks a months gets you 🙂

[goudok]

3 minutes ago, Pnwpingi210 said:

If you came in with that logic to the membership desk, I would politely and strongly offer you a full refund and cancellation of your membership.    There’s a severed disconnect on what you think that 750 bucks a months gets you 🙂

Ok and if they don’t?

[Pnwpingi210]

Just now, goudok said:

Ok and if they don’t?

I think if you came in talking like that with those examples…it would make them happy for you to join elsewhere

[goudok]

1 minute ago, Pnwpingi210 said:

I think if you came in talking like that with those examples…it would make them happy for you to join elsewhere

It’s only happy for them now where people are paying 100 to play cow pasture courses.  As soon as this craze wears off and we hit a recession those same clubs will start begging for members to come back.  

If leagues don’t like lunatic members to drive around while they are playing same holes then they can get a refund right?  

Im done talking about this, as i said before I don’t disagree with you or anyone here, but both sides have a point.  OP called members clowns, but those clowns pay way more than those leagues will bring and as soon as you have money on the table and everyone believes they paid for a service they should be getting you will have crazies that start complaining about everything.  

[WesternRacing]

8 minutes ago, goudok said:

Ok and if they don’t?

 

The rules are what they are.  Obviously, you don’t like the rules at your club (as the members at the course the OP referenced), but that’s between you and the (semi private) club, not you and the league players.  If you have an issue, take it up with your club leadership and, based on how they respond, decide whether you want to stay a member.

[Pnwpingi210]

Just now, goudok said:

It’s only happy for them now where people are paying 100 to play cow pasture courses.  As soon as this craze wears off and we hit a recession those same clubs will start begging for members to come back.  

If leagues don’t like lunatic members to drive around while they are playing same holes then they can get a refund right?  

Im done talking about this, as i said before I don’t disagree with you or anyone here, but both sides have a point.  OP called members clowns, but those clowns pay way more than those leagues will bring and as soon as you have money on the table and everyone believes they paid for a service they should be getting you will have crazies that start complaining about everything.  

I think your disconnected from reality on how much money leagues, events, and tournaments bring into to public courses (semi private courses are for all practical purposes public courses)

[WesternRacing]

3 minutes ago, goudok said:

It’s only happy for them now where people are paying 100 to play cow pasture courses.  As soon as this craze wears off and we hit a recession those same clubs will start begging for members to come back.  

If leagues don’t like lunatic members to drive around while they are playing same holes then they can get a refund right?  

Im done talking about this, as i said before I don’t disagree with you or anyone here, but both sides have a point.  OP called members clowns, but those clowns pay way more than those leagues will bring and as soon as you have money on the table and everyone believes they paid for a service they should be getting you will have crazies that start complaining about everything.  

 

Anyone who violates the rules of the course at the expense of other players is a clown.  Members cutting into the middle of league play where they shouldn’t be are clowns.  And if they respond negatively when confronted, they’re entitled clowns, which sadly golf is full of.  Obviously, there can be clowns on both sides, but in that situation, the ‘members’ are the clowns.

 

Edited July 26 by WesternRacing

[goudok]

Just now, WesternRacing said:

 

The rules are what they are.  Obviously, you don’t like the rules at your club (as the members at the course the OP referenced), but that’s between you and the (semi private) club, not you and the league players.  If you have an issue, take it up with your club leadership and, based on how they respond, decide whether you want to stay a member.

Again I have no issues with my course or any of this, I was just being devils advocate and know members whom don’t like those leagues, i was just pointing out the other side of this.

I play leagues at other courses that are fully private and if their members did that i would fully understand.

 

[WesternRacing]

1 minute ago, Pnwpingi210 said:

I think your disconnected from reality on how much money leagues, events, and tournaments bring into to public courses (semi private courses are for all practical purposes public courses)

 

100%.  IMO, there is no such thing as a semi private course.  They’re just public courses that sell rights to favorable tee times and as many tee times as you can book pursuant to their rules.

[WesternRacing]

2 minutes ago, goudok said:

Again I have no issues with my course or any of this, I was just being devils advocate and know members whom don’t like those leagues, i was just pointing out the other side of this.

I play leagues at other courses that are fully private and if their members did that i would fully understand.

 

 

You’d understand if members violated their own course rules and disrupted play that you paid for?  I sure wouldn’t.

 

Again, their problem is with their course, not the other players.  Being confrontational with the league players is just being a bass hat.  We do home and homes against other private clubs and I’d never think of disrupting one of those rounds at our club, nor would I accept it if we were traveling.

 

 

Edited July 26 by WesternRacing

[st1800e]

11 hours ago, Bad9 said:

golfers suck as people.

And a lot of people suck as golfers….😉

[SNIPERBBB]

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Edited July 26 by SNIPERBBB
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[SNIPERBBB]

10 hours ago, goudok said:

@Pnwpingi210 @Shilgy i am not disagreeing with you, I am just seeing the other side of this issue and being a member at a “semi private” course where they increased number of leagues that take 3 hours to play 9 holes.

my membership states “unlimited play” that’s what they sell it as.

I understand why they have leagues and events, no i dont think membership at a semi private gets me a wank after a round, but if a membership says “unlimited golf” some people will take it as unlimited golf, just like unlimited data that telecom providers sell you, there are restrictions and slowing down of data speeds.  So nobody should complain about it?  A vast majority of people complain about telcos slowing things down after certain amount of data used.  I am literally on a vacation right now, and they advertised happy hour during certain times, but when we go there the bar was closed.  Airlines overbook, someone whom booked first might get kicked off because someone paid more for that seat, should the first person not complain? Someone will always complain about it.  So why should members not complain about some league where they paid for 100-150x more than the league?  

OP has no idea how many leagues that course has, OP did not say how much the members pay, and their agreement.  At the end of the day members paid ahead of time and even if it’s a semi private they should not be treated like scums because they already paid and not brining any more money that given day.

And now that you mentioned about my agreement, I just found it in my email and it says,  “Some tee times might be blocked to outside events”.  So at which point should a member start complaining?  1 event a week? 2? 4? 5?  7? It’s different for every person, someone will always be unhappy, someone from league whom paid to play, a member whom wants to play at exact same time as league. 

This happened to me.  Part of the perks is being able to book 4 weeks in advance, which i did, i had some friends coming to town to visit me.  They canceled a tee time because of some guy bought out league for that day.  Are we saying i should not complain? Again, i didn;t i went elsewhere I know enough people that work in the golf industry to get a tee time, but just asking.

Unlimited golf just means the number of times you can play without paying greens is unlimited. It does not mean unlimited access.

 

You're not always going to be able to get on. They have events and leagues. Even on fully private courses. Even if there's not an event, the tee sheet might be so full there's not openings.

[SNIPERBBB]

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Edited July 26 by SNIPERBBB
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Edited July 26 by SNIPERBBB
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[deadsolid...shank]

12 hours ago, goudok said:

@Pnwpingi210 @Shilgy i am not disagreeing with you, I am just seeing the other side of this issue and being a member at a “semi private” course where they increased number of leagues that take 3 hours to play 9 holes.

my membership states “unlimited play” that’s what they sell it as.

I understand why they have leagues and events, no i dont think membership at a semi private gets me a wank after a round, but if a membership says “unlimited golf” some people will take it as unlimited golf, just like unlimited data that telecom providers sell you, there are restrictions and slowing down of data speeds.  So nobody should complain about it?  A vast majority of people complain about telcos slowing things down after certain amount of data used.  I am literally on a vacation right now, and they advertised happy hour during certain times, but when we go there the bar was closed.  Airlines overbook, someone whom booked first might get kicked off because someone paid more for that seat, should the first person not complain? Someone will always complain about it.  So why should members not complain about some league where they paid for 100-150x more than the league?  

OP has no idea how many leagues that course has, OP did not say how much the members pay, and their agreement.  At the end of the day members paid ahead of time and even if it’s a semi private they should not be treated like scums because they already paid and not brining any more money that given day.

And now that you mentioned about my agreement, I just found it in my email and it says,  “Some tee times might be blocked to outside events”.  So at which point should a member start complaining?  1 event a week? 2? 4? 5?  7? It’s different for every person, someone will always be unhappy, someone from league whom paid to play, a member whom wants to play at exact same time as league. 

This happened to me.  Part of the perks is being able to book 4 weeks in advance, which i did, i had some friends coming to town to visit me.  They canceled a tee time because of some guy bought out league for that day.  Are we saying i should not complain? Again, i didn;t i went elsewhere I know enough people that work in the golf industry to get a tee time, but just asking.

Seems to be an age old problem with public courses that sell “memberships”. Where membership really means pass. I think Western Racing said the same thing earlier. It just means no or discounted green fees, and in some places the ability to earlier access to tee times. It’s truly NOT a membership. And when you buy that pass, it should have the caveat that those “unlimited” tee times are subject to availability. But I think most people realize that. 
 

I really believe it’s the same almost everywhere, especially courses run by city governments. They love to take in that early pass money (big cash infusion at the first of the year when many courses are still under snow). At our course, they typically sell 100 +passes per year. Adding in cart and range probably brings that average cost to $2,500 or so. So a nice little January cash infusion. 
 

But here’s the kicker, and I think it’s pretty similar most places.  Once that early money comes in, they’re looking for cash across the counter. Daily fee money. Leagues, tournaments, corporate outings, etc. Cash flow on that day to day basis. You’ll quickly start to hear “well the members are only paying $xxxx per round because they play X an out of times”. Then they start to think they’re leaving money out there and they start to implement changes that impact the pass holders even more. For us, they added Prime Time this year.  Friday, Saturday, Sunday mornings, pass holders and employees (me) can’t play. And raised the green fees. 
 

I’ve said numerous times here I’d be pissed if I bought a “membership”. It seems like there is a tournament almost every weekend, and a league almost every night. I get the frustration. Especially paying $8,000 for that pass.  Ouch!  But I really do believe it is basically the same almost everywhere. 

[clinkinfo]

I think many of you are conflating 2 issues.  
 

There’s the issue of what “unlimited” golf means.  And like telecom, they can probably throttle and limit you within reason and still label it “unlimited”.  It’s likely in the fine print of the contract, something like “unlimited golf when the course is available”

 

But, then there’s the issue of “bad behavior”.  And that’s not limited to members or league participants, both can act like jerks.  It’s unacceptable and needs to stop.

[mshills]

19 hours ago, PJE said:

There’s a certain kind of person who joins a “semi private” course but who expects the benefits of a private course. And those are the a holes you have encountered. Rich but not rich enough. 
Note: Most semi private course members are rational people, usually avid golfers, who don’t mind paying a little more to enjoy courses that are less crowded, and often, in better condition than munis. But these people understand and accept the tradeoffs with semi private membership. 

100%. “Semi private” 😂 all that means is prepaid tee times. Not the same thing as a private club. 

[mshills]

16 hours ago, goudok said:

Isn’t that the point of a membership? Being able to go out and play any given time ? 

Nope. 

 

An especially hard No to guys who think “I’m a member, I live on #5, so I will jump out and play #5-#13 any time I want.” This might work at 1% of full private clubs, particularly those not in booming, busy areas. This would never be ok at a semi private, no way no how. 

[mshills]

13 hours ago, goudok said:

Again I have no issues with my course or any of this, I was just being devils advocate and know members whom don’t like those leagues, i was just pointing out the other side of this.

I play leagues at other courses that are fully private and if their members did that i would fully understand.

If the members don’t like those leagues, they better have a full grasp of what it would mean if the course did not have them. Those prepaid rounds might cost 2x or 3x. Or the course could close up. They bring in that much $, and even more important, the league brings a predictable, recurring $ amount. 
 

My place is totally private and we host outside events on some Mondays. Maintenance and greenskeeping work around them — they bring in a pile of money and are generally organizations that do quite a lot of good for the community, so it’s a win/win. 

[Shilgy]

3 hours ago, SNIPERBBB said:

Unlimited golf just means the number of times you can play without paying greens is unlimited. It does not mean unlimited access.

 

You're not always going to be able to get on. They have events and leagues. Even on fully private courses. Even if there's not an event, the tee sheet might be so full there's not openings.

 

Nobody is saying you can't complain. If the course has a board you might have better luck with your complaints. Especially if it's member owned. If it's owned by a person or company, chances are slim. 

Ok ok ok we agree with you. Stop hitting “submit reply” already🤣

[SNIPERBBB]

Just now, Shilgy said:

Ok ok ok we agree with you. Stop hitting “submit reply” already🤣

Phone glitch 

[goudok]

22 minutes ago, mshills said:

If the members don’t like those leagues, they better have a full grasp of what it would mean if the course did not have them. Those prepaid rounds might cost 2x or 3x. Or the course could close up. They bring in that much $, and even more important, the league brings a predictable, recurring $ amount. 
 

My place is totally private and we host outside events on some Mondays. Maintenance and greenskeeping work around them — they bring in a pile of money and are generally organizations that do quite a lot of good for the community, so it’s a win/win. 

I agree with that and again not complaining about my place, but i can see how some would. Just examples of how it can bring out Karen’s. 
My club has a board and my club states unlimited play at any time that is available. When someone purchases a membership and asks how many times there is league and are told once a week and 6 months later it’s 4? That’s not ok, they should’ve been told it’s one now but may increase. 
my place doubled in price for that exact reason to “service” the members better. Literally what they said to make it feel more elite. Bunch of members quit so now afternoon blocks are mostly empty. Good for me I thought but then went to 4 leagues a week. That’s 4 nights I can’t play. What if it goes from 8k to 12 or 16? At some point I will get upset too. What if your private course from some occasional Mondays to every Monday ? And then 2 times a week.

nobody knows the OP posts course membership agreement nobody knows anything other than there were a few baboons that went out during league but since there are multiple people that went out to play during league that’s more of a chance that the course is very poorly run and members don’t mean squat after they paid the yearly dues. We don’t know the yearly dues it might be very minimal but might be a lot and might have increased a lot in a small amount of time like mine and now that were close to being clowns became clowns. 
Not encouraging this behavior by any means but we don’t know anything other than the guy playing league got upset.  Just like you or someone said don’t join if you don’t like leagues well same thing can be said. Don’t play league on semi private courses if you don’t want this type of behavior.  I’m just stating how it goes both ways. I’ve witnessed numerous scraps at these leagues. 

So at the end of the day you will have clowns on all sides.  And it’s not just golf it’s anything in life. 
the only problem is that currently there are more people that want to play than courses so courses are getting away with stuff they didn’t 6 years ago. 
 

 

Edited July 26 by goudok

[nsxguy]

18 hours ago, goudok said:

Being a member of this course is still valuable to me despite not being able to play “whenever” I want. 

 

How did this thread even continue after this ?  

[I'_rather_be_golfing]

I’m very happy to see this rant thread. A lot of people always say “join a private club” for better experience. You don’t see the issues on a private course like you do on a public course. That wasn’t the case for me. 
 

I got a chance to play at a Willow Creek CC last Tuesday thanks to a coworker. My first impression was the clubhouse and course looked beautiful. Staff was super friendly and very inviting. Everything was great till we got to the turn. We were waiting on the 10th for the group to tee off. The group behind our group approached us and literally yelled at us. I kept my mouth shut as I have zero room to speak. The group behind us was yelling at us for not fixing our ball marks on the green. Here’s the kicker guys. Not one of us hit 1 green on the front 9. My coworker made that clear with the group. Then they continued to drill us for not fixing the ball mark and not respecting the course. My coworker told them what ever ball mark they saw we repaired. I was repairing ball marks whenever I walked by it. Then they got on our case for not keeping up with pace. My coworker told them to just go and pass.
 

Whether private or public it doesn’t matter as long as there are entitled dicks. 

[Warrior42111]

On 7/25/2025 at 7:02 PM, Bonneville85308 said:

Devil's advocate here; perhaps the course management needs to better communicate with the "members" to make it clear exactly when and which nine this league is playing, and during that time, the league has exclusive use of that nine, so everyone else must stay off it, no exceptions. A lot of courses aren't very transparent about these things. So people get out there, run into a league filling up an entire nine, and then get all pissed off.

 

 

There's signs in the proshop, where it says so. Main issue I think is people just roll in from the community and don't check

[Warrior42111]

On 7/25/2025 at 7:52 PM, goudok said:

@Pnwpingi210 @Shilgy i am not disagreeing with you, I am just seeing the other side of this issue and being a member at a “semi private” course where they increased number of leagues that take 3 hours to play 9 holes.

my membership states “unlimited play” that’s what they sell it as.

I understand why they have leagues and events, no i dont think membership at a semi private gets me a wank after a round, but if a membership says “unlimited golf” some people will take it as unlimited golf, just like unlimited data that telecom providers sell you, there are restrictions and slowing down of data speeds.  So nobody should complain about it?  A vast majority of people complain about telcos slowing things down after certain amount of data used.  I am literally on a vacation right now, and they advertised happy hour during certain times, but when we go there the bar was closed.  Airlines overbook, someone whom booked first might get kicked off because someone paid more for that seat, should the first person not complain? Someone will always complain about it.  So why should members not complain about some league where they paid for 100-150x more than the league?  

OP has no idea how many leagues that course has, OP did not say how much the members pay, and their agreement.  At the end of the day members paid ahead of time and even if it’s a semi private they should not be treated like scums because they already paid and not brining any more money that given day.

And now that you mentioned about my agreement, I just found it in my email and it says,  “Some tee times might be blocked to outside events”.  So at which point should a member start complaining?  1 event a week? 2? 4? 5?  7? It’s different for every person, someone will always be unhappy, someone from league whom paid to play, a member whom wants to play at exact same time as league. 

This happened to me.  Part of the perks is being able to book 4 weeks in advance, which i did, i had some friends coming to town to visit me.  They canceled a tee time because of some guy bought out league for that day.  Are we saying i should not complain? Again, i didn;t i went elsewhere I know enough people that work in the golf industry to get a tee time, but just asking.

So to answer your questions

membership gets you advanced tee times compared to the public 14 days vs 7. Member events, discounts on pro shop merchandise, and discounted tee times and ability to pay a trail fee to use a person cart. So they're suppose to still book all their times, and the time is blocked for leagues in the system.

 

As for leagues we're the only one per the calendar so  one day one 9 is closed for 2.5 hours. 

 

Correction: there are some levels of membership that buy unlimited tee times but all times must be booked through the proshop / computer system

Edited July 28 by Warrior42111
New Info

[Pnwpingi210]

1 hour ago, Warrior42111 said:

So to answer your questions

membership gets you advanced tee times compared to the public 14 days vs 7. Member events, discounts on pro shop merchandise, and discounted tee times and ability to pay a trail fee to use a person cart. So they're suppose to still book all their times, and the time is blocked for leagues in the system.

 

As for leagues we're the only one per the calendar so  one day one 9 is closed for 2.5 hours. 

 

Correction: there are some levels of membership that buy unlimited tee times but all times must be booked through the proshop / computer system

Yeah.  Unlimited golf anytime you want just means there aren’t any restrictions like week days only or weekends after.  
 

This doesn’t mean you don’t have to book a tee or respect tee sheet/booked rounds.  If you think you can just walk out on the course whenever you feel like it and have precident over a booked tee time that’s just looney.

 

the only exception is the ultra exclusive clubs with extremely low local members ship.  Bob parson can probably do it as his course, Jordan can do it at the grove.  But you 750 a month semi private fees don’t get you that 🙂