Retail employees working on Holidays....whats the issue?

[FairwaysToHeaven]

Every year around the holidays with retailers amping up for the holiday sales we hear of the complaints, strikes, etc from employees or others complaining about how unfair it is that they are 'forced' to work on thanksgiving, christmas, etc.

 

can anyone convince me that if you work in retail this should not be absolutely expected?

 

Seriously, people expect retail stores to shut down during their busiest time of the year? Since when is it expected for a business to shut down during its peak hours so that employees can stay home. Employees in retail often don't choose that line of work, but they can still be grateful to have a job. Isn't it common sense for a store to open during the hours that customers are most willing to show up.

 

Isn't this the same as a waiter wanting his employer to shut down during dinner time so he could spend dinner with his family? if you work retail thats part of the gig. if you work IT, you realize you may have to solve issues in middle of night. If you are a janitor, you can't demand to work during office hours.

 

the real problem i see is how those complaining are blaming the businesses for ruining the holidays. They argue that retailers have turned Thanksgiving and Christmas into "consumer holdiays", as if the consumers have zero responsibility towards this. "yada yada yada..... thanksgiving is supposed to be about giving thanks but those evil business are having sales and turning the holiday into only being about shopping".

 

I'm sorry, but i didn't realize that businesses are forcing anyone to shop. Retailers are simply giving consumers exactly what they demand, while being competitive amongst themselves. Its already expected to be a down season among consumer holiday spending, americans need to stop blaming the business and start looking in the mirror when it comes to placing blame on consumer holidays and losing the real meaning of the holiday. how is it retail business "greed", yet the fight to get "stuff" at rock bottom prices isn't labeled as greed.

 

just a rant after reading an article where the author blames retail business for being greedy and uncompassionate towards its employees.

[MrTmag]

People forgot that if you work Christmas or thanksgiving day you get paid triple or double because its not a desired day to work

[Agent Jim]

[quote name='MrTmag' timestamp='1384898505' post='8174032']
People forgot that if you work Christmas or thanksgiving day you get paid triple or double because its not a desired day to work
[/quote] I don't get extra pay. I get 8 hours vacation whether I work it or not. It all depends on the work schedule. I am in law enforcement, so I knew going in I'd be working holidays. This place I work at doesn't have the best contract. My last place paid time and a half and we accrued vacation time.

[SullGolf]

I'm sure you've never complained about your job, right?

[xThor]

Majority of these jobs are At-Will employment. Don't like it? feel free to quit.

I work in the medical industry. I've worked the majority of holidays for the last decade. Sometime's it sucks, but i've got a decent job, and holiday overtime pay is nice. Honestly, I dont really mind it that much. But I am single with no children so I guess that factors in somewhat.

[baseballfrk8998]

[quote name='Agent Jim' timestamp='1384903635' post='8174382']
[quote name='MrTmag' timestamp='1384898505' post='8174032']
People forgot that if you work Christmas or thanksgiving day you get paid triple or double because its not a desired day to work
[/quote] I don't get extra pay. I get 8 hours vacation whether I work it or not. It all depends on the work schedule. I am in law enforcement, so I knew going in I'd be working holidays. This place I work at doesn't have the best contract. My last place paid time and a half and we accrued vacation time.
[/quote]

So basically you get double pay if you work. The 8 hours of pay that you work plus the 8 hours of vacation.

[Arizonalefty59]

I work part time for a retailer and go to school full time and we open at 8PM Thanksgiving night and it's total bull. I have to be there at 7:30 and only get time and a half for the first 4 hours of my 12 hour shift. It gives me motivation to get good grades in school and pursue my degree so I don't have to do the retail bull anymore. Been there 3 1/2 years now since my junior year of high school and I just barely started making over $8 an hour.

Retail employees don't get enough credit, we get paid like dirt and get treated like trash. Thankfully I only work like 15 hrs a week.

[spring70]

[quote name='HoosierMizuno' timestamp='1384896619' post='8173886']
Every year around the holidays with retailers amping up for the holiday sales we hear of the complaints, strikes, etc from employees or others complaining about how unfair it is that they are 'forced' to work on thanksgiving, christmas, etc.

can anyone convince me that if you work in retail this should not be absolutely expected?

Seriously, people expect retail stores to shut down during their busiest time of the year? Since when is it expected for a business to shut down during its peak hours so that employees can stay home. Employees in retail often don't choose that line of work, but they can still be grateful to have a job. Isn't it common sense for a store to open during the hours that customers are most willing to show up.

Isn't this the same as a waiter wanting his employer to shut down during dinner time so he could spend dinner with his family? if you work retail thats part of the gig. if you work IT, you realize you may have to solve issues in middle of night. If you are a janitor, you can't demand to work during office hours.

the real problem i see is how those complaining are blaming the businesses for ruining the holidays. They argue that retailers have turned Thanksgiving and Christmas into "consumer holdiays", as if the consumers have zero responsibility towards this. "yada yada yada..... thanksgiving is supposed to be about giving thanks but those evil business are having sales and turning the holiday into only being about shopping".

I'm sorry, but i didn't realize that businesses are forcing anyone to shop. Retailers are simply giving consumers exactly what they demand, while being competitive amongst themselves. Its already expected to be a down season among consumer holiday spending, americans need to stop blaming the business and start looking in the mirror when it comes to placing blame on consumer holidays and losing the real meaning of the holiday. how is it retail business "greed", yet the fight to get "stuff" at rock bottom prices isn't labeled as greed.

just a rant after reading an article where the author blames retail business for being greedy and uncompassionate towards its employees.
[/quote]

I hope you never become a manager or someone who makes decisions;)

I didn't read the article, and I am not sure how old you are, but really nobody needs to shop on Thanksgiving, I am not sure who first did this , but Store A decided many years ago to open @midnight on Black Friday, then all of their competitors did the same, after several iterations we went from midnight, to 9pm to 7pm! Etc. if all stores cared about their people and wanted a work life balance , they could all open @8am on Friday and not lose a dime to one another. But companies are ran by sociopaths;) and that horse has left the barn.

Emergency medical and police are the exception IMO. They knew what they were getting into and choose their careers, and get compensated for their work, Police probably never enough.

[Arizonalefty59]

JC Penney was the first store to start opening at 8 and all other stores including mine followed.

[Petethreeput]

I think it more a statement of cultural malaise than the work itself. If it were just work, no one would pick up the story. And, as you mention, they can quit if they don't like it. Of course the other side of that equation is there is no where else to go get work.

[H.A. Kerr]

Let them eat cake.

[Pstar1978]

I've worked automotive retail for years where we had the major holidays off but every holiday we were open. I also worked Black Friday at Wal Mart and seen it first hand. I will not be shopping at any retailer on thanksgiving because if they're working, they can't have a Thanksgiving. I do go black Friday shopping in the evening and have had some success doing it. Some retail workers do it because it pays the bills and some do it because they don't have any other options because of outside factors(education, work experience, etc.) If retailers would pay their workers a living wage,[u] some [/u]people would not care to work those hours. How come Costco can pay their employees a great wage, offer great healthcare and be profitable but Wal Mart Can't? That's the real issue here.

[SullGolf]

I was just talking to a family member who works at a retail place. They have shifts on Thanksgiving until 4pm, and then after 7pm. So you have plenty of time to spend with your family!

I do get that it's primarily consumer driven, but at some point companies have to stick up for their employees. At some point, you have to consider your employees, not just your customers. Retail is so crunched right now with internet competition that they are using whatever options they can get, and I think they are pushing the boundaries of what consumers will actually go for. So it's on Thanksgiving now. Next stop is Wednesday. Then Tuesday. Then eventually, October. To me, all of that makes way more sense than Thanksgiving, so I'm ready for it.

[Petethreeput]

[quote name='H.A. Kerr' timestamp='1384912100' post='8175254']
Let them eat cake.
[/quote]

Marie couldn't have said it any better

[deadsolid...shank]

The original post may be in the running for worst post of the year.

Blaming the employes, what an asanine statement. Of course it's the retailers fault. They continue to try to one-up each other. Pure greed by continuing to open earlier and earlier for Black Friday. And now opening Thanksgiving evening. My daughter goes into her big box retail job at 5:30 Thursday night to start her 12 hour shift. So she can't come home for the holiday. But guess what, it's the job she has right now and it's not her fault they open that night, it's the store making that decision.

Like an earlier poster said, if they all opened at 8:00'friday morning, the holiday would still be a holiday.

OP, I hope you don't ever run into a situation where your family is impacted by the retailers earlier openings, you might actually gain some understanding and compassion.

[bscinstnct]

What is this?

The scrooge thread?

It s*cks that people have to work during the holidays and can't be with their families.

[Agent Jim]

[quote name='baseballfrk8998' timestamp='1384905453' post='8174536']
[quote name='Agent Jim' timestamp='1384903635' post='8174382']
[quote name='MrTmag' timestamp='1384898505' post='8174032']
People forgot that if you work Christmas or thanksgiving day you get paid triple or double because its not a desired day to work
[/quote] I don't get extra pay. I get 8 hours vacation whether I work it or not. It all depends on the work schedule. I am in law enforcement, so I knew going in I'd be working holidays. This place I work at doesn't have the best contract. My last place paid time and a half and we accrued vacation time.
[/quote]

So basically you get double pay if you work. The 8 hours of pay that you work plus the 8 hours of vacation.
[/quote] Kind of. We work 10 hour shifts. But if the day doesn't fall on my scheduled work day I still get the 8hrs vacation time. I work the night shift 8p-6a, so most holiday stuff I can still partake in, so its not bad. I also don't mind working most holiday's, I just like having Thanksgiving off. I have the seniority to do it every year if I choose. This year I let some of the newer guys have it.

[Agent Jim]

 

 

 

Emergency medical and police are the exception IMO. They knew what they were getting into and choose their careers, and get compensated for their work, Police probably never enough.

Thanks man. I can only be thankful for the medical I get I guess, even though I've only used it once in 9 years. A lot of people ask me why I put my life on the line for what I get paid. That is hard to explain, a lot joke that they are too dumb to do anything else. Sometimes that is true, but often it is not. It's something that I enjoy to do. Like most every job there are problems and complaints, but overall it a good feeling. I don't mind being transparent, so here is what I earn. We get paid biweekly

[Olson12]

Emergency medical and police are the exception IMO. They knew what they were getting into and choose their careers, and get compensated for their work, Police probably never enough.

Thanks man. I can only be thankful for the medical I get I guess, even though I've only used it once in 9 years. A lot of people ask me why I put my life on the line for what I get paid. That is hard to explain, a lot joke that they are too dumb to do anything else. Sometimes that is true, but often it is not. It's something that I enjoy to do. Like most every job there are problems and complaints, but overall it a good feeling. I don't mind being transparent, so here is what I earn. We get paid biweekly

 

You need to go on vacation my friend! And take a few sick days to play some golf!

[SilverBullets]

Emergency medical and police are the exception IMO. They knew what they were getting into and choose their careers, and get compensated for their work, Police probably never enough.

Thanks man. I can only be thankful for the medical I get I guess, even though I've only used it once in 9 years. A lot of people ask me why I put my life on the line for what I get paid. That is hard to explain, a lot joke that they are too dumb to do anything else. Sometimes that is true, but often it is not. It's something that I enjoy to do. Like most every job there are problems and complaints, but overall it a good feeling. I don't mind being transparent, so here is what I earn. We get paid biweekly

 

You need to go on vacation my friend! And take a few sick days to play some golf!

 

Next summer he should take 2 full months off and just golf

[airjammer]

I work for a food manufacturer, our busy season kicks in at Thanksgiving thru February. So I work every holiday during that time period. I'm lucky all of my family lives around me I can see them whenever I want. It doesn't bother me to have to work...I knew I would have to work when I applied for the job. I can however sympathize with people who's family travels from far away to spend the holidays together. In the end if you don't like what you are doing...do something different.

[Yanki01]

Emergency medical and police are the exception IMO. They knew what they were getting into and choose their careers, and get compensated for their work, Police probably never enough.

Thanks man. I can only be thankful for the medical I get I guess, even though I've only used it once in 9 years. A lot of people ask me why I put my life on the line for what I get paid. That is hard to explain, a lot joke that they are too dumb to do anything else. Sometimes that is true, but often it is not. It's something that I enjoy to do. Like most every job there are problems and complaints, but overall it a good feeling. I don't mind being transparent, so here is what I earn. We get paid biweekly

 

You need to go on vacation my friend! And take a few sick days to play some golf!

 

Next summer he should take 2 full months off and just golf

 

I agree!

 

regarding the shopping on Black Friday...we'll it's not even Black Friday anymore. just thanksgiving day shopping I guess. I haven't done it since I was in middle school with my older sister buying a SONY Digital Mavica (google it) it was a 3.5" floppy disk storage camera for my mom. I think late 90's early 2000's? can't remember but that's how long it's been and it was stupid. the people who rush to put one of everything in their basket are crazy rude pulling merchandise out of others basket. I don't go but these stores will keep opening earlier and earlier if people keep going. I don't get the hype or needing to rush the doors? My TV works perfect, I like my XBOX that I hardly play and my Blu-ray player works as it should. You won't find me out there. Sucks for the workers that don't want to be there.

[FairwaysToHeaven]

[quote name='deadsolid...shank' timestamp='1384917957' post='8175846']
The original post may be in the running for worst post of the year.

Blaming the employes, what an asanine statement. Of course it's the retailers fault. They continue to try to one-up each other. Pure greed by continuing to open earlier and earlier for Black Friday. And now opening Thanksgiving evening. My daughter goes into her big box retail job at 5:30 Thursday night to start her 12 hour shift. So she can't come home for the holiday. But guess what, it's the job she has right now and it's not her fault they open that night, it's the store making that decision.

Like an earlier poster said, if they all opened at 8:00'friday morning, the holiday would still be a holiday.

OP, I hope you don't ever run into a situation where your family is impacted by the retailers earlier openings, you might actually gain some understanding and compassion.
[/quote]

i may not be in retail, but there are hundreds of jobs out there that have requirements. if you work a job you have to work by the employers hours. a morning radio dj can't complain about wanting morning hours pushed back so he can see his kids off to school, a weatherman can't ask to stay home when the weather is nasty, hwy workers can't take off when the roads are bad, are halloween stores closing on halloween so emplyees can go to their parties, i'm sure there are a few pilots or airline stewardess that would love the holidays off, accountants can't take vacation early april,. etc etc

labeling companies as greedy is beyond stupid. no matter what size the retail business, if they don't stay competitive they don't stay open. its foolish to think that a retailer will give up millions or small retailer will give up huge percentage of yearly profits that are made over a couple days simply because they 'need' to be compassionate towards employees. how compassionate will they be when they are forced to start laying off those employees.

its so easy to simply 'want' employees to be able to stay home on thanksgiving, but in reality not only does working weird hours come with the job, but its expected. yes it no doubts sucks if employees have to work, but its naive to think somehow all retail stores should come to some pact in the name of fairness and close for the holiday.

[SilverBullets]

[quote name='HoosierMizuno' timestamp='1384964310' post='8177862']
[quote name='deadsolid...shank' timestamp='1384917957' post='8175846']
The original post may be in the running for worst post of the year.

Blaming the employes, what an asanine statement. Of course it's the retailers fault. They continue to try to one-up each other. Pure greed by continuing to open earlier and earlier for Black Friday. And now opening Thanksgiving evening. My daughter goes into her big box retail job at 5:30 Thursday night to start her 12 hour shift. So she can't come home for the holiday. But guess what, it's the job she has right now and it's not her fault they open that night, it's the store making that decision.

Like an earlier poster said, if they all opened at 8:00'friday morning, the holiday would still be a holiday.

OP, I hope you don't ever run into a situation where your family is impacted by the retailers earlier openings, you might actually gain some understanding and compassion.
[/quote]

i may not be in retail, but there are hundreds of jobs out there that have requirements. if you work a job you have to work by the employers hours. a morning radio dj can't complain about wanting morning hours pushed back so he can see his kids off to school, a weatherman can't ask to stay home when the weather is nasty, hwy workers can't take off when the roads are bad, are halloween stores closing on halloween so emplyees can go to their parties, i'm sure there are a few pilots or airline stewardess that would love the holidays off, accountants can't take vacation early april,. etc etc

labeling companies as greedy is beyond stupid. no matter what size the retail business, if they don't stay competitive they don't stay open. its foolish to think that a retailer will give up millions or small retailer will give up huge percentage of yearly profits that are made over a couple days simply because they 'need' to be compassionate towards employees. how compassionate will they be when they are forced to start laying off those employees.

its so easy to simply 'want' employees to be able to stay home on thanksgiving, but in reality not only does working weird hours come with the job, but its expected. yes it no doubts sucks if employees have to work, but its naive to think somehow all retail stores should come to some pact in the name of fairness and close for the holiday.
[/quote]

Pretty much agree with everything you said here.

I used to work retail, working on Thanksgiving sucked. I knew it was part of the territory though. It helped motivated me to make sure I got my degree and worked in a field I wanted to work in. I also knew I could have been like my friends and been a busboy at a restaurant. Would have made the same amount of money without working holidays. I chose not to do that.

My wife works at a hospital and has to work 3 of the 6 major holidays. She will be working Thanksgiving and Christmas this year. It sucks but she knew full well that was part of the deal. She could work at a outpatient site or in a doctor's office and get holidays off, but she wouldn't make as much money or find the job as interesting.

As much as people don't like to believe it, but, we all have choices and we all make decisions when it comes to employment. These are all things that I take into account prior to accepting a job. If you didn't take them into account, well then, shame on you for poor planning.

[deadsolid...shank]

[quote name='SilverBullets' timestamp='1384965534' post='8177972']
[quote name='HoosierMizuno' timestamp='1384964310' post='8177862']
[quote name='deadsolid...shank' timestamp='1384917957' post='8175846']
The original post may be in the running for worst post of the year.

Blaming the employes, what an asanine statement. Of course it's the retailers fault. They continue to try to one-up each other. Pure greed by continuing to open earlier and earlier for Black Friday. And now opening Thanksgiving evening. My daughter goes into her big box retail job at 5:30 Thursday night to start her 12 hour shift. So she can't come home for the holiday. But guess what, it's the job she has right now and it's not her fault they open that night, it's the store making that decision.

Like an earlier poster said, if they all opened at 8:00'friday morning, the holiday would still be a holiday.

OP, I hope you don't ever run into a situation where your family is impacted by the retailers earlier openings, you might actually gain some understanding and compassion.
[/quote]

i may not be in retail, but there are hundreds of jobs out there that have requirements. if you work a job you have to work by the employers hours. a morning radio dj can't complain about wanting morning hours pushed back so he can see his kids off to school, a weatherman can't ask to stay home when the weather is nasty, hwy workers can't take off when the roads are bad, are halloween stores closing on halloween so emplyees can go to their parties, i'm sure there are a few pilots or airline stewardess that would love the holidays off, accountants can't take vacation early april,. etc etc

labeling companies as greedy is beyond stupid. no matter what size the retail business, if they don't stay competitive they don't stay open. its foolish to think that a retailer will give up millions or small retailer will give up huge percentage of yearly profits that are made over a couple days simply because they 'need' to be compassionate towards employees. how compassionate will they be when they are forced to start laying off those employees.

its so easy to simply 'want' employees to be able to stay home on thanksgiving, but in reality not only does working weird hours come with the job, but its expected. yes it no doubts sucks if employees have to work, but its naive to think somehow all retail stores should come to some pact in the name of fairness and close for the holiday.
[/quote]

Pretty much agree with everything you said here.

I used to work retail, working on Thanksgiving sucked. I knew it was part of the territory though. It helped motivated me to make sure I got my degree and worked in a field I wanted to work in. I also knew I could have been like my friends and been a busboy at a restaurant. Would have made the same amount of money without working holidays. I chose not to do that.

My wife works at a hospital and has to work 3 of the 6 major holidays. She will be working Thanksgiving and Christmas this year. It sucks but she knew full well that was part of the deal. She could work at a outpatient site or in a doctor's office and get holidays off, but she wouldn't make as much money or find the job as interesting.

As much as people don't like to believe it, but, we all have choices and we all make decisions when it comes to employment. These are all things that I take into account prior to accepting a job. If you didn't take them into account, well then, shame on you for poor planning.
[/quote]

You can't equivilate retail to law enforcement or medical care. Those two fields require a 24/7 staffing, retail does not. Everyone who entered those two fields knew going into it that holiday work is highly likely. Retail, it's changing every year, getting earlier and earlier. No one has to shop on thanksgiving day. And if none of the stores were open for that thanksgiving day shopping, no one would suffer from it.

You may think it is stupid, but is in fact the retailers trying to grab a larger share of the holiday spending (greed) by trying to be open at hours when their competitors won't be.

And that crap of "if you don't like it find another job", is that , crap. For many, that is the only job they may be able to have.

Oh well, anyone working or not, by choice or forced to, I hope everyone has a great start to the holiday season. And I readily admit, my opinion is largely formed because I don't get the holiday with my daughter.

[Petethreeput]

[quote name='HoosierMizuno' timestamp='1384964310' post='8177862']
[quote name='deadsolid...shank' timestamp='1384917957' post='8175846']
The original post may be in the running for worst post of the year.

Blaming the employes, what an asanine statement. Of course it's the retailers fault. They continue to try to one-up each other. Pure greed by continuing to open earlier and earlier for Black Friday. And now opening Thanksgiving evening. My daughter goes into her big box retail job at 5:30 Thursday night to start her 12 hour shift. So she can't come home for the holiday. But guess what, it's the job she has right now and it's not her fault they open that night, it's the store making that decision.

Like an earlier poster said, if they all opened at 8:00'friday morning, the holiday would still be a holiday.

OP, I hope you don't ever run into a situation where your family is impacted by the retailers earlier openings, you might actually gain some understanding and compassion.
[/quote]

i may not be in retail, but there are hundreds of jobs out there that have requirements. if you work a job you have to work by the employers hours. a morning radio dj can't complain about wanting morning hours pushed back so he can see his kids off to school, a weatherman can't ask to stay home when the weather is nasty, hwy workers can't take off when the roads are bad, are halloween stores closing on halloween so emplyees can go to their parties, i'm sure there are a few pilots or airline stewardess that would love the holidays off, accountants can't take vacation early april,. etc etc

labeling companies as greedy is beyond stupid. no matter what size the retail business, if they don't stay competitive they don't stay open. its foolish to think that a retailer will give up millions or small retailer will give up huge percentage of yearly profits that are made over a couple days simply because they 'need' to be compassionate towards employees. how compassionate will they be when they are forced to start laying off those employees.

its so easy to simply 'want' employees to be able to stay home on thanksgiving, but in reality not only does working weird hours come with the job, but its expected. yes it no doubts sucks if employees have to work, but its naive to think somehow all retail stores should come to some pact in the name of fairness and close for the holiday.
[/quote]

The flaw in your argument is two fold.

All the jobs excepting the Halloween job has entry requirements. Those folks "chose" to do it, they worked to get the training and are fairly compensated for their work. The Halloween store is the exception, but ultimately, the holiday is a party/ night deal, and most of those employees are gone by the time the festivities begin. And, it is not considered a family holiday as the two coming up are, it is considered a kid centric night of begging and excess.

Chances are most who end up in retail are forced to take a minimum wage job due to personal circumstances. Those that excel and become managers probably didn't wake up at age 12 and say, "Gee, I want to be a toy department manager at Target." They stayed because of personal circumstance, and their employees are there for the same reason.

I worked in the service industry for years. It was incredibly good to me, and I learned a lot about people. The #1 thing I have learned is this, "How a person treats the 'help' is the best display of who that person is." It isn't the 50s and 60s anymore when a person can quit the retail job to make farm machinery regardless of education. Now the decision is between retail and restaurant. Sorry, but this post makes me think some are out of touch.

[xThor]

Majority of these companies rely on the money during the holidays. It's the real world. Capitalism. Whatever you want to call it. Every company is looking to get an edge over its competition.

I respect any company that chooses to be closed for a holiday. But I can't resent any company that chooses otherwise (except walmart, but that's for other reasons).

There's plenty of holidays. But business is business. I understand the majority would like holidays off, but there's no regulation that they have to be closed. People may not like it that they are open, but that doesn't make it wrong.

[SilverBullets]

[quote name='Petethreeput' timestamp='1384969461' post='8178490']
[quote name='HoosierMizuno' timestamp='1384964310' post='8177862']
[quote name='deadsolid...shank' timestamp='1384917957' post='8175846']
The original post may be in the running for worst post of the year.

Blaming the employes, what an asanine statement. Of course it's the retailers fault. They continue to try to one-up each other. Pure greed by continuing to open earlier and earlier for Black Friday. And now opening Thanksgiving evening. My daughter goes into her big box retail job at 5:30 Thursday night to start her 12 hour shift. So she can't come home for the holiday. But guess what, it's the job she has right now and it's not her fault they open that night, it's the store making that decision.

Like an earlier poster said, if they all opened at 8:00'friday morning, the holiday would still be a holiday.

OP, I hope you don't ever run into a situation where your family is impacted by the retailers earlier openings, you might actually gain some understanding and compassion.
[/quote]

i may not be in retail, but there are hundreds of jobs out there that have requirements. if you work a job you have to work by the employers hours. a morning radio dj can't complain about wanting morning hours pushed back so he can see his kids off to school, a weatherman can't ask to stay home when the weather is nasty, hwy workers can't take off when the roads are bad, are halloween stores closing on halloween so emplyees can go to their parties, i'm sure there are a few pilots or airline stewardess that would love the holidays off, accountants can't take vacation early april,. etc etc

labeling companies as greedy is beyond stupid. no matter what size the retail business, if they don't stay competitive they don't stay open. its foolish to think that a retailer will give up millions or small retailer will give up huge percentage of yearly profits that are made over a couple days simply because they 'need' to be compassionate towards employees. how compassionate will they be when they are forced to start laying off those employees.

its so easy to simply 'want' employees to be able to stay home on thanksgiving, but in reality not only does working weird hours come with the job, but its expected. yes it no doubts sucks if employees have to work, but its naive to think somehow all retail stores should come to some pact in the name of fairness and close for the holiday.
[/quote]

The flaw in your argument is two fold.

All the jobs excepting the Halloween job has entry requirements. Those folks "chose" to do it, they worked to get the training and are fairly compensated for their work. The Halloween store is the exception, but ultimately, the holiday is a party/ night deal, and most of those employees are gone by the time the festivities begin. And, it is not considered a family holiday as the two coming up are, it is considered a kid centric night of begging and excess.

Chances are most who end up in retail are forced to take a minimum wage job due to personal circumstances. Those that excel and become managers probably didn't wake up at age 12 and say, "Gee, I want to be a toy department manager at Target." They stayed because of personal circumstance, and their employees are there for the same reason.

I worked in the service industry for years. It was incredibly good to me, and I learned a lot about people. The #1 thing I have learned is this, "How a person treats the 'help' is the best display of who that person is." It isn't the 50s and 60s anymore when a person can quit the retail job to make farm machinery regardless of education. Now the decision is between retail and restaurant. Sorry, but this post makes me think some are out of touch.
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You're right about the manager part, but they work the holidays as well. My cousin, who was my roommate in college, is a store manager at Target. She makes something like $90k a year (by the way target is a great place to work, especially as a store manager) and is 28 years old. Certainly a solid living. She works thanksgiving afternoon/evening and the day after Christmas through news years is always a madhouse for her. She knew when she took the job that that was the deal.

Growing up I worked as a cashier at Big Lots. I prepped the store on thanksgiving. I worked Black Friday. I knew when I took the job that was the deal (I made $7.50 a hour also). I didn't b****. I knew I could have made the choice to take another unskilled labor position at a place which wasn't open on holidays (ie a bus boy, a store that isn't open on thanksgiving, etc.). I worked there because I liked the job as a student.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

I worked retail for Verizon for about 6years in my late teens early 20's here is what sucked about it.

1 holiday vacation blackouts we could not take approved time off from Nov 1st through Jan 15th. Can't tell you how many thanksgiving nights I had to spend in airports so I could back to work for black Friday. Which leads to number 2

2: We were overstaffed and dead (this does not apply to major retailers) Corporate freaked out about staffing for holidays yet we all stood around bored wishing we could be with family/friends. This was especially true Christmas eve and black friday.

3: there is no real valid reason for non essential businesses or services to be open on holidays except to make a balance sheet look better for folks who are home with their families.

It is not just retail the service industry as a whole follows the same pattern. I am in insurance now and corporate requires us (agency office) to be open black Friday. There is nothing so important that it could not wait until Monday. This is why policies contain newly purchased vehicle clauses which give people 30 days to notify us.

[deadsolid...shank]

[quote name='One_Putt_Blunder' timestamp='1385008110' post='8181986']
I worked retail for Verizon for about 6years in my late teens early 20's here is what sucked about it.

1 holiday vacation blackouts we could not take approved time off from Nov 1st through Jan 15th. Can't tell you how many thanksgiving nights I had to spend in airports so I could back to work for black Friday. Which leads to number 2

2: We were overstaffed and dead (this does not apply to major retailers) Corporate freaked out about staffing for holidays yet we all stood around bored wishing we could be with family/friends. This was especially true Christmas eve and black friday.

3: there is no real valid reason for non essential businesses or services to be open on holidays except to make a balance sheet look better for folks who are home with their families.

It is not just retail the service industry as a whole follows the same pattern. I am in insurance now and corporate requires us (agency office) to be open black Friday. There is nothing so important that it could not wait until Monday. This is why policies contain newly purchased vehicle clauses which give people 30 days to notify us.
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That sums it up pretty well. Shopping is not an essential service. That TV at Best Buy isn't going to go bad if you buy it Friday morning as opposed to Thursday night.