Tiger withdraws with achilles injury

[Redhill]

[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331581729' post='4491935']
Unfortunately, this is going to be my very first post on this forum. I've read about 75% of the comments made in this thread from the very start, before making my post.

One of the ways you know you are dealing with someone who is 100% clueless about what it takes to be a professional athlete in any sport, is by listening to them speak with respect to both injuries and how an athlete should respond to injury. Clearly, there are not many former professional athletes on this forum, so I won't dig in too deep, on the hopelessly clueless, irrational and illogical comments that I read earlier from people pretending to be "tough guys" and pretending to "know" what it means for an athlete to respond to injury.

I've been fortunate in my life to have had a 4 year career in the NCAA (football), a 3.25 year career in the NFL and 12 year career in the USAF. I actually began playing football at the age of 8, and put on pads for the very first time at 11. By the time I got to college, I had nearly 11 years of experience playing football, but had never dealt with serious injury up to that point.

I was extremely fortunate to get through 4 years of NCAA football, without suffering any serious injury whatsoever. It was not until I arrived at the NFL, that I began to experience what I had seen other players experience, my entire football career. Injury, is a natural component of all high-level competitive sports. I have known and routinely trained with Olympic Athletes over the years, who have constantly battled repetitive injuries on their way to winning Olympic Medal. I've seen the psychological, emotional and physical battles that Athletes have to endure, just to be able to survive in their respective Sport.

I know what it means to "play with pain." I know the personal psychology behind the motivation for playing with pain. I also know the the extent to which some Athletes are willing to go, in order to continue playing with pain. And, I've seen the physical and psychological destruction that can come from constantly playing with the wrong kinds of pain. What most of the Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks don't understand and don't have a solitary clue about, is that there is not a singular Top Athlete anywhere in the entire world, who would not give their Right Arm, to be able to [b]finish their competitive event after suffering injury.[/b]

So, when I see people posting about Tiger Woods, the most prolific Professional Golfer in my lifetime, not having what it takes to finish a round of golf, or "quitting" on his round because he was not at the top of the Leader Board, it reminds me all to well that there is major distinction between a "Fan" and someone who supports the Sport through their patronage AND through their [b]knowledge of the game.[/b] As a former player of both a collegiate and a professional sport, I have [b]always[/b] admired and respected those who supported the Game not just monetarily, but also from a position of [b]knowledge and understanding[/b] about what it takes to become a Top Athlete, regardless of the sport.

When you make comments that reference "O.J.," it becomes obviously that yours is not a sincere concern for the Game, the Sport or the Athlete. It becomes obvious that yours comes directly from a myopic view of life that contains some small minded personal vendetta against Tiger Woods, that is both irrational and illogical at its core. Tiger Woods, has probably demonstrated more ability to play with pain, than any Professional Golfer that I've ever known. He's not only played with pain, he's won with pain. Considering that we are talking about a Golf Swing, he's done nothing short of pulling off a miracle with his win on what was essentially one leg. It will forever be recalled in my mind (personally) as the "One Leg Victory."

When you find another Athlete on the PGA Tour that is tougher and/or more talented/skilled than Tiger Woods (both mentally and physically), drop me a line on this forum and let me know. I know a serious Player/Athlete when I see one. And, I've never seen one more serious, more tough, more capable, more talented, and more [b]productive[/b] in my generation than Tiger Woods. You may not like the fact that he's made some personal mistakes in his life, but none of you can look in a mirror and claim that you have [b]zero sin in your own lives.[/b]

At the end of the day, after he's taken the requisite time to recover and after he finds his way back into his personal "slot," he'll go on to capture Jack's long standing record of 18 Major victories, by placing an exclamation point on his 19th Major. Of that fact, you can all be 100% certain.
[/quote]

Wow.... that was impressive. I especially liked the part about your NFL experience spanning 3.25 years. Is that kind of like the little boy that says he is 8.5 years old?

So from a reading of your post, is it a requirement to have had a 3.25 year career in the NFL or be a PGA touring pro to be able to post an opinion on Eldrick's mental and physical conditions?

I think you will find a couple of docs on these boards with some sound opinions on injury treatments but then again I'm not sure that most of them have had a NFL career so they may have to look at their surgical case history on the same kind of injuries that Eldrick has as null and void. Somehow I'm going with their input over yours. Sorry.

So from my non NFL background (I only played 3.98 years of NCAA Div I basketball......no NBA time, darn it!) i wondered why he would want an ice bag for the left "leg", knee or Achilles, and then drive off for a long drive home! My non NFL opinion, and I do have one, is that it's a knee that needs an evaluation.

Just my opinion, but I like it and I'm not at all certain or close to it about that 19th major. Seems like it's fading away without an exclamation point!!

[Barto78]

I swear, some of you folks could learn a thing or 2 about civility. I know i shouldn't call the kettle black or cast stones in a glass house, but the rude factor has seemingly gone up 5 fold on these forums in the last few months.

[502 to Right]

[quote name='Barto78' timestamp='1331586317' post='4492559']
I swear, some of you folks could learn a thing or 2 about civility. I know i shouldn't call the kettle black or cast stones in a glass house, but the rude factor has seemingly gone up 5 fold on these forums in the last few months.
[/quote]


It's Tiger's fault.

[Frankie Lob Wedge]

[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331584346' post='4492327']
[quote name=%26%2339%3BFrankie Lob Wedge' timestamp='1331581769' post='4491945']Other athletes have like Bill Russell, Bob Cousy, Curt Shilling, Willis Reed, Kirk Gibson, Ronnie Lott, Jack Youngblood, Phil probably with his arthritis. <br /><br />Sometimes guys need to step up. Sometimes it is gut check time, Some guys step up to the plate.<br />[/quote]


Other "Athletes" played other sports that don't require anywhere near the same level of mental focus and neuro-muscular, inter-muscular and intra-muscular coordination. The Golf Swing is [b]unique[/b] among all professional Sports because it involves a massive amount of [b]precision[/b]. This should be common sense for even the most Amateur of golf enthusiasts. Anyone that has ever picked-up a golf club of any kind, should be able to tell the difference and the distinction between the precision it takes to hit an 8-iron from 178yds away to within 12ft of the hole under tournament pressure -vs- taking a hand-off deep in the backfield with a broken wrist and hitting the "B" gap on your way to level two contact with a linebacker. Even if you have never played a single down of football, if you have ever picked up a golf club, the distinction should not be all that difficult to imagine.

In fact, I find it a little absurd that anyone would need such a thing clarified for them. Golf requires a sound Mind, a sound Body, and a Sound spirit. You need to feel whole and complete when you play golf at the Professional level and under Professional Tournament pressures. Anything in your life that is not right, will come up and surface itself, sooner or later. You can count on it. Golf is a unique Sport, a special Sport and you need to be healthy to play it at the highest level.

Furthermore, I have personally witnessed Professional Athletes pull themselves out of action for injuries that were [b]far less[/b] that what Tiger Woods, is currently dealing with right now - and all of those men were playing a Team Sport. So, they had the responsibility of doing what was best, not just or themselves, but for the entire Team.

A Professional Golfer, has to evaluate Risk AND Reward. He, or She, has to consider the [b]long-term damage that could result from pressing an injury and making it worse.[/b] ACL type injuries are NOTHING to play with. They are NOT a joke. I have seen Athletes that would have gone on to become huge household names, but the public has never heard of their name before, because of an ACL injury that took place very early in the college career - so they never made it to the Professional level, even though had they made it, their name would have been bigger than the most.

I've seen extremely talented individual, not just in football, but in Gymnastics for example; never have the opportunity to compete for for an Olympic Medal. Why? Because of the dreaded ACL injury. It is not something to play with. Some people can bounce back from ACL surgery in a flash and go on to be seemingly better than thy were before the injury, while others seem to get hampered with ACL "fallout" for the remainder of their career.

I played with Ronnie Lot. I know Ronnie Lott, personally. I know what kind of pain he's played through and I also know what kind of injuries kept him on the sidelines, even when he wanted (desperately) to be on the field. Ronnie Lott, is not the only one. I also know Eddie Anderson, and played with him as well. As quiet as it is kept, Eddie, as just as big a hard hitting Safety as Ronnie Lott, was - but even Eddie, had to pull himself out of games after suffering difficult injuries.

Trying to compare what a Safety in the NFL does in his role on the field, with Tiger Woods, trying to focus on hitting a 6-iron to a green that is 245yds away, is like trying to compare the night time interdiction capabilities and precision of an F-15E Eagle, to the cutting capability of a Neurosurgeon's scalpel. They are simply two entirely different worlds. Both require [u]extreme[/u] precision. One can be done with all heck breaking lose around the Pilot, while the other must be done in an absolutely focused and sterile environment [b]with zero distractions[/b] around the Surgeon.
[/quote]

Ben Hogan's body was wrecked in a terrible car crash in 1949. His car had 1949 safety which means no safety. he was rebuilt with 1949/50's medical technology which was a joke compared to today.

He won 6 majors after the crash playing with terrible pain. Hogan knew how to step it up.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CApJbFStuMs"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CApJbFStuMs[/url]

[bscinstnct]

[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331584346' post='4492327']
[quote name=%26%2339%3BFrankie Lob Wedge' timestamp='1331581769' post='4491945']Other athletes have like Bill Russell, Bob Cousy, Curt Shilling, Willis Reed, Kirk Gibson, Ronnie Lott, Jack Youngblood, Phil probably with his arthritis. <br /><br />Sometimes guys need to step up. Sometimes it is gut check time, Some guys step up to the plate.<br />[/quote]


Other "Athletes" played other sports that don't require anywhere near the same level of mental focus and neuro-muscular, inter-muscular and intra-muscular coordination. The Golf Swing is [b]unique[/b] among all professional Sports because it involves a massive amount of [b]precision[/b]. This should be common sense for even the most Amateur of golf enthusiasts. Anyone that has ever picked-up a golf club of any kind, should be able to tell the difference and the distinction between the precision it takes to hit an 8-iron from 178yds away to within 12ft of the hole under tournament pressure -vs- taking a hand-off deep in the backfield with a broken wrist and hitting the "B" gap on your way to level two contact with a linebacker. Even if you have never played a single down of football, if you have ever picked up a golf club, the distinction should not be all that difficult to imagine.

In fact, I find it a little absurd that anyone would need such a thing clarified for them. Golf requires a sound Mind, a sound Body, and a Sound spirit. You need to feel whole and complete when you play golf at the Professional level and under Professional Tournament pressures. Anything in your life that is not right, will come up and surface itself, sooner or later. You can count on it. Golf is a unique Sport, a special Sport and you need to be healthy to play it at the highest level.

Furthermore, I have personally witnessed Professional Athletes pull themselves out of action for injuries that were [b]far less[/b] that what Tiger Woods, is currently dealing with right now - and all of those men were playing a Team Sport. So, they had the responsibility of doing what was best, not just or themselves, but for the entire Team.

A Professional Golfer, has to evaluate Risk AND Reward. He, or She, has to consider the [b]long-term damage that could result from pressing an injury and making it worse.[/b] ACL type injuries are NOTHING to play with. They are NOT a joke. I have seen Athletes that would have gone on to become huge household names, but the public has never heard of their name before, because of an ACL injury that took place very early in the college career - so they never made it to the Professional level, even though had they made it, their name would have been bigger than the most.

I've seen extremely talented individual, not just in football, but in Gymnastics for example; never have the opportunity to compete for for an Olympic Medal. Why? Because of the dreaded ACL injury. It is not something to play with. Some people can bounce back from ACL surgery in a flash and go on to be seemingly better than thy were before the injury, while others seem to get hampered with ACL "fallout" for the remainder of their career.

I played with Ronnie Lot. I know Ronnie Lott, personally. I know what kind of pain he's played through and I also know what kind of injuries kept him on the sidelines, even when he wanted (desperately) to be on the field. Ronnie Lott, is not the only one. I also know Eddie Anderson, and played with him as well. As quiet as it is kept, Eddie, as just as big a hard hitting Safety as Ronnie Lott, was - but even Eddie, had to pull himself out of games after suffering difficult injuries.

Trying to compare what a Safety in the NFL does in his role on the field, with Tiger Woods, trying to focus on hitting a 6-iron to a green that is 245yds away, is like trying to compare the night time interdiction capabilities and precision of an F-15E Eagle, to the cutting capability of a Neurosurgeon's scalpel. They are simply two entirely different worlds. Both require [u]extreme[/u] precision. One can be done with all heck breaking lose around the Pilot, while the other must be done in an absolutely focused and sterile environment [b]with zero distractions[/b] around the Surgeon.
[/quote]

Good point, as weird as it is, in some respects, it's easier to play football with a twisted ankle or a broken finger than to play golf with one.

You can get into the hole and just toss your body in there and stop a run. In football, you can just play til you can't walk around anymore. Not that I played in the NFL, but I did some poppin! Play around the pain to whatever extent you can tolerate it. You can play football at 80% but not PGA golf because of the precision required, as you point out.

And I love these "writers" questioning Tiger's toughness.

Tiger proved he will suffer through pain and permanent injury to win a US Open.

Do the "writers" now require that he endure the same pain and potential injury whenever he plays?

What a joke.

Guys WD all the time. And you know what, I bet NONE of them do it if they are about to win and most of them do it when playing poorly.

I hope it's "just" tendonitis. It could be, right?

[scratchswinger]

[quote name='502 to Right' timestamp='1331586581' post='4492583']
[quote name='Barto78' timestamp='1331586317' post='4492559']
I swear, some of you folks could learn a thing or 2 about civility. I know i shouldn't call the kettle black or cast stones in a glass house, but the rude factor has seemingly gone up 5 fold on these forums in the last few months.
[/quote]


It's Tiger's fault.
[/quote]
Blame it on Lebron.

[psd]

[quote name='502 to Right' timestamp='1331586581' post='4492583']
[quote name='Barto78' timestamp='1331586317' post='4492559']
I swear, some of you folks could learn a thing or 2 about civility. I know i shouldn't call the kettle black or cast stones in a glass house, but the rude factor has seemingly gone up 5 fold on these forums in the last few months.
[/quote]


It's Tiger's fault.
[/quote]


Nope. It's Elin's fault. Always has been.

[geesecougar2]

[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331581729' post='4491935']
Unfortunately, this is going to be my very first post on this forum. I've read about 75% of the comments made in this thread from the very start, before making my post.

One of the ways you know you are dealing with someone who is 100% clueless about what it takes to be a professional athlete in any sport, is by listening to them speak with respect to both injuries and how an athlete should respond to injury. Clearly, there are not many former professional athletes on this forum, so I won't dig in too deep, on the hopelessly clueless, irrational and illogical comments that I read earlier from people pretending to be "tough guys" and pretending to "know" what it means for an athlete to respond to injury.

I've been fortunate in my life to have had a 4 year career in the NCAA (football), a 3.25 year career in the NFL and 12 year career in the USAF. I actually began playing football at the age of 8, and put on pads for the very first time at 11. By the time I got to college, I had nearly 11 years of experience playing football, but had never dealt with serious injury up to that point.

I was extremely fortunate to get through 4 years of NCAA football, without suffering any serious injury whatsoever. It was not until I arrived at the NFL, that I began to experience what I had seen other players experience, my entire football career. Injury, is a natural component of all high-level competitive sports. I have known and routinely trained with Olympic Athletes over the years, who have constantly battled repetitive injuries on their way to winning Olympic Medal. I've seen the psychological, emotional and physical battles that Athletes have to endure, just to be able to survive in their respective Sport.

I know what it means to "play with pain." I know the personal psychology behind the motivation for playing with pain. I also know the the extent to which some Athletes are willing to go, in order to continue playing with pain. And, I've seen the physical and psychological destruction that can come from constantly playing with the wrong kinds of pain. What most of the Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks don't understand and don't have a solitary clue about, is that there is not a singular Top Athlete anywhere in the entire world, who would not give their Right Arm, to be able to [b]finish their competitive event after suffering injury.[/b]

So, when I see people posting about Tiger Woods, the most prolific Professional Golfer in my lifetime, not having what it takes to finish a round of golf, or "quitting" on his round because he was not at the top of the Leader Board, it reminds me all to well that there is major distinction between a "Fan" and someone who supports the Sport through their patronage AND through their [b]knowledge of the game.[/b] As a former player of both a collegiate and a professional sport, I have [b]always[/b] admired and respected those who supported the Game not just monetarily, but also from a position of [b]knowledge and understanding[/b] about what it takes to become a Top Athlete, regardless of the sport.

When you make comments that reference "O.J.," it becomes obviously that yours is not a sincere concern for the Game, the Sport or the Athlete. It becomes obvious that yours comes directly from a myopic view of life that contains some small minded personal vendetta against Tiger Woods, that is both irrational and illogical at its core. Tiger Woods, has probably demonstrated more ability to play with pain, than any Professional Golfer that I've ever known. He's not only played with pain, he's won with pain. Considering that we are talking about a Golf Swing, he's done nothing short of pulling off a miracle with his win on what was essentially one leg. It will forever be recalled in my mind (personally) as the "One Leg Victory."

When you find another Athlete on the PGA Tour that is tougher and/or more talented/skilled than Tiger Woods (both mentally and physically), drop me a line on this forum and let me know. I know a serious Player/Athlete when I see one. And, I've never seen one more serious, more tough, more capable, more talented, and more [b]productive[/b] in my generation than Tiger Woods. You may not like the fact that he's made some personal mistakes in his life, but none of you can look in a mirror and claim that you have [b]zero sin in your own lives.[/b]

At the end of the day, after he's taken the requisite time to recover and after he finds his way back into his personal "slot," he'll go on to capture Jack's long standing record of 18 Major victories, by placing an exclamation point on his 19th Major. Of that fact, you can all be 100% certain.
[/quote]

Great post. My stance is we should temper our armchair quarterbacking; none of us knows what it takes to be the best in the world at anything. The guys who have had success at that level have found a secret sauce in addition to their talent, and who are we to mess with that sauce?

Tiger has already earned the benefit of the doubt and proved he can play through pain. For anyone to criticize him of mailing it in is asinine........

[FLOGMR]

[candess]

[quote name='Frankie Lob Wedge' timestamp='1331586669' post='4492595']
[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331584346' post='4492327']
[quote name=%26%2339%3BFrankie Lob Wedge' timestamp='1331581769' post='4491945']Other athletes have like Bill Russell, Bob Cousy, Curt Shilling, Willis Reed, Kirk Gibson, Ronnie Lott, Jack Youngblood, Phil probably with his arthritis. <br /><br />Sometimes guys need to step up. Sometimes it is gut check time, Some guys step up to the plate.<br />[/quote]


Other "Athletes" played other sports that don't require anywhere near the same level of mental focus and neuro-muscular, inter-muscular and intra-muscular coordination. The Golf Swing is [b]unique[/b] among all professional Sports because it involves a massive amount of [b]precision[/b]. This should be common sense for even the most Amateur of golf enthusiasts. Anyone that has ever picked-up a golf club of any kind, should be able to tell the difference and the distinction between the precision it takes to hit an 8-iron from 178yds away to within 12ft of the hole under tournament pressure -vs- taking a hand-off deep in the backfield with a broken wrist and hitting the "B" gap on your way to level two contact with a linebacker. Even if you have never played a single down of football, if you have ever picked up a golf club, the distinction should not be all that difficult to imagine.

In fact, I find it a little absurd that anyone would need such a thing clarified for them. Golf requires a sound Mind, a sound Body, and a Sound spirit. You need to feel whole and complete when you play golf at the Professional level and under Professional Tournament pressures. Anything in your life that is not right, will come up and surface itself, sooner or later. You can count on it. Golf is a unique Sport, a special Sport and you need to be healthy to play it at the highest level.

Furthermore, I have personally witnessed Professional Athletes pull themselves out of action for injuries that were [b]far less[/b] that what Tiger Woods, is currently dealing with right now - and all of those men were playing a Team Sport. So, they had the responsibility of doing what was best, not just or themselves, but for the entire Team.

A Professional Golfer, has to evaluate Risk AND Reward. He, or She, has to consider the [b]long-term damage that could result from pressing an injury and making it worse.[/b] ACL type injuries are NOTHING to play with. They are NOT a joke. I have seen Athletes that would have gone on to become huge household names, but the public has never heard of their name before, because of an ACL injury that took place very early in the college career - so they never made it to the Professional level, even though had they made it, their name would have been bigger than the most.

I've seen extremely talented individual, not just in football, but in Gymnastics for example; never have the opportunity to compete for for an Olympic Medal. Why? Because of the dreaded ACL injury. It is not something to play with. Some people can bounce back from ACL surgery in a flash and go on to be seemingly better than thy were before the injury, while others seem to get hampered with ACL "fallout" for the remainder of their career.

I played with Ronnie Lot. I know Ronnie Lott, personally. I know what kind of pain he's played through and I also know what kind of injuries kept him on the sidelines, even when he wanted (desperately) to be on the field. Ronnie Lott, is not the only one. I also know Eddie Anderson, and played with him as well. As quiet as it is kept, Eddie, as just as big a hard hitting Safety as Ronnie Lott, was - but even Eddie, had to pull himself out of games after suffering difficult injuries.

Trying to compare what a Safety in the NFL does in his role on the field, with Tiger Woods, trying to focus on hitting a 6-iron to a green that is 245yds away, is like trying to compare the night time interdiction capabilities and precision of an F-15E Eagle, to the cutting capability of a Neurosurgeon's scalpel. They are simply two entirely different worlds. Both require [u]extreme[/u] precision. One can be done with all heck breaking lose around the Pilot, while the other must be done in an absolutely focused and sterile environment [b]with zero distractions[/b] around the Surgeon.
[/quote]

Ben Hogan's body was wrecked in a terrible car crash in 1949. His car had 1949 safety which means no safety. he was rebuilt with 1949/50's medical technology which was a joke compared to today.

He won 6 majors after the crash playing with terrible pain. Hogan knew how to step it up.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CApJbFStuMs"]http://www.youtube.c...h?v=CApJbFStuMs[/url]
[/quote]


Unless you know the extent of Hogan's and TW's injuries vs. they are not comparable. The Doral is not a major. Whose to say Tiger won't come back and win multiple majors. You are making too many assumptions based on a WD from The Doral Classic.

[candess]

[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331581729' post='4491935']
Unfortunately, this is going to be my very first post on this forum. I've read about 75% of the comments made in this thread from the very start, before making my post.

One of the ways you know you are dealing with someone who is 100% clueless about what it takes to be a professional athlete in any sport, is by listening to them speak with respect to both injuries and how an athlete should respond to injury. Clearly, there are not many former professional athletes on this forum, so I won't dig in too deep, on the hopelessly clueless, irrational and illogical comments that I read earlier from people pretending to be "tough guys" and pretending to "know" what it means for an athlete to respond to injury.

I've been fortunate in my life to have had a 4 year career in the NCAA (football), a 3.25 year career in the NFL and 12 year career in the USAF. I actually began playing football at the age of 8, and put on pads for the very first time at 11. By the time I got to college, I had nearly 11 years of experience playing football, but had never dealt with serious injury up to that point.

I was extremely fortunate to get through 4 years of NCAA football, without suffering any serious injury whatsoever. It was not until I arrived at the NFL, that I began to experience what I had seen other players experience, my entire football career. Injury, is a natural component of all high-level competitive sports. I have known and routinely trained with Olympic Athletes over the years, who have constantly battled repetitive injuries on their way to winning Olympic Medal. I've seen the psychological, emotional and physical battles that Athletes have to endure, just to be able to survive in their respective Sport.

I know what it means to "play with pain." I know the personal psychology behind the motivation for playing with pain. I also know the the extent to which some Athletes are willing to go, in order to continue playing with pain. And, I've seen the physical and psychological destruction that can come from constantly playing with the wrong kinds of pain. What most of the Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks don't understand and don't have a solitary clue about, is that there is not a singular Top Athlete anywhere in the entire world, who would not give their Right Arm, to be able to [b]finish their competitive event after suffering injury.[/b]

So, when I see people posting about Tiger Woods, the most prolific Professional Golfer in my lifetime, not having what it takes to finish a round of golf, or "quitting" on his round because he was not at the top of the Leader Board, it reminds me all to well that there is major distinction between a "Fan" and someone who supports the Sport through their patronage AND through their [b]knowledge of the game.[/b] As a former player of both a collegiate and a professional sport, I have [b]always[/b] admired and respected those who supported the Game not just monetarily, but also from a position of [b]knowledge and understanding[/b] about what it takes to become a Top Athlete, regardless of the sport.

When you make comments that reference "O.J.," it becomes obviously that yours is not a sincere concern for the Game, the Sport or the Athlete. It becomes obvious that yours comes directly from a myopic view of life that contains some small minded personal vendetta against Tiger Woods, that is both irrational and illogical at its core. Tiger Woods, has probably demonstrated more ability to play with pain, than any Professional Golfer that I've ever known. He's not only played with pain, he's won with pain. Considering that we are talking about a Golf Swing, he's done nothing short of pulling off a miracle with his win on what was essentially one leg. It will forever be recalled in my mind (personally) as the "One Leg Victory."

When you find another Athlete on the PGA Tour that is tougher and/or more talented/skilled than Tiger Woods (both mentally and physically), drop me a line on this forum and let me know. I know a serious Player/Athlete when I see one. And, I've never seen one more serious, more tough, more capable, more talented, and more [b]productive[/b] in my generation than Tiger Woods. You may not like the fact that he's made some personal mistakes in his life, but none of you can look in a mirror and claim that you have [b]zero sin in your own lives.[/b]

At the end of the day, after he's taken the requisite time to recover and after he finds his way back into his personal "slot," he'll go on to capture Jack's long standing record of 18 Major victories, by placing an exclamation point on his 19th Major. Of that fact, you can all be 100% certain.
[/quote]

Thanks for your insightful post.

[Redman]

[quote name='Frankie Lob Wedge' timestamp='1331586669' post='4492595']
[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331584346' post='4492327']
[quote name=%26%2339%3BFrankie Lob Wedge' timestamp='1331581769' post='4491945']Other athletes have like Bill Russell, Bob Cousy, Curt Shilling, Willis Reed, Kirk Gibson, Ronnie Lott, Jack Youngblood, Phil probably with his arthritis. <br /><br />Sometimes guys need to step up. Sometimes it is gut check time, Some guys step up to the plate.<br />[/quote]


Other "Athletes" played other sports that don't require anywhere near the same level of mental focus and neuro-muscular, inter-muscular and intra-muscular coordination. The Golf Swing is [b]unique[/b] among all professional Sports because it involves a massive amount of [b]precision[/b]. This should be common sense for even the most Amateur of golf enthusiasts. Anyone that has ever picked-up a golf club of any kind, should be able to tell the difference and the distinction between the precision it takes to hit an 8-iron from 178yds away to within 12ft of the hole under tournament pressure -vs- taking a hand-off deep in the backfield with a broken wrist and hitting the "B" gap on your way to level two contact with a linebacker. Even if you have never played a single down of football, if you have ever picked up a golf club, the distinction should not be all that difficult to imagine.

In fact, I find it a little absurd that anyone would need such a thing clarified for them. Golf requires a sound Mind, a sound Body, and a Sound spirit. You need to feel whole and complete when you play golf at the Professional level and under Professional Tournament pressures. Anything in your life that is not right, will come up and surface itself, sooner or later. You can count on it. Golf is a unique Sport, a special Sport and you need to be healthy to play it at the highest level.

Furthermore, I have personally witnessed Professional Athletes pull themselves out of action for injuries that were [b]far less[/b] that what Tiger Woods, is currently dealing with right now - and all of those men were playing a Team Sport. So, they had the responsibility of doing what was best, not just or themselves, but for the entire Team.

A Professional Golfer, has to evaluate Risk AND Reward. He, or She, has to consider the [b]long-term damage that could result from pressing an injury and making it worse.[/b] ACL type injuries are NOTHING to play with. They are NOT a joke. I have seen Athletes that would have gone on to become huge household names, but the public has never heard of their name before, because of an ACL injury that took place very early in the college career - so they never made it to the Professional level, even though had they made it, their name would have been bigger than the most.

I've seen extremely talented individual, not just in football, but in Gymnastics for example; never have the opportunity to compete for for an Olympic Medal. Why? Because of the dreaded ACL injury. It is not something to play with. Some people can bounce back from ACL surgery in a flash and go on to be seemingly better than thy were before the injury, while others seem to get hampered with ACL "fallout" for the remainder of their career.

I played with Ronnie Lot. I know Ronnie Lott, personally. I know what kind of pain he's played through and I also know what kind of injuries kept him on the sidelines, even when he wanted (desperately) to be on the field. Ronnie Lott, is not the only one. I also know Eddie Anderson, and played with him as well. As quiet as it is kept, Eddie, as just as big a hard hitting Safety as Ronnie Lott, was - but even Eddie, had to pull himself out of games after suffering difficult injuries.

Trying to compare what a Safety in the NFL does in his role on the field, with Tiger Woods, trying to focus on hitting a 6-iron to a green that is 245yds away, is like trying to compare the night time interdiction capabilities and precision of an F-15E Eagle, to the cutting capability of a Neurosurgeon's scalpel. They are simply two entirely different worlds. Both require [u]extreme[/u] precision. One can be done with all heck breaking lose around the Pilot, while the other must be done in an absolutely focused and sterile environment [b]with zero distractions[/b] around the Surgeon.
[/quote]

Ben Hogan's body was wrecked in a terrible car crash in 1949. His car had 1949 safety which means no safety. he was rebuilt with 1949/50's medical technology which was a joke compared to today.

He won 6 majors after the crash playing with terrible pain. Hogan knew how to step it up.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CApJbFStuMs"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CApJbFStuMs[/url]
[/quote]

If that were Tiger you'd be saying he was lying about the pain or maybe just faked the car wreck altogether.

[Redman]

[quote name='Redhill' timestamp='1331585946' post='4492511']
[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331581729' post='4491935']
Unfortunately, this is going to be my very first post on this forum. I've read about 75% of the comments made in this thread from the very start, before making my post.

One of the ways you know you are dealing with someone who is 100% clueless about what it takes to be a professional athlete in any sport, is by listening to them speak with respect to both injuries and how an athlete should respond to injury. Clearly, there are not many former professional athletes on this forum, so I won't dig in too deep, on the hopelessly clueless, irrational and illogical comments that I read earlier from people pretending to be "tough guys" and pretending to "know" what it means for an athlete to respond to injury.

I've been fortunate in my life to have had a 4 year career in the NCAA (football), a 3.25 year career in the NFL and 12 year career in the USAF. I actually began playing football at the age of 8, and put on pads for the very first time at 11. By the time I got to college, I had nearly 11 years of experience playing football, but had never dealt with serious injury up to that point.

I was extremely fortunate to get through 4 years of NCAA football, without suffering any serious injury whatsoever. It was not until I arrived at the NFL, that I began to experience what I had seen other players experience, my entire football career. Injury, is a natural component of all high-level competitive sports. I have known and routinely trained with Olympic Athletes over the years, who have constantly battled repetitive injuries on their way to winning Olympic Medal. I've seen the psychological, emotional and physical battles that Athletes have to endure, just to be able to survive in their respective Sport.

I know what it means to "play with pain." I know the personal psychology behind the motivation for playing with pain. I also know the the extent to which some Athletes are willing to go, in order to continue playing with pain. And, I've seen the physical and psychological destruction that can come from constantly playing with the wrong kinds of pain. What most of the Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks don't understand and don't have a solitary clue about, is that there is not a singular Top Athlete anywhere in the entire world, who would not give their Right Arm, to be able to [b]finish their competitive event after suffering injury.[/b]

So, when I see people posting about Tiger Woods, the most prolific Professional Golfer in my lifetime, not having what it takes to finish a round of golf, or "quitting" on his round because he was not at the top of the Leader Board, it reminds me all to well that there is major distinction between a "Fan" and someone who supports the Sport through their patronage AND through their [b]knowledge of the game.[/b] As a former player of both a collegiate and a professional sport, I have [b]always[/b] admired and respected those who supported the Game not just monetarily, but also from a position of [b]knowledge and understanding[/b] about what it takes to become a Top Athlete, regardless of the sport.

When you make comments that reference "O.J.," it becomes obviously that yours is not a sincere concern for the Game, the Sport or the Athlete. It becomes obvious that yours comes directly from a myopic view of life that contains some small minded personal vendetta against Tiger Woods, that is both irrational and illogical at its core. Tiger Woods, has probably demonstrated more ability to play with pain, than any Professional Golfer that I've ever known. He's not only played with pain, he's won with pain. Considering that we are talking about a Golf Swing, he's done nothing short of pulling off a miracle with his win on what was essentially one leg. It will forever be recalled in my mind (personally) as the "One Leg Victory."

When you find another Athlete on the PGA Tour that is tougher and/or more talented/skilled than Tiger Woods (both mentally and physically), drop me a line on this forum and let me know. I know a serious Player/Athlete when I see one. And, I've never seen one more serious, more tough, more capable, more talented, and more [b]productive[/b] in my generation than Tiger Woods. You may not like the fact that he's made some personal mistakes in his life, but none of you can look in a mirror and claim that you have [b]zero sin in your own lives.[/b]

At the end of the day, after he's taken the requisite time to recover and after he finds his way back into his personal "slot," he'll go on to capture Jack's long standing record of 18 Major victories, by placing an exclamation point on his 19th Major. Of that fact, you can all be 100% certain.
[/quote]

Wow.... that was impressive. I especially liked the part about your NFL experience spanning 3.25 years. Is that kind of like the little boy that says he is 8.5 years old?

So from a reading of your post, is it a requirement to have had a 3.25 year career in the NFL or be a PGA touring pro to be able to post an opinion on Eldrick's mental and physical conditions?

I think you will find a couple of docs on these boards with some sound opinions on injury treatments but then again I'm not sure that most of them have had a NFL career so they may have to look at their surgical case history on the same kind of injuries that Eldrick has as null and void. Somehow I'm going with their input over yours. Sorry.

So from my non NFL background (I only played 3.98 years of NCAA Div I basketball......no NBA time, darn it!) i wondered why he would want an ice bag for the left "leg", knee or Achilles, and then drive off for a long drive home! My non NFL opinion, and I do have one, is that it's a knee that needs an evaluation.

Just my opinion, but I like it and I'm not at all certain or close to it about that 19th major. Seems like it's fading away without an exclamation point!!
[/quote]

Ahh it all makes sense now.....didn't make the NBA so taking that out on Tiger and now even 19th Major. I bet had you made the NBA and hurt your Achilles you would have played till it just blew up huh?

[candess]

[quote name='Redman' timestamp='1331591745' post='4493249']
[quote name='Redhill' timestamp='1331585946' post='4492511']
[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331581729' post='4491935']
Unfortunately, this is going to be my very first post on this forum. I've read about 75% of the comments made in this thread from the very start, before making my post.

One of the ways you know you are dealing with someone who is 100% clueless about what it takes to be a professional athlete in any sport, is by listening to them speak with respect to both injuries and how an athlete should respond to injury. Clearly, there are not many former professional athletes on this forum, so I won't dig in too deep, on the hopelessly clueless, irrational and illogical comments that I read earlier from people pretending to be "tough guys" and pretending to "know" what it means for an athlete to respond to injury.

I've been fortunate in my life to have had a 4 year career in the NCAA (football), a 3.25 year career in the NFL and 12 year career in the USAF. I actually began playing football at the age of 8, and put on pads for the very first time at 11. By the time I got to college, I had nearly 11 years of experience playing football, but had never dealt with serious injury up to that point.

I was extremely fortunate to get through 4 years of NCAA football, without suffering any serious injury whatsoever. It was not until I arrived at the NFL, that I began to experience what I had seen other players experience, my entire football career. Injury, is a natural component of all high-level competitive sports. I have known and routinely trained with Olympic Athletes over the years, who have constantly battled repetitive injuries on their way to winning Olympic Medal. I've seen the psychological, emotional and physical battles that Athletes have to endure, just to be able to survive in their respective Sport.

I know what it means to "play with pain." I know the personal psychology behind the motivation for playing with pain. I also know the the extent to which some Athletes are willing to go, in order to continue playing with pain. And, I've seen the physical and psychological destruction that can come from constantly playing with the wrong kinds of pain. What most of the Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks don't understand and don't have a solitary clue about, is that there is not a singular Top Athlete anywhere in the entire world, who would not give their Right Arm, to be able to [b]finish their competitive event after suffering injury.[/b]

So, when I see people posting about Tiger Woods, the most prolific Professional Golfer in my lifetime, not having what it takes to finish a round of golf, or "quitting" on his round because he was not at the top of the Leader Board, it reminds me all to well that there is major distinction between a "Fan" and someone who supports the Sport through their patronage AND through their [b]knowledge of the game.[/b] As a former player of both a collegiate and a professional sport, I have [b]always[/b] admired and respected those who supported the Game not just monetarily, but also from a position of [b]knowledge and understanding[/b] about what it takes to become a Top Athlete, regardless of the sport.

When you make comments that reference "O.J.," it becomes obviously that yours is not a sincere concern for the Game, the Sport or the Athlete. It becomes obvious that yours comes directly from a myopic view of life that contains some small minded personal vendetta against Tiger Woods, that is both irrational and illogical at its core. Tiger Woods, has probably demonstrated more ability to play with pain, than any Professional Golfer that I've ever known. He's not only played with pain, he's won with pain. Considering that we are talking about a Golf Swing, he's done nothing short of pulling off a miracle with his win on what was essentially one leg. It will forever be recalled in my mind (personally) as the "One Leg Victory."

When you find another Athlete on the PGA Tour that is tougher and/or more talented/skilled than Tiger Woods (both mentally and physically), drop me a line on this forum and let me know. I know a serious Player/Athlete when I see one. And, I've never seen one more serious, more tough, more capable, more talented, and more [b]productive[/b] in my generation than Tiger Woods. You may not like the fact that he's made some personal mistakes in his life, but none of you can look in a mirror and claim that you have [b]zero sin in your own lives.[/b]

At the end of the day, after he's taken the requisite time to recover and after he finds his way back into his personal "slot," he'll go on to capture Jack's long standing record of 18 Major victories, by placing an exclamation point on his 19th Major. Of that fact, you can all be 100% certain.
[/quote]

Wow.... that was impressive. I especially liked the part about your NFL experience spanning 3.25 years. Is that kind of like the little boy that says he is 8.5 years old?

So from a reading of your post, is it a requirement to have had a 3.25 year career in the NFL or be a PGA touring pro to be able to post an opinion on Eldrick's mental and physical conditions?

I think you will find a couple of docs on these boards with some sound opinions on injury treatments but then again I'm not sure that most of them have had a NFL career so they may have to look at their surgical case history on the same kind of injuries that Eldrick has as null and void. Somehow I'm going with their input over yours. Sorry.

So from my non NFL background (I only played 3.98 years of NCAA Div I basketball......no NBA time, darn it!) i wondered why he would want an ice bag for the left "leg", knee or Achilles, and then drive off for a long drive home! My non NFL opinion, and I do have one, is that it's a knee that needs an evaluation.

Just my opinion, but I like it and I'm not at all certain or close to it about that 19th major. Seems like it's fading away without an exclamation point!!
[/quote]

Ahh it all makes sense now.....didn't make the NBA so taking that out on Tiger and now even 19th Major. I bet had you made the NBA and hurt your Achilles you would have played till it just blew up huh?
[/quote]

I'm beginning to think many of them are failed athletes that never made it past Pop Warner or their city's youths teams so they have animosity against a nerdy dude like Tiger climbing to the top of the sports world.

[Redhill]

[quote name='Redman' timestamp='1331591745' post='4493249']
[quote name='Redhill' timestamp='1331585946' post='4492511']
[quote name='19th Major' timestamp='1331581729' post='4491935']
Unfortunately, this is going to be my very first post on this forum. I've read about 75% of the comments made in this thread from the very start, before making my post.

One of the ways you know you are dealing with someone who is 100% clueless about what it takes to be a professional athlete in any sport, is by listening to them speak with respect to both injuries and how an athlete should respond to injury. Clearly, there are not many former professional athletes on this forum, so I won't dig in too deep, on the hopelessly clueless, irrational and illogical comments that I read earlier from people pretending to be "tough guys" and pretending to "know" what it means for an athlete to respond to injury.

I've been fortunate in my life to have had a 4 year career in the NCAA (football), a 3.25 year career in the NFL and 12 year career in the USAF. I actually began playing football at the age of 8, and put on pads for the very first time at 11. By the time I got to college, I had nearly 11 years of experience playing football, but had never dealt with serious injury up to that point.

I was extremely fortunate to get through 4 years of NCAA football, without suffering any serious injury whatsoever. It was not until I arrived at the NFL, that I began to experience what I had seen other players experience, my entire football career. Injury, is a natural component of all high-level competitive sports. I have known and routinely trained with Olympic Athletes over the years, who have constantly battled repetitive injuries on their way to winning Olympic Medal. I've seen the psychological, emotional and physical battles that Athletes have to endure, just to be able to survive in their respective Sport.

I know what it means to "play with pain." I know the personal psychology behind the motivation for playing with pain. I also know the the extent to which some Athletes are willing to go, in order to continue playing with pain. And, I've seen the physical and psychological destruction that can come from constantly playing with the wrong kinds of pain. What most of the Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks don't understand and don't have a solitary clue about, is that there is not a singular Top Athlete anywhere in the entire world, who would not give their Right Arm, to be able to [b]finish their competitive event after suffering injury.[/b]

So, when I see people posting about Tiger Woods, the most prolific Professional Golfer in my lifetime, not having what it takes to finish a round of golf, or "quitting" on his round because he was not at the top of the Leader Board, it reminds me all to well that there is major distinction between a "Fan" and someone who supports the Sport through their patronage AND through their [b]knowledge of the game.[/b] As a former player of both a collegiate and a professional sport, I have [b]always[/b] admired and respected those who supported the Game not just monetarily, but also from a position of [b]knowledge and understanding[/b] about what it takes to become a Top Athlete, regardless of the sport.

When you make comments that reference "O.J.," it becomes obviously that yours is not a sincere concern for the Game, the Sport or the Athlete. It becomes obvious that yours comes directly from a myopic view of life that contains some small minded personal vendetta against Tiger Woods, that is both irrational and illogical at its core. Tiger Woods, has probably demonstrated more ability to play with pain, than any Professional Golfer that I've ever known. He's not only played with pain, he's won with pain. Considering that we are talking about a Golf Swing, he's done nothing short of pulling off a miracle with his win on what was essentially one leg. It will forever be recalled in my mind (personally) as the "One Leg Victory."

When you find another Athlete on the PGA Tour that is tougher and/or more talented/skilled than Tiger Woods (both mentally and physically), drop me a line on this forum and let me know. I know a serious Player/Athlete when I see one. And, I've never seen one more serious, more tough, more capable, more talented, and more [b]productive[/b] in my generation than Tiger Woods. You may not like the fact that he's made some personal mistakes in his life, but none of you can look in a mirror and claim that you have [b]zero sin in your own lives.[/b]

At the end of the day, after he's taken the requisite time to recover and after he finds his way back into his personal "slot," he'll go on to capture Jack's long standing record of 18 Major victories, by placing an exclamation point on his 19th Major. Of that fact, you can all be 100% certain.
[/quote]

Wow.... that was impressive. I especially liked the part about your NFL experience spanning 3.25 years. Is that kind of like the little boy that says he is 8.5 years old?

So from a reading of your post, is it a requirement to have had a 3.25 year career in the NFL or be a PGA touring pro to be able to post an opinion on Eldrick's mental and physical conditions?

I think you will find a couple of docs on these boards with some sound opinions on injury treatments but then again I'm not sure that most of them have had a NFL career so they may have to look at their surgical case history on the same kind of injuries that Eldrick has as null and void. Somehow I'm going with their input over yours. Sorry.

So from my non NFL background (I only played 3.98 years of NCAA Div I basketball......no NBA time, darn it!) i wondered why he would want an ice bag for the left "leg", knee or Achilles, and then drive off for a long drive home! My non NFL opinion, and I do have one, is that it's a knee that needs an evaluation.

Just my opinion, but I like it and I'm not at all certain or close to it about that 19th major. Seems like it's fading away without an exclamation point!!
[/quote]

Ahh it all makes sense now.....didn't make the NBA so taking that out on Tiger and now even 19th Major. I bet had you made the NBA and hurt your Achilles you would have played till it just blew up huh?
[/quote]

Actually I did have an NBA tryout with a bunch of other college players but just didn't have the stuff to make it to the next level.

How about you? Tell me did you play any college sport? ok ok how about High school sport? ok ok ok , maybe something in grade school or Pop Warner? ok ok ok ok Don't tell me.......... you were in the band? So sorry.

[llamont]

Lol... Actually, I was in the band and I played sports. Then, I played golf at a Div 3 NAIA school where anyone could play as long as you had the grades and an ounce of interest... So what's your point? Every person is different. Tiger walking off the course midround definitely came as a shock, but I'm wouldn't call him a quitter for doing so. That's never happened and we all know that his leg has been a problem for a while. What's the point in making matters worse by continuing to play on it? With the way he's been playing, there is no reason for him to give up. I just hope he heals completely before Augusta...

[tw18majors]

Tiger just tweeted: "Got good news from doc tonight. Only mild strain of left Achilles. Can resume hitting balls late in week and hopeful for next week."

Good to hear!

[Redman]

[quote name='Redhill' timestamp='1331595800' post='4493837']
[quote name='Redman' timestamp='1331591745' post='4493249']

Ahh it all makes sense now.....didn't make the NBA so taking that out on Tiger and now even 19th Major. I bet had you made the NBA and hurt your Achilles you would have played till it just blew up huh?
[/quote]

Actually I did have an NBA tryout with a bunch of other college players but just didn't have the stuff to make it to the next level.

How about you? Tell me did you play any college sport? ok ok how about High school sport? ok ok ok , maybe something in grade school or Pop Warner? ok ok ok ok Don't tell me.......... you were in the band? So sorry.
[/quote]

Actually there bad a$$ I played D2 golf on a full ride and was first team all conference all four years. I'm not gonna make up a story to make it seem like I almost made it to the big show however. No band either....never was musically inclined in the least. However, it is clear that you don't think much of people in the band. Let's see you hated on a football player, Tiger, and band members. Anyone else? Now's the time.

[Redhill]

[quote name='Redman' timestamp='1331603269' post='4495123']
[quote name='Redhill' timestamp='1331595800' post='4493837']
[quote name='Redman' timestamp='1331591745' post='4493249']
Ahh it all makes sense now.....didn't make the NBA so taking that out on Tiger and now even 19th Major. I bet had you made the NBA and hurt your Achilles you would have played till it just blew up huh?
[/quote]

Actually I did have an NBA tryout with a bunch of other college players but just didn't have the stuff to make it to the next level.

How about you? Tell me did you play any college sport? ok ok how about High school sport? ok ok ok , maybe something in grade school or Pop Warner? ok ok ok ok Don't tell me.......... you were in the band? So sorry.
[/quote]

Actually there bad a$ I played D2 golf on a full ride and was first team all conference all four years. I'm not gonna make up a story to make it seem like I almost made it to the big show however. No band either....never was musically inclined in the least. However, it is clear that you don't think much of people in the band. Let's see you hated on a football player, Tiger, and band members. Anyone else? Now's the time.
[/quote]

Stop it! Stop it! you are hurting my feelings there calling me a bad a$$ (it really needs 2$).

You're missing the point of my slam completely, but that's not news. 19trh Major indicated that you need the experience of 3.25 years (love that .25 part) in the NFL or be a PGA touring pro to understand tenacity and pain management and to be competent enough to post an opinion on those subjects. I disagree with that completely then and now.

Opinions freely abound and everyone is entitled to them, although I think yours completely stink, are often in error, and show a fan boy fascination, I defend your ability to voice them. Even though you don't seem to have the required 3.25 years in the NFL, but then again, neither do I.

It's amazing when anyone raises a question about Jose (aka ELDRICK) which cuts across your lofty held belief system about the wee lad, it's a panic time in the city. But then again when I review your posts the understanding becomes more clear.

Please continue to post your weak arguments as I look forward to them, and I shall do the same. (Do you know where I can get 3.25 years of NFL experience?)

[Redman]

[quote name='Redhill' timestamp='1331605812' post='4495629']
[quote name='Redman' timestamp='1331603269' post='4495123']
Actually there bad a$ I played D2 golf on a full ride and was first team all conference all four years. I'm not gonna make up a story to make it seem like I almost made it to the big show however. No band either....never was musically inclined in the least. However, it is clear that you don't think much of people in the band. Let's see you hated on a football player, Tiger, and band members. Anyone else? Now's the time.
[/quote]

Stop it! Stop it! you are hurting my feelings there calling me a bad a$$ (it really needs 2$).

You're missing the point of my slam completely, but that's not news. 19trh Major indicated that you need the experience of 3.25 years (love that .25 part) in the NFL or be a PGA touring pro to understand tenacity and pain management and to be competent enough to post an opinion on those subjects. I disagree with that completely then and now.

Opinions freely abound and everyone is entitled to them, although I think yours completely stink, are often in error, and show a fan boy fascination, I defend your ability to voice them. Even though you don't seem to have the required 3.25 years in the NFL, but then again, neither do I.

It's amazing when anyone raises a question about Jose (aka ELDRICK) which cuts across your lofty held belief system about the wee lad, it's a panic time in the city. But then again when I review your posts the understanding becomes more clear.

Please continue to post your weak arguments as I look forward to them, and I shall do the same. (Do you know where I can get 3.25 years of NFL experience?)
[/quote]

Ouch. Now you stop it - hurting my feelings by calling my arguments weak. That's just plain mean. I guess if being a fan of Tiger because of what he has done on the golf course and not getting all up in arms about what he did in his personal life makes me a "fan boy" then whatever. I imagine you are one of those that go around complaining about how bad of a person Tiger is for his infidelity as if he did it to your sister or something. Wait, are you Elin's brother? If so I'm sorry - you win. Oh poor Redhill, he was so devastated to find out Tiger was not a good hubby that he can barely sleep at night. And now, Tiger is getting what he deserves, YAY. Are you a Fowler fan? Are you wearing your Puma orange gear as of this very moment?

[scratchswinger]

Look I was always too busy doing other things that would not allow me to make the big show . However I do have Direct TV with the NFL and Red Zone packages. That gives me over 2000 channels- far more impressive than the NFL or D1 ball.

[TeeBee72]

[quote name='scotchblade' timestamp='1331526865' post='4487453']
[quote name='Yepyukon' timestamp='1331526325' post='4487403']
Yes, a person's kids will look up to their parents and emulate them...to a point. However, ALL kids have role models outside of their home and a good majority of them (mostly male) will look to professional athletes as their role models. Whether Tiger wants to be a role model or not, he is.
[/quote]
Tiger had pictures of Jack Nicklaus in his bedroom. I wanted to grow up to be Mickey Mantle, not my dad. I agree with you.
[/quote]


how old are you guys ?
jack and arnie did the same thing...the media hid it back then...now they get rich off it.
read your history kids, same thing...different era...different results.


all these kids on tour are good kids...it's not a sport that produces thugs !!!

THE MEDIA IS GETTING FILTHY RICH OFF FOOLING YOU !!!



p.s.

do you subscribe to the Enquirer...do you ?

[Asleep]

[b]Let's shift this conversation to either:

here: http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/612469-citing-achilles-tightness-tiger-exits-wgc-cadillac-championship/

or here: http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/613181-tigers-results-on-the-achilles/

Thanks. [/b]