The Cameron Disease

[Scotttau]

The Scotty Cameron phenomenon has intrigued me for quite some time.

 

I've owned two Camerons (a Tei3 NP2 and a Tei3 NP) and had extended loans of mates' PPs, Circas etc and I still feel they are no better to use than a Ping, 350 milled etc etc.

 

So what causes the commotion that inspires people to collect them?

 

The cosntruction is clearly top-quality, but Scotty isn't the only manufacturer who makes good putters. I'd rate my current Ping Karsten Anser 2 as every bit as good to putt with as any Scotty, and it cost me a hundred brand new...

 

I'm left considering that Scotty is simply a great businessman and a marketing expert. he understands the way of the golf ho and knows how to appeal to that instinct.

 

Are his putters really better than the competition? Probably not, but he has managed to get enough pros on board through a dedication to making exactly what they want in a putter to gain immense credibility.

 

I mean, he has people collecting pitch mark repairers and headcovers!!

 

Will I buy another Scotty in my life? Probably. But does anyone agree the Scotty hysteria is slightly confusing and over the top?

[whateverworks]

Scotty majic is so far over the top I don't believe there is a name for it unless you call it "Heaven Marketing ". Great products but no better than other quality putters. He is just a smart guy and his Tour image is at the top. The prices of his headcoovers,tools and ball markers still amaze me. You correctly stated though they are no better than others but they are Scotties...

[TM golf guy]

What is the over under on how long this thread stays open? Somebody let me know, and I will get the pool started.

 

Seriously though, haven't we beat the living daylights out of the "What is special about a Cameron?" threads?

 

:drinks: ;) :cheesy: :cheesy: :yes: :) :) ;)

[scottyallanb]

I just wanted to use my saying of the month. "it is what it is!!"

 

I still cant get over his ball markers that I have made in the shop out of some scrap metal. Were going for $100 + on the bay!!!

 

 

I have no problem with the cult following but some take it to the point that its almost a Scotty Religion. I love putters not just Scotty's. Many great putters out there by many company's. Lets just love them all!!

 

Scotty B

[Tupperwolf]

The Cameron Cult is a combination of a good product spread by word of mouth, followed by massive success on tour in the public eye, and a genius marketing scheme (ultra-limited stuff). There really is nothing special about Scotty Cameron IMO except that he has managed to give his brand that superstar status that every manufacturer of every product wants.... collectibility. Great designs, great 'logoing'. Look at how many logos there are - the crown, the Circle T, the scotty dog, etc, etc - tons of logos that are all good, good designers making cool looking headcovers that are 1/10 or 1/100 - for whatever reason he found a recipe for great success. Every manufacturer of goods wants to have exactly that kind of success, where people just go crazy for anything with their name and logo on it.

 

For my money I will buy something like TP Mills any time, awesome product with a cult of its own, but on a very much more individual kind of level, where you can feel you are really connecting with the makers instead of just the brand cash cow.

[wdgolf 39]

a lot of ppl own scotty's because tiger woods has the putter, i never had the chance to use a cameron but they do look like a great putter to use, however i cant spend $300 dollars on a putter because there are other putters out there that will do the same thing.

[pm4610]

Do you think if Tiger decided to use something other than a SC, that things would change (dramatically)?

[wdgolf 39]

i dont know about dramatically but i guarantee ppl would start to by the putter he used instead of the cameron

[8thehardway]

Really no different than what's going on in the spirit world with Tequila. Absolut may have been the originator - marketing made it seem like they had pedigreed potatoes yielding extraordinary vodka. It's a spud, for crissakes!

 

All putters work and most golfers can't putt. Any vodka will loosen you up and who can taste the difference in a mixed drink? But you won't be taking that cutie from Acquisitions & Mergers home if you specify Majorska for her vodka and tonic and who can deny you are serious about your short game when you 3-putt with an expensive flatstick?

 

"How will I know it's good if it's not expensive?" People who ask themselves that question about goods or services can rest assured someone will eventually provide the appropriately expensive anser.

[El Crab]

I love my Detour, but it was my first Scotty. And I didn't buy it because its a Scotty, but because I love the way it looks. It suits my eye.

 

And I'll be damned if I'm gonna pay for the ridiculous upgrades. I wanted the 30g plug in the 35", but you can't get it without upcharging. When I got the putter, it was too light for my tastes. I was used to my The Wilson 8802 with a few strips of lead tape. So instead of sending it in and having the 75 dollar 30 gram plug in through the Workshop, I took needle-nose pliers and cranked out the 10g plug. In went 4 nickels, and screwed the plug back down. Its not quite flush, but those nickels aren't going anywhere inside, and it feels perfect. Even improved the sound. Not quite 20 more grams, but its close enough (4.9 grams per nickel, I believe).

 

And it didn't hurt that I got it for 115 dollars brand new. Gotta love P.U.D. pricing.

[whateverworks]

Scotty has way too many top Tour players using his product for things to change drastcially if TW opted out. A certain segment of the golfing public will always follow Tigers lead though. It would be a shame if those $10 headcovers actually became worth only $10.00 in the real world..

[jonwil]

Scotty putters are magic!!

[jick]

This thread is beating a dead horse. I agree.

 

There are a lot of "reference threads" about Cameron.

 

If you want something about the "Cameron Cult" check this out:

The Fall Of The Cameron Empire

If you want to know a bit about his quality control, check these out:

 

Scotty Cameron Studio Select Sweetspot

Scotty Cameron Circa Charcoal Mist - Rusting

 

And finally, if you want to get into Cameron's frame of mind, check this out:

2006 Scotty Cameron Interview

 

With all these reference threads here, I think this thread can be closed now since it calls for discussions to topics that have already been covered ad infinitum. I hope this helps.

[Deerslayer]

There is no winning ANY arguement on how good any putter is. A putter is as good as its operator and if that putters operator likes and is successful with THAT putter, then.....it IS a great putter to them. My son is infected with Cameronitus and it is costly, but if Cameronitus produces results.......that is the price one must pay. They are beautifully crafted putters

[Scotttau]

You're right deerslayer. If you're confident with a 25yo putter that's been under a lawnmower, it's a great putter for you.

 

To the "lock this thread" crowd, if I go and revive any of those threads about Scotty putters, I'm sure you'll carry on the same way (it has happend to me on another topic), so whe does that leave new members - unable to discuss any issue that has already been discussed on golfwrx. That's pretty ridiculous.

 

If you aren't interested, ignore the thrad. It's pretty simple really.

[Emm]

IMO (Emm puts his hard hat on)

 

Cameron has tapped into something fairly simple In psychological terms and that’s a need to desire, to impress, or to show off. Society seems to function on consumer purchases, female consumerism has been set up like this for years, buy these shoes, buy these bags, even if you already have 10 bags and 40 pairs of shoes!

 

Cameron understood that men don’t normally purchase like that, we usually buy when we NEED to. Cameron has tapped into the key areas that promote purchases based on desire instead of need. We desire to have something that a pro hits, we want to say to friends” Yes I bought 1 of ……… from Cameron”, look at my headcover etc. Or look at my putter rack.

 

It great to see people buying something based on desire instead of a need (like a putter), backed by tour players (the desire effect). And now by extension he has generated a desire for headcovers, and other bits. I don’t get it at all, but its fascinating to read about and see the pics.

[jick]

The publishers of a prominent national golfing publication (glossy magazine in full color) here in my country will be doing a feature on boys and their toys. I am going to do a writeup on an individual who keeps a modest Cameron collection. I am very excited about that prospect because I feel that my vast Cameron knowledge puts me in a position to do justice to that article. Perhaps once it is published, I will ask them to allow us to reproduce the writeup in this forum. We are talking months from now, but I just thought you'd get advanced notice.

[Deerslayer]

The Fall Of The Cameron Empire

I am very excited about that prospect because I feel that my vast Cameron knowledge puts me in a position to do justice to that article.

We are talking months from now, but I just thought you'd get advanced notice.

 

 

Are you SURE Scotty Cameron will still be in business by then? :fool:

[greengolfhippo]

I think that if you would go over to the TCC site you would find that many old time poster have left and nolonger post. That there are more for sale post that disscusion post. That it is ruled with an iron hand, you can not mention any other putter makes but Scotty or you face being disbarment.

Thanks to other internet sites I have found other putter makers just as good at a better price.

In fact I now use a Copper Stix by Bruce Sizemore instead of a Scotty and putt much better.

 

It will be interesting to see how all this plays out regarding sales of Camerons at inflated prices with the current money/credit problems we are having here and around the world.

[Joeypole]

I must say Emm, you hit the nail on the head.

 

Scotty has taken golf marketing to a whole new level. He still isn't selling as many OTR putters as some of the other guys but he is selling a huge amount of "Tour" putters that leave his shop. Between those sales and all the "Limited" releases he is making a good fair share of money.

 

Its all about product placement.

 

Pay cash to Tour Pros to put your putter in there bag. Gets some people to question why is Sergio gaming a Cameron when he is under contract with TM (yes I know he switched last week).

 

He is (or someone at Titleist is) a marketing genius.

 

Scotty makes a good product. There are a lot of other guys out there who make just as good if not better product (in some peoples opinions).

 

Some of the backroom stuff that goes on with Cameron's business practices and the collectors as a whole has left a bad taste in my mouth.

 

Just my .02 for what its worth.

 

Just know I'll never own another one.

[yoshiod9]

Just know I'll never own another one.

 

Nor will I... I love the fact that my Byron Morgans/John Byrons feel so much nicer than my Camerons. I won't buy another SC putter but I'll probably buy a head cover or something if it catches my eye!

[bub72ck]

Scotty is a marketing master and he has taken ideas that noone else in mainstream golf decided to act upon and made millions. Ping created the Anser style putter but never made the decision to put someones initials or a custom finish or stamp on them and market them as "Tour". To me that is Ping's fault. Putter makers never made the decision to put dancing suns or dogs or cars or horses or lobsters or ducks or snowmen or crowns or.... on a headcover and THEN make 100 of the 1000 made a "special-special edition" with something different about those covers driving up the price. Again, everyone elses fault for not thinking of that. I know now that the Scotty putters are not any different than other custom or non-custom putters you can buy. Honestly, I liked Scotty putters because they were made by Titleist not because they were Scottys. I still use the same TeI3 putter I used 8 years ago and have no plans to buy a new SC. I would just be cutting it down and sticking lead tape on it anyway. People who don't understand why Scotty has such a following need to look at his marketing plan and understand that he makes his "stuff" desirable by tapping into our ego for unique and flashy products. I admit I am a victim too but I guess I just don't care.

[medic170979]

Really no different than what's going on in the spirit world with Tequila. Absolut may have been the originator - marketing made it seem like they had pedigreed potatoes yielding extraordinary vodka. It's a spud, for crissakes!

 

All putters work and most golfers can't putt. Any vodka will loosen you up and who can taste the difference in a mixed drink? But you won't be taking that cutie from Acquisitions & Mergers home if you specify Majorska for her vodka and tonic and who can deny you are serious about your short game when you 3-putt with an expensive flatstick?

 

"How will I know it's good if it's not expensive?" People who ask themselves that question about goods or services can rest assured someone will eventually provide the appropriately expensive anser.

 

LMAO!!!!!!!!!! I'm a Scotty fan but this response is priceless!!! :fool:

Well done!!

[Ezgolfer]

And so is Bettinardi if i say so.

Those aren't cheap either or made of a different material .

[Emm]

Scotty is a marketing master and he has taken ideas that noone else in mainstream golf decided to act upon and made millions. Ping created the Anser style putter but never made the decision to put someones initials or a custom finish or stamp on them and market them as "Tour". To me that is Ping's fault. Putter makers never made the decision to put dancing suns or dogs or cars or horses or lobsters or ducks or snowmen or crowns or.... on a headcover and THEN make 100 of the 1000 made a "special-special edition" with something different about those covers driving up the price. Again, everyone elses fault for not thinking of that. I know now that the Scotty putters are not any different than other custom or non-custom putters you can buy. Honestly, I liked Scotty putters because they were made by Titleist not because they were Scottys. I still use the same TeI3 putter I used 8 years ago and have no plans to buy a new SC. I would just be cutting it down and sticking lead tape on it anyway. People who don't understand why Scotty has such a following need to look at his marketing plan and understand that he makes his "stuff" desirable by tapping into our ego for unique and flashy products. I admit I am a victim too but I guess I just don't care.

 

 

If only you guys knew what I know... worked for as one of the 3 Cameron Distributors for two years...all I can say is KOOL AID! :fool:

 

bub72ck: I don't see a reason why you should care, if you find the Scotty Cameron marketing strategy enticing enough to buy his putters, headcovers or markers that’s great. People collect all sorts of weird and wonderful things, Its just amazing to be able to have a high demand for a product, even if the demand is only created through a manufactured short supply.

 

Venno: I would love to find out what you know, coming from the UK I don’t get the Kool Aid reference. If you don’t want to spill the beans send me a PM.

 

Ezgolfer: With regard to the above post, I think Bettinardi putters are made from something a little different. but don't take my word for it listen to Bob Bettinardi…

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/putters/

[jdawg690]

This thread is beating a dead horse. I agree.

 

There are a lot of "reference threads" about Cameron.

 

If you want something about the "Cameron Cult" check this out:

The Fall Of The Cameron Empire

If you want to know a bit about his quality control, check these out:

 

Scotty Cameron Studio Select Sweetspot

Scotty Cameron Circa Charcoal Mist - Rusting

 

And finally, if you want to get into Cameron's frame of mind, check this out:

2006 Scotty Cameron Interview

 

With all these reference threads here, I think this thread can be closed now since it calls for discussions to topics that have already been covered ad infinitum. I hope this helps.

 

 

I also find it hilarious that although there is a lot of smack being thrown Scotty's way this guy owns one that's a Custom no less. :fool:

 

Jason

[jrsharp21]

The Scotty Cameron craze reminds me of the Air Jordan craze in the sneaker world. I used to collect Air Jordans and nothing would touch my feet but shoes that had that Jumpman symbol on it.

[devildog66]

Well I will tell you this... the 'sweet spot' method being used in the sub-articles is flawed and that is definitely the reason that the supposed 'sweet spot' is located behind the sight-line -- and the reason that those relying on that test are wrong and buttressing up their prejudices. As a note, I do have a Newport myself. It is the one that I am playing with -- not just one that I bought and rotate in and out of play. Full disclosure there. Also full disclosure is that if something isn't right -- no matter what the representatives say, I will 'call a spade a spade!'

 

Here's the problem with the 'testing' method they used (there are several flaws in the method but this is the one that kinda puts it into perspective: When these people grab the shaft, they allow the shaft to align vertical and perpendicular to the deck. I ask you... do you -- or anyone you know, put with the shaft hanging vertically? NOPE! You put with an angle to the shaft. The only alignment commensurate with an outside agency such as the deck -- or a right-angle device like a plumb line or a true vertical surface is when the sole of the club is aligned the way that Mr. Cameron intended you to use it -- i.e., is it supposed to be struck with its bottom/sole to be level with the deck, toe up, heel up? Assuming that the sole is supposed to be flat with the surface... that changes the torqued head when it is struck using the stated balance finding method. Hold the club so that the head is flat to the deck and you will find that the 'balance' point is now right in line with the sight-line.

 

So, the method of testing is what was flawed. I am not making a statement for or against Scotty -- just an explanation that those who were using a flawed method in order to discredit Mr. Cameron and that such useage renders their statements flawed as well.

[Emm]

^^^ Did you post this in the wrong section??

 

The sweetspot thread is completely separate to this...

[touch]

Do you think if Tiger decided to use something other than a SC, that things would change (dramatically)?

 

No way....It would not even phase the Scotty magic.

I would love it if TIger switched.....he should be using a crappy Nike Putter for the trillions they pay him.