6 hr rounds Is this the new trend?

[WichitaDuffer]

Yeah, Tex Consolver here in Wichita on the weekends is like a petting zoo of people. I was unaware I could ask for a rain check if I felt the pace of play is too slow, of course it makes a lot more sense as to why the cashier sometimes says "no rain checks today". I played TC for the last time last Sunday because it was like waiting in line at the DMV between holes. Next season I am going to look into joining a private course, because me and my friend usually don't take more than 4.5 hours to do 18 (we would be faster, but my buddy has a fake leg, and I am not pushing him to speed up because we know how to cart golf for the most part.) So for now, Hidden Lakes is my home course.

let me ask you guys this because I was in this situation about 4 weeks ago:
I was playing with my buddy and his son. The whole reason my buddy (Tim) and his stepson (Jake) are out on the course is because Jake is really getting into golf. Tim has never golfed a day in his entire life. We get out there, have an 8am tee time, and we are off. I am having a decent round, drives are straight, approach shots are good, putting is killing me (as per usual). We catch up to the group in front of us on the 3rd tee, and we get caught by a single with his grandson. We let the single play through and that's when it all goes awry. Tim wants to enjoy himself, so I am trying to help him out as best I can to just get him to just make contact with the ball, and Jake is playing decently for a 13 yr old. Groups ahead are visible, but pulling away, groups behind are closing in fast. By the time we get to the back 9, the groups ahead are NOWHERE to be found, and the groups behind are stacking up. I immediately try to remedy the situation saying I need to grab a hot dog and bathroom break and head into the club house. I kill a good 30 - 45 minutes to let as many groups get through as possible without arousing suspicion. We head back out and immediately start stacking up groups again, I apologize for all 3 and offer people the chance to play through. Several groups did, but on the 14th the group behind us said no, its ok. So we skip the 14th move directly to the 15th. Once we get to the 15th, here comes the Marshal talking about pace of play, I apologize profusely, and try and explain in private that Tim is VERY new and trying to get him to speed up. I told the marshal its under control and skipped to the 17th to let the guys play the last 2 holes. We FINALLY get off the course 2:45, and I am sunburnt and kind of upset (my fault).

I know I should have started skipping holes sooner, but Tim is one of those guys that says "Hey I paid to play too, I have just as much right to blah blah blah" I try explaining to him about pace of play, its on the scorecard for a reason and all that jazz. Told him I will work with him and Jake on a driving range, and maybe next time take Jake out myself.

Having said all of that, how do I tell somebody that we NEED to speed up/skip holes because the 30 groups behind have paid as well and we are causing amusement park wait times in a very hot part of the day (103* at noon) without being rude? Tim is a good guy trying to be there for Jake (long story) but for the love of god I could have lapped them if I was playing by myself. Any input would be appreciated, like I said, I know I should have done more to speed up sooner.

[mesquite2]

How do you overbook a golf course? I work at at 2 course complex in Nj & we have 10 minute teetime spacing. So, only 6 teetimes per hour. I have a regular group that tees it up at noon on Thursdays. Last week we had 5 threesomes, I was in the first threesome, we were done in 2:50, the last threesome did 3:20, if there is a very slow group in front of us I will drive up to them & ask what their problem is, no round should take more than 4 hours at the most. I have a friend from England who says that a 4 hour round is not tolerated there & play just moves along.

[hurricanes7]

[quote name='mesquite2' timestamp='1284994773' post='2705421']
How do you overbook a golf course? I work at at 2 course complex in Nj & we have 10 minute teetime spacing. So, only 6 teetimes per hour. I have a regular group that tees it up at noon on Thursdays. Last week we had 5 threesomes, I was in the first threesome, we were done in 2:50, the last threesome did 3:20, if there is a very slow group in front of us I will drive up to them & ask what their problem is, no round should take more than 4 hours at the most. I have a friend from England who says that a 4 hour round is not tolerated there & play just moves along.
[/quote]

golf on TV is bad for slow play. they watch the pros and figure thats what they need to do to be good. waste of time. im the first player off at my course and im done by myself in 2.5 hours. even my wife cant complain with that

[fairyinatie]

I played in scramble Friday and we teed off at 8 am. We finished at 11:30 and went in to eat right after putting are clubs up. We went to banquet room and there were several groups already eating but they were in the afternoon flight . No other teams from morning flight had made it in. We probably sat there go good 30 minutes or so. We walked down to scoreboard to see if any other scores were posted several times . There were still teams out on course at 12:50 and afternoon flight were supposed to tee off at 1. We finished 1 1/2 hours ahead of most of the groups and there was no excuse for a 5 hour round for them. There were only 7 teams for the morning flight!!!! I can only imagine how long it would have taken if these had played in afternoon flight with other 27 teams. We finally found out we won a little after 1 pm. I guess we played quick shooting a 53 and winning by 6!

Can you ask to play through during a scramble?

[toddnt]

Had a 5+ hour round in Palm Springs yesterday and it was 113, was ready to quit after 9!

[TrickyTree]

I get extreamly angry with anything over 4 hrs.

If my course gets anywhere near 6 hrs i will go fishing on a saturday instead.

[Senior_Golfer]

I feel it is the course marshal that makes the difference. I have played some very crowded courses, and if a course has a "good" marshal the worst round will be 4 1/2 on the most crowded day. Also it requires some common sense from the Pro shop, or the starter.

Sadly most cases marshals are not well trained, and that is partly due to the fact the PGA Member (Professional) at the course does not have the background or training to understand course management. Management, mostly PGA Members, do not understands how to train marshals.

Hopefully there will be more comments, like the ones on this forum, given to the course management and they will wake up to the importance of pace of play.

[nitefisher111]

I seriously don't understand the "course is overbooked" theory. It makes little difference how many people are on the course, ONLY how fast the people on the course choose (or are forced) to play their rounds. Simply, if slow play is not tolerated it will go away. It's up to the course to enforce it.....PERIOD.

[aliikane]

I think the slow play is from a new crop of players (post tiger) that just started golf and are beginners. they watch golf on tv and see how long they take on every shot. then play the same way they do. unfortunately taking that much time on 100+ strokes takes much longer and is probably a 6 hour round. there is unspoken rules and etiquette on the public courses not to take much time from earlier generations but hasn't got to new generation. i played golf with all my dad's friends and they were sticklers for the etiquette of the game.

groups are as slow as their slowest player. beginners need to play each shot quicker to keep up. it is bad that beginners need to play faster but a reality to keep pace. if you are playing less strokes like 70-80s you can take more time. just a simple math problem. less strokes take less time. however, i do play with people who are beginners and know how to keep up.

don't get me wrong, growth of golf is great and new players coming to game is good but maybe there should be a written handbook of unwritten rules and etiquette for courses.

[iCollector]

I would quit golf if rounds approached 6 hrs.

As it is, a round approaching 4:30 is painful now. I walked off after 15 last week because of slow play.

Reading through here there are things that can be done... If course managers didn't pack people in [u][i][b]AND[/b][/i][/u] marshals did their jobs and sped up the slow players for example.

I play with a couple who are not exceptional players, but still, they won't hold up play, and we have completed out rounds at about 4 hours. I could, and have played easily under 4 hour rounds, but that is without anyone ahead of the group.

No way rounds should take that long!

[Greenie]

In my case above mentioned it was definately a case of over booking. When we checked in the two guys talking behind the desk were saying things like "we can put this group in here and this group between them. When we got to the starter there were a line of foursomes waiting to tee off.
I thought it was harlious when the ranger rode up to us, while were waiting to hit onto the green and said we needed to pick up play. I said what? you want us to hit into them? and for what? I said there are guys on the green and two foursomes watching the group on the next tee teeing off. He just laughed and said they have more then expected come out today and they still had a tourney to get in later.
Now how can you have more then expected. If you had the tee times spaced you already know the max number you can have on the course. I doubt any course would let one group slow the course up that bad. They overbooked!

[Blues Golfer]

Among all the problems, the biggest is ego.

Why is it ok for someone to brag that they shot 112 from the back tees, but they got their money's worth, but be too proud to play from the tees that would afford them a round in at least double digits?

I am mystified why someone is more ashamed of where they hit the ball from, than how many hundred strokes they rack up.

It makes no sense to take pride in shooting a 112 from the back tees "because that's where Tiger plays from."

Is golf now an "all you can stuff in your face buffet?"

Maybe just maybe the courses are reaching their breaking point, where they start making people pay according to either the tees they want to play, or the time on the course. Start charging people an extra ten bucks to waste their time from the tips, and you'll see how many people find joy in the red, white, and blue.


As for slow play, I finally broke down and joined a private club. Best decision I could have made. If I ever have to drop it, I'll probably quit playing seriously. There is no point to playing golf, when it takes 6 hours.

[BogeyDog11]

Wife and I played 18 yesterday at our home course which is private in 3 hrs 10 min. I then met my brother in law later in the day at a local 9 hole muni and it took us 2 hrs 20 minutes to play 9. The only foursome on the course had everyone backed up. We caught up to them on the second tee and they said "we already let one twosome thru, so you will have to wait". Waited on every shot the rest of the way. The course super does not care either.
Slow play has always been the cancer of golf. Some people just don't get it.

[birdieboy52]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1286543430' post='2734246']
Wife and I played 18 yesterday at our home course which is private in 3 hrs 10 min. I then met my brother in law later in the day at a local 9 hole muni and it took us 2 hrs 20 minutes to play 9. The only foursome on the course had everyone backed up. We caught up to them on the second tee and they said "we already let one twosome thru, so you will have to wait". Waited on every shot the rest of the way. The course super does not care either.
Slow play has always been the cancer of golf. Some people just don't get it.
[/quote]


What was ahead of the foursome? Was there an open hole directly in front of them? Were they riding? Were you riding?

[Pweb44]

I have a 7hr round one time, but that is far from the norm, usually I'm through a round in 4 to 4.5 hours.

[BogeyDog11]

[quote name='birdieboy52' timestamp='1286544207' post='2734255']
[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1286543430' post='2734246']
Wife and I played 18 yesterday at our home course which is private in 3 hrs 10 min. I then met my brother in law later in the day at a local 9 hole muni and it took us 2 hrs 20 minutes to play 9. The only foursome on the course had everyone backed up. We caught up to them on the second tee and they said "we already let one twosome thru, so you will have to wait". Waited on every shot the rest of the way. The course super does not care either.
Slow play has always been the cancer of golf. Some people just don't get it.
[/quote]


What was ahead of the foursome? Was there an open hole directly in front of them? Were they riding? Were you riding?
[/quote]

The only thing in front of this foursome was the two they let thru just before we caught them. They were on carts, we were walking.
I knew everyone in the group as we live in a small town. I told one of them when we finished that if I ever got them behind me it was going to be hell to pay.

[BogeyDog11]

Today, I played at a great old course that was packed. I was in a threesome and we had a 10:50 tee time. It was solid foursomes out in front of us but we got off right at our tee time and to make a long story short, we finished right at 3 hrs 40 minutes and never played thru anyone nor had anyone play thru us.
Just goes to show what can happen when a course has a super that knows how to run a course. Very pleasant round.

[birdieboy52]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1286581434' post='2734997']
[quote name='birdieboy52' timestamp='1286544207' post='2734255']
[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1286543430' post='2734246']
Wife and I played 18 yesterday at our home course which is private in 3 hrs 10 min. I then met my brother in law later in the day at a local 9 hole muni and it took us 2 hrs 20 minutes to play 9. The only foursome on the course had everyone backed up. We caught up to them on the second tee and they said "we already let one twosome thru, so you will have to wait". Waited on every shot the rest of the way. The course super does not care either.
Slow play has always been the cancer of golf. Some people just don't get it.
[/quote]


What was ahead of the foursome? Was there an open hole directly in front of them? Were they riding? Were you riding?
[/quote]

The only thing in front of this foursome was the two they let thru just before we caught them. They were on carts, we were walking.
I knew everyone in the group as we live in a small town. I told one of them when we finished that if I ever got them behind me it was going to be hell to pay.
[/quote]


That just sucks. I would have waled through them, right down the middle of the fairway to the next hole.

[BogeyDog11]

Ya, I feel the same way but we are in a small town where everyone knows everyone. The super on the course, which just opened 3 yrs ago is from out of town and has never been willing to do anything about the slow play. I rarely play there for this reason.
They would kick you out for hitting into a group while saying nothing to the group playing so slow. I told one guy in the group after we finished, that if I ever got them behind me, it would be hell to pay. They have no idea how slow it will be. I'll hit ten balls off of every tee and play them all out.

[Prairie Golfer]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1286593417' post='2735252']
Ya, I feel the same way but we are in a small town where everyone knows everyone. The super on the course, which just opened 3 yrs ago is from out of town and has never been willing to do anything about the slow play. I rarely play there for this reason.
They would kick you out for hitting into a group while saying nothing to the group playing so slow. I told one guy in the group after we finished, that if I ever got them behind me, it would be hell to pay. They have no idea how slow it will be. I'll hit ten balls off of every tee and play them all out.
[/quote]

I'm playing a Ryder Cup Four Ball match. Ben Crane and Jack Nicklaus against Berhard Langer and Padraig Harrington from the back tees. I really can't copy their swings, but everything else should be about the same. Tim Conway in his role of The Old Man will be the official. I'm probably going to need lots of rulings. Set your sun dials folks!

[bordenms19]

If I was on pace for a 6 hour round after 9 hole I would get a rain check with out even thinking about it. I have only had a handful of rounds over 4 hours all season. I have had plenty of rounds around 3 hours. If I were you I would complain to the management and not golf at that course again with until management could promise me there would be less waiting.

[tElihu]

[quote name='nitefisher111' timestamp='1286214975' post='2727831']
I seriously don't understand the "course is overbooked" theory. It makes little difference how many people are on the course, ONLY how fast the people on the course choose (or are forced) to play their rounds. Simply, if slow play is not tolerated it will go away. It's up to the course to enforce it.....PERIOD.
[/quote]

It's simple. The pace of play is dictated by the slowest group. On average, the more groups you have, the slower your slowest group will be.

[DaveGord]

I was fortunate to live in St. Andrews a while back and was a member at one of the clubs there. We used to play in a foursomes competition that was played on the Old Course. Because of work me and my partner could only play late afternoon.
A packed Old Course playing foursomes! Regularly it would be 20 minutes before you had a shot!
Definitely couldn't get into the groove!

[Bobcat 2]

Its why I went with a private club. At our place rounds take about 3.5 hours on peak Sat mornings. People there just pick up when they will ESC max, so the pace of play is quick. On public courses there are folks putting for 12 and higher all over the place. That adds up to really slow rounds for everyone no matter how many groups are out there.

[Senior_Golfer]

When I was a course marshall I have, on occassions, ask a foresome on a 3.5hr pace to pull over and let the foresome behind them through. A good marshall can make the request in a manner not to offend anyone in the group. The object is a good pace of play, and for everyone to have a good time and experience. I found it easy to do both. A reason the management asked me to open on their most crowded days.

One thng I had to explain to the Pro's in the shop was not to send out twosomes. Twosomes will shut down the pace pf play quickly, but at times a newer Pro would send out a twosome, and I would find a way to deal with them, which is difficult but not impossible. Being a course marshall can be an interesting challenge because of the many varibles when dealing with people of different skill levels.

[charge]

Anything over 4 hours and I feel like I'm daydreaming...

[birdieboy52]

[quote name='Senior_Golfer' timestamp='1290043018' post='2795866']
When I was a course marshall I have, on occassions, ask a foresome on a 3.5hr pace to pull over and let the foresome behind them through. A good marshall can make the request in a manner not to offend anyone in the group. The object is a good pace of play, and for everyone to have a good time and experience. I found it easy to do both. A reason the management asked me to open on their most crowded days.

One thng I had to explain to the Pro's in the shop was not to send out twosomes. Twosomes will shut down the pace pf play quickly, but at times a newer Pro would send out a twosome, and I would find a way to deal with them, which is difficult but not impossible. Being a course marshall can be an interesting challenge because of the many varibles when dealing with people of different skill levels.
[/quote]


How could a twosome shut down the pace of play?

[TourSpoon]

I played at my home course and for the first time this season we had to wait on the front nine. By the time we made the turn it was cleared out and we finished just at 4 hours (front over 2...back under 2). The ranger said that he finally had to ask one of the lead groups on hole nine to pick up their balls and go to hole ten because he had warned them enough. That is why I play there. They know that pace of play brings back customers and also allows more people to play.

[rsballer10]

[quote name='TourSpoon' timestamp='1295741163' post='2915820']
I played at my home course and for the first time this season we had to wait on the front nine. By the time we made the turn it was cleared out and we finished just at 4 hours (front over 2...back under 2). The ranger said that he finally had to ask one of the lead groups on hole nine to pick up their balls and go to hole ten because he had warned them enough. That is why I play there. They know that pace of play brings back customers and also allows more people to play.
[/quote]

Even though i just worked a course as a silly summer job, In the case of where I worked at in my opinion it is the players that create the slow play. All jam-ups were usually caused by only one group, and it affected everyone that was behind them. Almost always it was because of silly-drawn-out practice routines. It seems like some people think that taking ten practice swings and waggling for a minute creates good shots. I hate ranting, but I was astonished at how many times myself and up to three other people that worked there would get stuck behind smaller groups that were riding. And we were walking lol.
It's incredible how many people are aware of golf being a game of etiquette, yet have no problem playing like it's an all day expirience. I mean, my favorite part of playing golf is playing golf, not waggling or routines lol.

Sorry for my angry rant but i feel better now, and am excited for better weather to come i guess 6 hrs is better than sitting inside and not playing golf...

[Greenie]

Actually 6 hr. rounds isn't better then not playing at all. If it comes to be a regular thing I will be looking elsewhere for my enjoyment because 6 hr. rounds isn't enjoyable at all. Alot of my friends from work don't play as much as they use to because they are fed up with slow play. I have learned to accept a 4 1/2 hr. round but a 6 hr. round is not acceptable period.